Post by: Dennis Rhodes on January 31, 2009, 03:12:35 PM
This is just an observation of my equipment, and that is it.
My current arsenal is:
Brunswick Maxxx Zone #2 (Rev-Levarage, 1500 grit)
Brunswick Maxxx Zone #1 (10:30 drill-4 1/2 pin to pap, pin above ring finger, 1000 grit with storm extra shine)
Brunswick Vapor Zone (3 inch pin to pap, 3 1/2 psa to pap, 1000 grit with storm extra shine)
Brunswick Wild Ride (4 1/2 Pin to pap, drilled 60 degree psa, 1000 grit with storm extra shine)
Brunswick Copperhead (3 inch to pap, 5 inch to cg from pap)
Brunswick Swarm (rico'd, 4000 grit abralon)
Brunswick Rhino PTE (10:30 drill see Maxxx Zone for Pin to pap distance, pin above ring finger)
At first, I have to say that I was disappointed in the Maxxx Zone and Wild Ride. Out of box, the Maxxx Zone #1 was so smooth, that it wasn't giving me the look that I had hoped for. After tinkering with the surface (as noted above), the ball is much more lively, and recovery has increased greatly. Same with Maxxx Zone #2, which is just one awesome piece for heavy conditions. The Wild Ride had disappointed slightly in the oob surface. It was great as long as I kept it right of 15, but it became a little touchy when I moved deeper. Carry-down seemed to affect it greatly, and it seemed to cover about the same area on the same condition as my Vapor Zone. After messing with the surface, I have seen this ball start to do as it showed in the video on Brunswick's website. It is good from outside, medium, and inside of 20 now. This was definitely interesting considering that I changed the surface to allow me to stay right of my Vapor. The copperhead, I am still searching for the right surface. The ball is incredibly smooth, which takes away from recovery, but I am still hopeful that surface altercations (I have tried oob, 2000 with storm extra shine without much success) will prove fruitful. The Swarm is great, and much more predictable with the current surface alterations. Sorry for the long post. I have read some posts where people have been slightly disappointed in the new offerings, and just wanted to say; feel free to change the surfaces. This has made, what appeared to be some average equipment, into some awesome pieces.
Thanks for your time,
Dennis
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You''d be good, if it wasn''t for your brain!-My Older Brother
Post by: bluerrpilot on February 01, 2009, 07:31:24 AM
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"USBC is concerned that technology has overtaken player skill in determining success in the sport of bowling"
Post by: Easy10pins on February 01, 2009, 08:03:28 AM
I know I don't roll the ball like Billy O. So why would I expect, using the Wild Ride as an example, for a ball with the same specs/drilling to give me the same reaction?
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The bowler formerly known as BrunsRod.
Solid 7 Pin?? 299 Game??!! WTF
Post by: bluerrpilot on February 01, 2009, 09:05:19 AM
quote:
Isn't that a given though?
I know I don't roll the ball like Billy O. So why would I expect,
It should be. There are always exceptions to the rule, you are one of them.
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"USBC is concerned that technology has overtaken player skill in determining success in the sport of bowling"
Post by: Verbs on February 01, 2009, 10:08:26 AM
For instance, the Wild Ride is supposed to be a skid/snap ball, but invariably someone who buys the ball, whose ball speed is just short of Mach 1. And whose rev rate is well short of Ernie Schlegel's (no disrespect to Ernie intended), will either go back to his pro shop saying this ball is a piece of crap, or will write a review on this site stating how disatisfied because the ball didn't do what it was advertised or both.
As educated players, pro shop operators, ball reps, etc., we NEED to educate our ball buying public as to what ball should match a players game the best.
Now here's the really downside. The pro shop operator, in some instances, is now a crook in this customers eyes, because he/she sold them this P.O.C. (PG version
) and will not give the customer a refund.While I am not a pro shop opeator or ball rep anymore, I try and educate consumers that the surface that the ball comes out of the box is not the "Holy Grail" surface. You can adjust the surface without damaging the ball. Just remember, you can always resurface the ball back to near OOB condition.
Dennis, I applaud you for not giving upon these pieces and working with the surfaces until you found the right combination.
