BallReviews
General Category => Beginners Board => Topic started by: bowlersam on September 05, 2016, 04:39:26 PM
-
Hi. In today's era of modren bowlinget, a lot goes besides the bowlers skills. Thinkers of the industry has tried their best to find a solution whereby bowlers can overcome the dreaded invisible enemy spread between them and perfect game
As soon as the ball is released, it's either pulled or pushed, if it wants to turn it is pushed down the lane, if it want to go further down it is kicked left or right. This enemy is furious, relentless and unforgiving. It's called the oil and the oil pattern.
To overcome this, ball manufacturers are creating new core designs new coverstocks and what not while great minds are trying to find a drilling suitable for Bowler so his ball matches the lane pattern in order for him to score the best he or she can
Being a beginner and a student, I find all this very fascinating. Different drilling methods different release methods different layout techniques
After reading for almost a year or more, I concluded that there is no quick fix. No single best choice.
The bowlers differ in styles speeds rev rates axis tilt axis rotation and so many different ways so one layout though perfect for one may not work at all for other. Since balls have so much varied specifications, by the same token one layout may work wonders for one particular lane pattern for one particular Bowler on a particular day while the exact same layout on a different ball or for a different baller or on a different lane pattern may just embarrass the thrower. A 200 Average player may end up shooting 150.
Yeah. So every one knows that. Dah!!! What's the big deal.
The big deal is the opposite of this. I've been following different channels for ball review videos on YouTube.
Often when I see 3 bowlers, a Stroker, A Tweener, and a Cranker, throwing the same ball with same DA layout. One is playing 10th another 15th and last 20th boards. Their break points are different down lanes. Yet all are striking. And that gets me confused.
Is this right? Am I wrong about putting a different layout on different balls?
Should I just put one layout on all balls?
Please enlighten?
-
I know guys that use 2 layouts for all balls. one that is pin up and one that is pin down. their experiences tell them that the 2 selected layouts tend to work best for them.
I have 3 layouts that I tend to comeback to and utilize a lot; but I am not beholden to them. I work with my PSO to drill my equipment for the reaction I am desiring regardless of layout.
keep in mind, the vast majority of the videos you see on youtube are showing you guys bowling on a THS. Most of those videos are guys trying to show off when the lanes are so easy that the lane/THS is doing most of the work and its up to the bowler to not screw it up.
Many (most, all??) THS patterns really eliminate the differences between drilling and style. sure, the cranker is playing inside of the stroker, but they are likely using the same break point. any reasonably experienced bowler of any style can make just about any ball work on a THS.
So, bowlers that never leave the comfort zone of a THS may never see the benefits of different drill patterns.
-
Anthony Simonsen uses the same layout on all his balls
-
I know guys that use 2 layouts for all balls. one that is pin up and one that is pin down. their experiences tell them that the 2 selected layouts tend to work best for them.
BTW what is Pin up and Pin Down? I've been meaning to ask that for the longest. Some how never got to.
I understand that Pin Up meaning Pin above either finger or above bridge, Pin Down in same way but below the fingers.
Question number 2 is that in this case scenario when you have Pin above the bridge, CG kicked a little to the right, does PAP even matter or is ever taken into consideration?
-
BTW what is Pin up and Pin Down?
Pinup/pindown refers to a old method of ball layout, discussion of which can get heated at times.
Note: Discussions about using the same or similar layouts on different balls is a hot button topic on some websites. Be careful.
Most today say Pinup/pindown is basically meaningless that all it's doing is altering the Pin to Val angle. But the terminology is still widely used by many.
Note: Radical's suggested layouts for symmetrical balls, uses a Pinup/pindown system. They just changed the names to Pin above/Pin under.
Example: Jackpot drill sheet
http://radicalbowling.com/uploads/downloads/Radical_Drilling_Instructions_-_Jackpot.pdf (http://radicalbowling.com/uploads/downloads/Radical_Drilling_Instructions_-_Jackpot.pdf)
This will give you a basic idea of how it was supposed to work. This is from the old (2009) Lanemasters drill sheet. PAP is used for the horizontal pin placement.
(https://s5.postimg.org/vhltmon0n/LM_Ball_Drilling_Instructio.jpg)
-
Thanks dear. That clears it up. Still debatable but now I understand better
-
I use two layouts (and one of them about 75% of the time). It's really not that uncommon. Once you find something that works well for your particular game you stick with it and tweak surfaces as needed. It removes much of the guesswork.
-
Unless I'm bowling nationals or drilling for sport oil. I'm always pin up.... basically replicating the horizontal pin placement that aloarjr shared...
