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Author Topic: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?  (Read 1368 times)

Snakster

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What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« on: August 04, 2013, 01:47:57 PM »
So when looking at balls on line (specs), one would think that certain styles would look for, or eliminate, certain possibilities based on mechanics.  So if you are a speed dominant player, almost by default since not a high rev dude. What would look for to at least whittle down the possibilities?

Asymmetric or symmetric?
Low RG or high RG
High differential or low?

Cover would depend on conditions you bowl on, yes?

Then once you've narrowed it down, does pin and top weight measurements matter too?

It's easy to look at balls and see stuff you like, but it would be nice to able to see a spec sheet and say, no that doesn't match up with my style. Thanks for any replies and opinions. Just trying to learn.
Currently own:
Radical Times Up (pearl)
Radical Torrid Affair
Radical Grease Monkey
Radical Yeti Unleashed
Radical Reax (undrilled)

 

tommyboy74

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2013, 02:24:34 PM »
This definitely falls into my category since I am speed dominant tweener with a medium rev rate.  (19-22mph ball speed, 420 rev rate)

I generally tend to go with solid or hybrid covers compared to pure pearls with what I usually see.  The big reason I do this is that the pure pearls with higher speeds generally won't have enough time to pick up off the breakpoint on many of the medium and lighter conditions.   An exception in my case is the Critical Theory, which is one of the very few pearl balls I can use on medium to heavy patterns and match up extremely well to it. 

On heavy patterns, I go with short pins and asymmetric cores.  On these balls such as my Defiant and Critical Theory, I always go with a 2-3 inch pin.  I also look for low RG/high diff numbers because I want it to be more core than cover and have a high flare potential.  On heavy oil, I typically drill pin below for because I want the ball to read as early as possible and to be smooth going down the lane. 

On medium and lighter patterns, I will go with longer pins (4-5 inches), and drill pin above.   I generally go with many of the standard balls with symmetrical cores that are intended for their conditions.  In these cases, I will go with a higher RG/lower diff ball which tends to make it more cover heavy and better suited for these patterns.  The difference here is that I will usually go with a slightly stronger layout compared to what most people will use in order to accomodate higher speeds.  In this case will use pin above layouts to give a good combo of length and backend.  I avoid high skid/flip layouts and high skid/flip balls since those would blow through the breakpoint.

With that being said, surface can be your friend with higher speeds.  I have taken balls such as the Nano and Defiant down to 2000 in the past when needed for tournament shots.  I have also taken balls like my Rogue Cell hybrid down to 500 on reverse blocks when I needed to have it react sooner.  Don't be afraid to take a pad and add surface when you need it.

For top weight, usually 2-3 oz, and will drill an x-hole whenever needed to add/reduce flare.

This should give you a good starting point.  If you have any questions about specific balls that you may be looking at, let me know.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2013, 02:30:15 PM by tommyboy74 »
Current Ball Arsenal
Heavy:
Roto Grip Critical Theory
Roto Grip Defiant
Roto Grip Rogue Cell

Med-Heavy:
MOTIV Covert Revolt

Medium:
MOTIV Sigma Sting
Track 505T
Roto Grip Nomad Dagger

Medium-Light
Storm Frantic

The Bowling Pariah

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2013, 03:17:47 PM »
Low RG asymetric with a higher diff rating.  Drill it to read the pattern earlier. Surface will depend on what you need, but solids would probably work better if you are REALLY speed dominant.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2013, 03:21:14 PM by The Bowling Pariah »
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northface28

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2013, 04:30:53 PM »
One word, friction.
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Snakster

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2013, 05:35:50 PM »
TB74,
Thank you for that detailed response.  A lot to digest, and I may send up some names to get an idea. I may be doing my first full season league this fall, and the place is generally light, even when fresh. At least to my experience so far and from people I spoke to who have bowled there extensively. I was thinking a pearl but with low RG and high diff. But now I may concentrate more on hybrids, which kind of has me back to the drawing board. That's why I'm not listing some balls with this reply.