Verbs
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Larry Verble
Post by: johns811 on February 01, 2009, 10:13:23 AM
Let alone a plug and redrill without adjusting the cover, that is probably even dumber.
Post by: mainzer on February 01, 2009, 10:21:19 AM
idiots hurt the game just IMO
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''If their is a life after death,
then their is no death,
and if their is no death,
we do not live''
Progressive Metal Band
EVERGREY
MainzerPower
Post by: nd300 on February 01, 2009, 10:38:08 AM
Your statement that idiots hurt the game hits the nail right on the head. There are so many once a week bowlers who do watch the PBA,see the pros throw a certain ball and go buy it expecting it to act the same way on their league oil pattern that they saw on the previous Sunday telecast. When it doesn't,they do as was described and sell it.
It seems that bowling balls have also become another unfortunate victim to our present day "throw away" society if it doesn't work perfectly the first time and every time after that.
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Chris
JTTDB---Just Throw The Damn Ball
Don't "think"---that ball isn't in your bag yet..........
Post by: OddBalls on February 02, 2009, 11:26:55 AM
Anyone else notice this??
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Inverted 1 and Dead Flush are my Evil Twins...
Post by: mainzer on February 02, 2009, 11:39:25 AM
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''If their is a life after death,
then their is no death,
and if their is no death,
we do not live''
Progressive Metal Band
EVERGREY
MainzerPower
Post by: Deathclutch on February 02, 2009, 11:42:11 AM
quote:
I've seen the WR twice now thrown by three different bowlers and I've got to say, I'm not really impressed by what I saw. Rash, Dorin=Ballard and the lady from last week were throwing them and really (IMHO) NOT getting a good read or reaction from them.
Anyone else notice this??
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Inverted 1 and Dead Flush are my Evil Twins...
Yeah I have noticed. The doesnt seem to read the lane well at all. But who knows it might have looked good all week then go to crap on the telecast. Wouldnt be the first time.
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F.O.S.
Post by: COG-528 on February 02, 2009, 04:52:10 PM
I've just gotten back into bowling regularly after six year layoff. I'm using a Columbia 300 C/Beast I bought in the late 90s and know I should get a new ball. But it is very hard to tell from what is written in the ball reviews that would be applicable to me. I can't afford to be buying multiple balls for different conditions or spending money on a new ball that doesn't work any better for me than my old C/Beast.
So what am I supposed to do???
Edited on 2/2/2009 5:53 PM
Edited on 2/4/2009 4:50 PM
Post by: DON DRAPER on February 02, 2009, 04:54:17 PM
Post by: nocarey on February 02, 2009, 07:15:39 PM
Your old ball may still work if you find some lightly oiled lanes.
But if you have grips get them replaced, even check your span.
As for what you saw Sean and Carolyn roll in the doubles from Reno-
They just had an off day, chances are low you will ever see either miss a single pin spare or Sean come up light too often.
Like Greg said above "surface preperation" is a major factor and you can manipulate these new surfaces in many ways. But only before and after competition.
Edited on 2/2/2009 8:16 PM
Post by: Spider Ball Bowler on February 02, 2009, 07:44:19 PM
quote:
COG-528-
Your old ball may still work if you find some lightly oiled lanes.
Edited on 2/2/2009 8:16 PM
I don't think that even matters as much as the surface you're bowling on. If you're playing on wood and shoot down and in, urethanes work very well. They check up early and just roll. The only thing you're missing with a urethane ball that you can get from a reactive is MASSIVE recovery and better carry on light hits.
Get away from the urethane and you are giving up control for power. I roll urethane now and again just for fun, and on a wood THS I know I can average 210 or better, because the ball hits good on flush shots and evens out the THS pattern so I don't get that stupid jump on the back.
Roll with what works for you, but if you are bowling for money, you need to step up into the reactive, because 220's and 230's don't cut it anymore.
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Ahhh Disco Biscuits!
