I'd say this was a perfect example of how not to play the lanes down there. After watching Vermilyea's group do as well as you can reasonably expect on those conditions, these guys did just about the opposite. Derek figured it out and got lined up for singles and bowled well, Dan threw the ball well for the most part, but Tim was frustrating to watch. It looks like they got too deep too quickly, were trying to keep the ball too close to the pocket, and were being much too firm. Once Derek softened up and looped it more, he did much better. I didn't initially think creating angle was going to be your friend down there, but it appears to be the opposite. Being soft and smooth and just floating it out there looks to be the best way to do it, being firm just caused way too much over/under, and getting too deep too quick down there looks like it causes carrydown to the right, but still stays dry inside, which makes the over/under even worse. For comparison:

Vermilyea's group:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EE_eRgDIjI

Eoff's group:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fm7S4FLmAg

No, but I agree it's easy to draw conclusions when you haven't been there.  I'm just trying to draw as much information from what I'm seeing as possible.  Everyone has agreed though that they had a different look on the tournament lanes than they even had on the showcase lanes (which is usually the case), so I'm not putting much stock into anything but what I'm seeing is working and not working for others. 

Early on, it was stay right and let the shot come to you, but after watching guys struggle staying right and then doing well when they moved deep and never getting left of 4th arrow, it changed a bit.  Then Vermilyea's group looked to me like they handled it the best.  Some friends of mine bowled team right next to them and said their team set was impressive too.  Eoff's group looked like they overcorrected and got too deep too quick. 

What were your conclusions?

Have you bowled there yet? Its easy to draw conclusions at home. I bowled and I agree with some of what you said.

Ok, that makes sense.  We don't go until later in June, so I've got plenty of time, but I'm in a similar boat with you as far as speed and rev rate.  Preferred rev rate anyway.  I don't like playing right, but I can play straight up 3 comfortably, but move me into playing straight up 8 or playing a little swing and I get really uncomfortable.  I will have to work on that.  3029 is a super solid score this year, nice job.  I'm good with speed control, but I'm the best at staying soft and rolling the ball, which usually puts me a bit deeper than everyone else.  I just don't want to get there too soon and make the over/under worse.  Must practice . .

Quote from: ITZPS on April 16, 2015, 10:56:51 AM

No, but I agree it's easy to draw conclusions when you haven't been there.  I'm just trying to draw as much information from what I'm seeing as possible.  Everyone has agreed though that they had a different look on the tournament lanes than they even had on the showcase lanes (which is usually the case), so I'm not putting much stock into anything but what I'm seeing is working and not working for others. 

Early on, it was stay right and let the shot come to you, but after watching guys struggle staying right and then doing well when they moved deep and never getting left of 4th arrow, it changed a bit.  Then Vermilyea's group looked to me like they handled it the best.  Some friends of mine bowled team right next to them and said their team set was impressive too.  Eoff's group looked like they overcorrected and got too deep too quick. 

What were your conclusions?

Quote from: northface28 on April 16, 2015, 10:49:08 AM

Have you bowled there yet? Its easy to draw conclusions at home. I bowled and I agree with some of what you said.

The BJ/Showcase are much tighter than the convention center I had sets ranging from 590-629 at the BJ. The convention lanes let you play where you want. Im 17.2 MPH/420 rev rate  with too much left to right in my game. I struggled because I was a "team player" playing right of 5, even though it felt like I was bowling in a phone booth. We finished with 3029 and left in 10th place in team. We broke them down around 2-3-4 in practice and moved in around 7 to start, we ended up at about 4th arrow give or take depending on the player.

Our ball choices ranged from GB2, Asylum, IQ Nano, Ultimate Inferno, Rumble ,505T with surface and/or pin down. You're going to have to be a shot maker and be in command of your speed. There isn't much shape to the pattern so speed control is paramount.

Not sure who was playing the gutter for actual score,  but you'll die a fast death unless you're a premium shot maker. I still believe breaking them down outside 5 is the way to go. I'd strongly advise staying right of 10 for at least a game in team, fight the urge to move in, you'll make your life difficult moving in too soon.

Its a wierd mix of when they do vids of what event.

I am going to disagree with this. I just bowled on the 12th and 13th. I tried to play in and struggled, especially in D/S. The 10th frame of game 1 of Singles I moved to play straight up 1-2 on the right. I shot 247, 225 the next two games. And believe me, I am no super skilled shot maker. It worked really well for me, and the couple I did tug, went brooklyn. Don't discount this shot for those who haven't gone. I found it to be very very scoreable.

Quote from: northface28 on April 17, 2015, 08:53:35 PM

Not sure who was playing the gutter for actual score,  but you'll die a fast death unless you're a premium shot maker. I still believe breaking them down outside 5 is the way to go. I'd strongly advise staying right of 10 for at least a game in team, fight the urge to move in, you'll make your life difficult moving in too soon.

Id have to see you bowl, but I'm not buying this, a lot of times guys think they are going up 1-2, they really aren't. They're playing 5 or 4 out 1-2. Pete Thomas, is one of the best straight players in the country, and even he wasn't going up 1-2.

Team NABR actually just showed everyone how to play the Team pattern yesterday, as they just knocked JTUSA Support #1 out of top spot.

Most of them stayed outside of 10 at the arrows, with their breakpoint just right of the far right range finder (should be 11-12) until they opened up the pattern, then started to move in.

Again, completely different than how Eoff's team played, and while Eoff's stream was on D/S, Eoff's communication really wasn't there, either. #BartaNation definitely did their homework, especially with Gotschall needing to double to take the lead. Theirs is definitely one to watch.

BL.

Team NABR actually just showed everyone how to play the Team pattern yesterday, as they just knocked JTUSA Support #1 out of top spot.

Most of them stayed outside of 10 at the arrows, with their breakpoint just right of the far right range finder (should be 11-12) until they opened up the pattern, then started to move in.

Again, completely different than how Eoff's team played, and while Eoff's stream was on D/S, Eoff's communication really wasn't there, either. #BartaNation definitely did their homework, especially with Gotschall needing to double to take the lead. Theirs is definitely one to watch.

BL.

Eoff was literally bowling with subs off the sub board if I'm not mistaken, two guys from his team had emergencies come up and couldn't make it. That explains the disconnect.