My thing is I'm not a slave to speed.  That is, more often than not I find myself backing off on speed to play the conditions with what I have. I can find grooves where I'm dialed in, but when I miss or lose it, it's hard to find again. So it would be great to find a ball where I would not have to do as much conscious physical adjustments.

I'm also going to the storm/roto demo day that lil league coach has been posting here. Any thoughts on which balls I should maybe focus on at that demo? I'm sure the hour goes fast, so I'm trying to focus.

Currently own:
Radical Times Up (pearl)
Radical Torrid Affair
Radical Grease Monkey
Radical Yeti Unleashed
Radical Reax (undrilled)

900DJ

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2013, 05:54:26 PM »
I am also speed dominate.  My med, med/heavy benchmark ball is a pin down 1500 grit Train.  Basically balls rated for medium are good for me on dry, rated heavy is good for med/heavy and so on.  Surface will always be your friend.

Gizmo823

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2013, 05:57:22 PM »
This definitely falls into my category since I am speed dominant tweener with a medium rev rate.  (19-22mph ball speed, 420 rev rate)

I generally tend to go with solid or hybrid covers compared to pure pearls with what I usually see.  The big reason I do this is that the pure pearls with higher speeds generally won't have enough time to pick up off the breakpoint on many of the medium and lighter conditions.   An exception in my case is the Critical Theory, which is one of the very few pearl balls I can use on medium to heavy patterns and match up extremely well to it. 

On heavy patterns, I go with short pins and asymmetric cores.  On these balls such as my Defiant and Critical Theory, I always go with a 2-3 inch pin.  I also look for low RG/high diff numbers because I want it to be more core than cover and have a high flare potential.  On heavy oil, I typically drill pin below for because I want the ball to read as early as possible and to be smooth going down the lane. 

On medium and lighter patterns, I will go with longer pins (4-5 inches), and drill pin above.   I generally go with many of the standard balls with symmetrical cores that are intended for their conditions.  In these cases, I will go with a higher RG/lower diff ball which tends to make it more cover heavy and better suited for these patterns.  The difference here is that I will usually go with a slightly stronger layout compared to what most people will use in order to accomodate higher speeds.  In this case will use pin above layouts to give a good combo of length and backend.  I avoid high skid/flip layouts and high skid/flip balls since those would blow through the breakpoint.

With that being said, surface can be your friend with higher speeds.  I have taken balls such as the Nano and Defiant down to 2000 in the past when needed for tournament shots.  I have also taken balls like my Rogue Cell hybrid down to 500 on reverse blocks when I needed to have it react sooner.  Don't be afraid to take a pad and add surface when you need it.

For top weight, usually 2-3 oz, and will drill an x-hole whenever needed to add/reduce flare.

This should give you a good starting point.  If you have any questions about specific balls that you may be looking at, let me know.

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itsallaboutme

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2013, 06:07:25 PM »
Just for clarification, the only place a rev rate of 420 is considered medium is on tour.

tommyboy74

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2013, 06:44:14 PM »
TB74,
Thank you for that detailed response.  A lot to digest, and I may send up some names to get an idea. I may be doing my first full season league this fall, and the place is generally light, even when fresh. At least to my experience so far and from people I spoke to who have bowled there extensively. I was thinking a pearl but with low RG and high diff. But now I may concentrate more on hybrids, which kind of has me back to the drawing board. That's why I'm not listing some balls with this reply.

My thing is I'm not a slave to speed.  That is, more often than not I find myself backing off on speed to play the conditions with what I have. I can find grooves where I'm dialed in, but when I miss or lose it, it's hard to find again. So it would be great to find a ball where I would not have to do as much conscious physical adjustments.

I'm also going to the storm/roto demo day that lil league coach has been posting here. Any thoughts on which balls I should maybe focus on at that demo? I'm sure the hour goes fast, so I'm trying to focus.