Either pin above the bridge, above the ring, or to the right of my ring...all due to my speed, and rev rate. I have drilled atleast 100 balls and it just works on more houses on more patterns...so I repeat it.
-
I use 2 layouts, but the last 4 balls i had the PSO drill all have the same layout. 4x4x2. The next one that would replace my storm tropical heat will have the same layout. For THS, this layout is suffice - with surface adjustments.
-
I usually use either pin above or below bridge, with 2 speciality drills in the bag. I try to keep a 2 inch pin to pap and a Rico in the bag for tournaments.
-
Is your Rico a strike king? I know that is a common rico ball. If so I have one for sale
NIB 3 pin
-
BTW what is Pin up and Pin Down?
Pinup/pindown refers to a old method of ball layout, discussion of which can get heated at times.
Note: Discussions about using the same or similar layouts on different balls is a hot button topic on some websites. Be careful.
Most today say Pinup/pindown is basically meaningless that all it's doing is altering the Pin to Val angle. But the terminology is still widely used by many.
Note: Radical's suggested layouts for symmetrical balls, uses a Pinup/pindown system. They just changed the names to Pin above/Pin under.
Example: Jackpot drill sheet
http://radicalbowling.com/uploads/downloads/Radical_Drilling_Instructions_-_Jackpot.pdf (http://radicalbowling.com/uploads/downloads/Radical_Drilling_Instructions_-_Jackpot.pdf)
This will give you a basic idea of how it was supposed to work. This is from the old (2009) Lanemasters drill sheet. PAP is used for the horizontal pin placement.
(https://s5.postimg.org/vhltmon0n/LM_Ball_Drilling_Instructio.jpg)
+1
-
Everything I buy/own/drill/throw is pin up
-
Everything I buy/own/drill/throw is pin up
+1 same here.
-
Pin up is very general, unless you're including pin to pap distance. For example, my pin to pap is usually 5 inches, no matter if it's below or above the fingers.
-
I throw 2 layouts on everything 5" Pin up or 5" pin down.
If I need more drive on the back I'll add a p3 hole on the pin down. If I need more angle off the spot for deep inside lines I'll add a p3 hole to the pin up. I find that I can throw a ball a lot longer nowadays making small transitions rather than having 10 board adjustment ranges and having to switch through 3-4 balls.
-
my thing for me is, if i can repeat my release, speed, and be very accurate, then maybe I'll try different layouts. But, just doing 4x4x2 with or without P holes is enough for me and where I bowl.
-
I myself keep most of my equipment drilled the same and adjust coverstock surface to read earlier or later. i feel that coverstock prep. will make the most change on reactions vs drillings however some have different opinions on this as well. but whatever works for 1 usually doesnt work for another.
-
Often when I see 3 bowlers, a Stroker, A Tweener, and a Cranker, throwing the same ball with same DA layout.
Technically speaking, it is a different DA layout for each (unless they happen to all have the same PAP).
-
Technically speaking, it is a different DA layout for each (unless they happen to all have the same PAP).
You are absolutely right Sir. PAP plays a huge role. DA may be the same but it makes Pin placement different for different Bowles. But what about when one particular bowler puts the same layout on all his balls.
As I understand, and I may be wrong, the Drilling angle determines the skid phase of the ball, but so does the coverstock.
A polished ball vs a mate finish.
Secondly. The core dynamics also play a role in how far the ball goes down before it pick up.
High vs Low RG.
And last but not least, the hand position.
Up the back vs on the side.
So how come one particular Bowler with his unique PAP throws all kinds of surfaces and RGs, drill all balls with the same DA or PSA layout and keeps striking?
I do know that THS is very forgiving some times but PROs also have favorite layours which they use on all balls. Sport patterns and PBA patterns aren't as forgiving as the THS.
I'm not arguing here just to argue. I have very little knowledge and I'm trying to learn. These are the few questions which happened to pop up in my mind after you post, so I asked.
Some here advocate universal layout on all balls as well.
Please educate.
-
Likely bigger differences between surface finish, and core dynamics, than layouts. It might be a mental thing for some folks too... I always bowl well with this layout (or even worsr, I always bowl well with this cg position), therefore they do.
For a symmetric ball, there are only so many layouts anyways... shy away from the extremes (greater than 5.5" pin or less than 2.5" pin) and for most Bowlers you are having a pin placement around the ring finger.
Add in asymmetrical cores and most people want it in the "strong" position...somewhere between the thumb and VAL. Since THS covers up subtle changes in reaction anyway (that could be gained by these small tweaks), it comes down to picking your favorite layout and going.
Exception is if you are looking for something specific...