Post by: DON DRAPER on February 02, 2009, 08:31:26 PM
Post by: wasted talent on February 02, 2009, 10:10:43 PM
Post by: Burak Natal on February 03, 2009, 01:25:16 AM
quote:
Why is it that a ball just doesn't live up to the manufacturer's hype? Why is it always the bowler's fault? If a company hypes a ball to have the most back end of any ball they have every made I would expect it to do so on a typical house shot. No ball is perfect out of the factory for everyone but I would expect it to work for the majority of bowlers with the "out of box finish". It just seems that a lot of people are commenting about how the Wild Ride doesn't roll like expected out of the box and they have had to adjust the surface in order to get it to roll half-way decent.
Because it has a relatively WEAK core. Together with asymmetry, it is very easy to make it look junk with an inappropriate drilling.
OB finish is great for its INTENDED conditions and CORRECT line. That ball, for the majority, MUST be played close to friction. Yes, cover is not clean as enmotion and it is not allergic to carry-down, but still friction is needed. It is not an oil ball.
Again, core does not rev up as early as we all got used to seeing with most high-end releases of many companies. Lower pins, stronger pin-PAP distances AND smaller drilling angles are more likely to match up with the expectations of the majority. It is not bad, it is just different and should be treated accordingly.
If drilled AND played properly, believe me, it backends, and backends hard! At least, for me, it's sharper than similarly surface prepared Rampage, Original Inferno and Absolute Inferno.
quote:
Yeah I have noticed. The doesn't seem to read the lane well at all. But who knows it might have looked good all week then go to crap on the telecast. Wouldn't be the first time.
That is a very good point. They were doubles and missed single pin spares, lost their focus, made bad shots etc..
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Regards,
Natal
Edited on 2/3/2009 3:41 AM
Post by: dizzyfugu on February 04, 2009, 03:55:58 AM
quote:
Why is it that a ball just doesn't live up to the manufacturer's hype? Why is it always the bowler's fault?
It is because the bowler WANTS this certain ball. I come from a house league where 80% of players did not care for ball prep or had a strategy for their arsenal. Most ran into the pro shop (run by an idiot, sorry), asked for the most hooking ball and tossed it with glee in their eyes witha spinning release that made anything skid... I have seen people tossing high load particle pieces on a 30' THS, with absolutely NO ball reaction, but they were frim believers that this ball was "good", because the pro shop told them so and the ball had a high hook potential, according to its advertising.
IMHO, it is rarely the ball's fault - it is this swamp of ignorance on both sides that puts bowlers in a dead end.
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DizzyFugu (http://"http://www.putfile.com/dizzyfugu/") - Reporting from Germany
Confused by bowling?
Check out BR.com's vault of wisdom: the unofficial FAQ section (http://"http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=74110&ForumID=16&CategoryID=5")
Post by: COG-528 on February 04, 2009, 10:53:49 AM
quote:
quote:
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COG-528-
Your old ball may still work if you find some lightly oiled lanes.
Edited on 2/2/2009 8:16 PM
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I don't think that even matters as much as the surface you're bowling on. If you're playing on wood and shoot down and in, urethanes work very well. They check up early and just roll. The only thing you're missing with a urethane ball that you can get from a reactive is MASSIVE recovery and better carry on light hits.
Get away from the urethane and you are giving up control for power. I roll urethane now and again just for fun, and on a wood THS I know I can average 210 or better, because the ball hits good on flush shots and evens out the THS pattern so I don't get that stupid jump on the back.
I bowl in an early (6:30) league on what I believe are synthetic lanes. Is there any surface preparation I can do to my old Columbia 300 C/Beast that will make it work better under these conditions?
I was thinking if I can get the money together I'd pick up either a Copperhead or Swarm for a new ball. Haven't seen either one rolled where my league plays so don't know exactly what I should expect from either one.
Edited on 2/4/2009 4:51 PM
Post by: tizzle on February 04, 2009, 11:57:34 AM
Post by: Burak Natal on February 04, 2009, 03:20:19 PM
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Regards,
Natal
Post by: tizzle on February 05, 2009, 01:01:41 AM
Post by: Burak Natal on February 05, 2009, 01:36:43 AM
And I'd like to know your PAP to understand what exactly those pin placements mean.
Thanks,
(For a side note, I'm just trying to understand the situation for future reference, have no other intention)
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Regards,
Natal