Here is what I'd look at for the demo day.  Most of these are all solids or hybrids, with the exception of 1-2 pearl balls that could potentially work:

Heavy: Sync, Defiant, Lucid (sanded pearl)
Medium-Heavy: Marvel-S, Defiant Soul
Medium: Disturbed, and the Hy-Road (hybrid)
Medium-Light: Frantic, Rumble

If time allows, it wouldn't hurt throwing the Marvel Pearl as that ball can and has worked with speed dominant bowlers.
Current Ball Arsenal
Heavy:
Roto Grip Critical Theory
Roto Grip Defiant
Roto Grip Rogue Cell

Med-Heavy:
MOTIV Covert Revolt

Medium:
MOTIV Sigma Sting
Track 505T
Roto Grip Nomad Dagger

Medium-Light
Storm Frantic

vkowalski1970

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2013, 07:01:26 PM »
Pearls will be ok without polish.....need the ball to read earlier. Low drill angles. Low Rg/high diff. 
Hyper Cell.................40x5x35
Disturbed..................50x4x65
Zero Gravity..............45x4x40
Asylum.....................60x4x40
Nomad.....................50x5x70
Lights Out.................40x4x60
Lane 1 Cherry SOS.....50x4x25

mainzer

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2013, 09:33:24 PM »
falling into this category. I can say I don't look for anything different in equipment. It is the prep of the equipment that matters to me.

I usually low sums of angles even for stuff I intend to use on drier lanes. Also i like longer pin to pap distances on drier lanes. On oil low sums of angles that promote stronger reactions off friction.
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Snakster

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #11 on: August 05, 2013, 08:22:52 AM »
Great stuff. I signed up for the first hour of the demo, and the sync was definitely on my list to try. Defiant Soul has now been raised to a higher level in my consciousness as well. Conversely, the IQs have now been downgraded and I might throw them only at the end of my hour if there is time.

Looking at the vast expanse that is the Internet, I've added some others to a list of potentials as well. A couple are technically discontinued, but are still somewhat widely available (and at discounts). Any thoughts would be appreciated.  They seem to fit the entry criteria.

Storm Modern Marvel. I had actually looked at this before because of its availability at a nice discount. Just wasn't sure if it 'matched up'.

Ebonite Pursuit. I've actually always liked the look of this ball and I have a bit of an affinity for ebonite. Not exactly sexy to the masses it appears, but that doesn't really concern me.

Motiv Sigma Hybrid. Intrigued by Motiv in general. Again always kind of liked the look; unsure of the match.

AMF Mamba Hybrid. Seems to have had a short shelf life but still can be found at discount. General checklist seems right. AMF a good ball?

DV8 Endless or Brutal Nightmare. My son's coach is a DV8 person so I'd always consider one. Do these foot the bill?

Ebonite Warning Sign. Seems to have been marketed as a Heavy Oil complement to the Signals. Signals is first ball I bought (used) and I have enjoyed a lot of good games and personal bests with it. Cover is a bit played out now and it is one where I really have to consciously back off on speed to play well with. Upside here is I'm familiar with core and can be gotten at great price.

Two balls I really like the look of but perhaps are not quite as in the wheelhouse:
Lane#1 Grind-R
New Storm Reign On
(See the pattern there?)
Thoughts on those two?
Currently own:
Radical Times Up (pearl)
Radical Torrid Affair
Radical Grease Monkey
Radical Yeti Unleashed
Radical Reax (undrilled)

JustRico

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #12 on: August 05, 2013, 09:33:45 AM »
SURFACE is first and foremost....the bowling ball HAS to slow down properly before any of the other factors are or become relevant...
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spmcgivern

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Re: What does a speed dominant bowler look for?
« Reply #13 on: August 05, 2013, 09:45:24 AM »
JustRico is always correct.

For the Motiv side, the Sigma Hybrid is a good choice for what you are looking for.  Great low RG core with a hybrid cover that acts more like a solid.  This may not fill the need for heavy oil, but with high speed it would be a great medium oil ball.

Also, the Motiv Venom Strike is another great ball with a low RG core with a little less differential than the Sigma Hybrid.  Great solid cover that is adjustable and would be great step down from the Sigma Hybrid.

Good luck with your search!