Post by: JohnP on March 09, 2009, 02:40:16 AM
I am JohnP, I manage the pro shop at Tell City Bowling Center, Tell City, Indiana. I have a customer, EA, that purchased a 12 lb Twisted Fury from Bowlerstore.com on 3/19/08. I drilled the ball for his wife and was careful to keep the pin 1+" away from any hole and to bevel all holes. The ball does have finger grips, a thumb sleeve, and a balance hole. A couple of months after I drilled it, the ball cracked, first between the fingers and then about 3/4 of the way around, probably about 1/8" wide crack. I normally don't get involved in warranty issues for internet balls, but Bowlerstore.com has jerked him around so much that I have on this one. They had him return the ball, then sent it back to him unopened and marked "Rejected". They refused to answer repeated e-mails he sent. There is no way to talk to a human being there, just an on-line chat. I have attached a copy of the last chat I've had with them as a Word document. They have asked him to send the ball back again, but he doesn't want to pay for that and they only say there will be no charge if they honor the warranty. I really think they have no intention of doing so. Can Brunswick help us with this? By the way, I looked at the ball again a few days ago and there is a black gooey material oozing out from between the coverstock and the filler in the balance hole I drilled. My e-mail address and phone number (home) are below. Thanks for your help.
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 09, 2009, 10:49:29 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: Easy10pins on March 09, 2009, 12:35:41 PM
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The bowler formerly known as BrunsRod.
Solid 7 Pin?? 299 Game??!! WTF
Post by: Verbs on March 09, 2009, 12:53:46 PM
I no longer work for Brunswick, but I do know about some of the things that happen inside the company.
Tom Tomaras does handle all of the warrenty issues, but Tom also does some international traveling with seminars and teaching ball drilling overseas. I'm not sure if he is out of the country currently or not. But please be patient as Tom does have a very full plate.
Thanks
Verbs
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Larry Verble
Post by: BeansProShop on March 09, 2009, 01:58:10 PM
quote:
Isn't the ball warranty voided once you use inserts and/or a thumb slug?
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The bowler formerly known as BrunsRod.
Solid 7 Pin?? 299 Game??!! WTF
95% of all bowlers use finger grips and/or thumb slugs...
Most reputable ball manufacturers will still warranty the balls unlessthere is definate tampering or indisputable driller error..
Beans
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www.beansproshop.com
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Thomas "Beans" Biniek Jr.
PBA Member and Lane#1 National Sales Manager and Lane#1 Ball Drilling Expert
Check out current eBay auctions at:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=beanssecretsauce Official Pro Shop of "ALL" F.O.S. Members!!!
Post by: JohnP on March 09, 2009, 03:18:15 PM
Post by: clovismaul on March 09, 2009, 03:23:52 PM
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Who Shoots 650 without shooting a duece?
Post by: renoatpikeville on March 09, 2009, 03:27:06 PM
Now, we have stuff that cracks, all of which are used balls that have been plugged prior but I have never seen a NIB ball crack on the shelves...just sort of weird.
We are in the process of sending it back to our dist.
Post by: blacknois on March 09, 2009, 03:32:31 PM
quote:
We have a ball in our shop, NIB that just cracked last Thursday...I was going around the shop cleaning up and lo and behold a NIB Twisted Fury Pearl cracked.
Now, we have stuff that cracks, all of which are used balls that have been plugged prior but I have never seen a NIB ball crack on the shelves...just sort of weird.
We are in the process of sending it back to our dist.
we acutally have had that happen with a couple tropical storms in the shop, lighter weight ones though
Post by: JohnP on March 09, 2009, 08:52:52 PM
quote:
Just call your ball rep/salesman and tell him you had a ball crack they will replace it.I've had to same thing happened to one of my customers and the ball was replaced by my local distributor....good luck
I doubt that Classic would help replace a ball that they didn't sell, might be wrong. And we are a small center in the middle of nowhere. I've never had a ball company rep visit, and the Classic rep very seldom comes in. But also, I don't want to get the reputation of providing a warranty on internet balls. My intention is to find someone that will help my customer, then turn it over to him to work out the details. I wouldn't have gotten into it at all if Bowlerstore.com had been the least bit cooperative. -- JohnP
Post by: Easy10pins on March 09, 2009, 09:44:17 PM
quote:quote:
Isn't the ball warranty voided once you use inserts and/or a thumb slug?
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The bowler formerly known as BrunsRod.
Solid 7 Pin?? 299 Game??!! WTF
95% of all bowlers use finger grips and/or thumb slugs...
Most reputable ball manufacturers will still warranty the balls unlessthere is definate tampering or indisputable driller error..
Beans
I guess I'm in that 5% that doesn't use inserts or a thumb slug..
I bowl mainly at military base centers and was informed that a ball won't be warrantied with slugs or thumb insert. Something about the glue used and how it can weaken the molecular structure of the area around the holes. *dunno*
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The bowler formerly known as BrunsRod.
Solid 7 Pin?? 299 Game??!! WTF
Post by: mmcfarland300 on March 10, 2009, 08:35:14 AM
Post by: JohnP on March 11, 2009, 09:59:50 PM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 12, 2009, 09:04:42 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 13, 2009, 10:14:00 AM
Post by: jls on March 13, 2009, 11:04:04 AM
That is the normal way things are handled. A pro shop or a online dealer send the ball back to the dist. they bought the ball from.
Sounds like you went way out of your way to help!!!!
And yet more then likely, the next time this person buys a ball, they will buy PRICE, not good customer service. So they will again buy it online.
And when it cracks, they Bitxxh to the pro shop that drilled the ball.
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jls
Post by: JohnP on March 13, 2009, 05:30:23 PM
quote:
The real issue here is that Bowlerstore.com has not done anything here. They sold the ball to the consumer. The ball should have been returned to them, and then they would deal with their dist. And then their dist. would deal with Brunswick.
That is the normal way things are handled. A pro shop or a online dealer send the ball back to the dist. they bought the ball from.
Sounds like you went way out of your way to help!!!!
And yet more then likely, the next time this person buys a ball, they will buy PRICE, not good customer service. So they will again buy it online.
And when it cracks, they Bitxxh to the pro shop that drilled the ball.
I agree with you completely about Bowlerstore.com. When this issue is resolved, I plan to post what has happened, with my recommendation that no one should order anything from Bowlerstore.com, ever, on a half dozen or so forums that I participate in.
This customer has already purchased a new ball and ordered it through my shop. In fact, when that ball came in (it was not a Brunswick ball) it had a gouged area and we had to return it to Classic for replacement. I really don't think he will ever order another ball over the internet, that's one reason I really want to help him.
And the only thing he has complained to me about is the way Bowlerstore.com treated him, when I asked him how the warranty complaint was coming. He didn't ask for help, I just got aggravated at the way he was treated. -- JohnP
Post by: chatnboy on March 15, 2009, 12:41:25 AM
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Go hard or go home!!!!!Bowl your best...ALWAYS!!!
Post by: JohnP on March 16, 2009, 10:19:09 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 16, 2009, 11:05:25 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 16, 2009, 02:45:48 PM
-- JohnP
Post by: JohnP on March 17, 2009, 10:22:23 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 17, 2009, 10:58:01 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 20, 2009, 10:27:33 PM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 20, 2009, 10:30:31 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 24, 2009, 10:46:52 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 24, 2009, 12:11:16 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 24, 2009, 08:33:25 PM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 24, 2009, 10:47:22 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 25, 2009, 10:42:03 AM
I got a response from Tom Tomaras this morning asking if the customer had returned the ball using the labels that Brunswick Warranty Service provided. My response is below. Please remember that I'm trying to back myself out of this issue and let the customer deal with Brunswick directly. He was supposed to contact me when he heard back from Brunswick, either he hasn't gotten the labels yet or he didn't send me an e-mail.
Tom -- I don't know, but I'm sending a copy of this to the customer. (Names deleted) -- Please advise as to the status, send message to Tom and me. Thanks -- John
Post by: JohnP on March 25, 2009, 11:31:33 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 25, 2009, 01:30:43 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on March 25, 2009, 08:52:58 PM
Post by: JohnP on March 26, 2009, 10:51:01 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 26, 2009, 10:56:34 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: Verbs on March 26, 2009, 11:03:11 AM
Just FYI, Tom works for Brunswick part time. He is the produce manager for a local large chain of stores. He usually gets into his office at Brunswick around 1pm.
Trust me, Brunswick WILL take care of the situation. They just have to do all the proper "corpoarate" procedures.
Thanks,
Verbs
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Larry Verble
Post by: JohnP on March 26, 2009, 04:43:56 PM
Post by: JohnP on March 28, 2009, 08:48:28 PM
Post by: JOE FALCO on March 29, 2009, 12:37:11 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on April 01, 2009, 10:24:24 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 01, 2009, 11:38:12 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on April 04, 2009, 09:52:22 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 04, 2009, 10:01:12 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: bassace on April 04, 2009, 04:00:41 PM
quote:
I've been thinking about this .. all my dealings with manufacturers and cracked balls were satisfied with PICTURES! Why is BRUNSWICK making the customer go through extra SHIPPING expenses when a picture should be enough? At the end of each of my experiences it wasn't necessary for me to return the ball (however in most cases I did!).
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Storm made me send a ball to them.
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"So here's my sound advice: shut your trap, get a life, and make a quick run to the store so you can buy yourself a clue." - Uncle Crusty to Mike James 9/15/08
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 04, 2009, 08:44:22 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: Verbs on April 04, 2009, 09:51:08 PM
It is EXTREMELY rare when a company will deny a claim. I know this because I used to work for a manufacturer and currently I work for a LARGE distributor.
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Larry Verble
Post by: JohnP on April 07, 2009, 10:14:20 AM
Post by: on April 07, 2009, 02:05:06 PM
Sometimes a company wants to examine the ball because all "cracks" are not equal. They can be caused by any number of reasons, so if the company requests the ball to be shipped, it may be to determine the problem and hopefully avoid it in the future. I have confidence that your customer will be treated fairly. Keep us posted.
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Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff
www.brunswickbowling.com
The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 07, 2009, 04:45:21 PM
quote:
Sometimes a company wants to examine the ball because all "cracks" are not equal. They can be caused by any number of reasons, so if the company requests the ball to be shipped, it may be to determine the problem and hopefully avoid it in the future. I have confidence that your customer will be treated fairly. Keep us posted.
Mr Carter .. I understand your comment and surely agree that a look at the ball MAY eliminate other customer problems .. but could not that happen after this customer is satisfied (send the ball back).
In this case you have JohnP (a Pro Shop owner) reviewing the ball and you have the possibility of looking at Pictures of the ball .. all this could assist in determining if the company should be of service to the customer. After the decision if they want the ball for research .. send it back!
I feel Customer Satisfaction is 1st! Brunswick should honor the fact he chose BRUNSWICK, paid for Ball Protection (whatever that is) and had a Pro Shop's opinion that the ball was not abused.
Having the ball returned before a decision is made causes an expense to the customer a longer then necessary period for the customer to be without a ball and an UN-HAPPY CUSTOMER!
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Edited on 4/7/2009 4:46 PM
Post by: on April 07, 2009, 05:28:27 PM
This thread has been going for some time now, (almost a month) but if I remember correctly (hopefully) wasn't something leaking from the ball? In that case a picture doesn't tell Brunswick what the substance is. It's not as if the customer has to pay for the shipping...
By the way, I agree that John has done an excellent job for the customer. the customer has "dropped the ball" here...
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Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff
www.brunswickbowling.com
The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.
Edited on 4/7/2009 5:32 PM
Post by: JohnP on April 08, 2009, 10:08:08 AM
Post by: JohnP on April 13, 2009, 09:56:12 AM
Post by: JohnP on April 13, 2009, 11:23:33 AM
Edited on 4/13/2009 2:46 PM
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 13, 2009, 01:00:34 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on April 14, 2009, 03:02:21 PM
Post by: on April 14, 2009, 03:39:50 PM
Thanks for updating us, and thanks for your exemplary customer service. Hopefully that customer will be as loyal to you in the future as you have been to him.
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Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff
www.brunswickbowling.com
The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 14, 2009, 03:53:53 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: Verbs on April 14, 2009, 05:05:38 PM
When your customer gets the ball and brings it to you to get drilled, make sure you charge him a fair price for your efforts. You have went WAY above and beyond the call of duty to get your customers satifaction for a product that he didn't even buy from you.
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Larry Verble
Post by: JohnP on April 15, 2009, 09:58:00 AM
Post by: JohnP on April 22, 2009, 10:05:37 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on April 22, 2009, 10:26:07 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Post by: JohnP on May 02, 2009, 10:38:46 AM
Post by: JohnP on May 03, 2009, 09:45:03 PM
Post by: JohnP on May 04, 2009, 09:57:54 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on May 04, 2009, 10:04:06 AM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
RIP Thong Princess
Post by: blacknois on May 04, 2009, 12:28:08 PM
Post by: bassace on May 04, 2009, 02:34:28 PM
quote:quote:
If that's not the pot calling the kettle black, I don't know what is. Joe has never trolled this or any other forum, he's been here much longer than you and as far as I can see, you're the troll at the moment.
+1 .... Joe is an honest respected member of this site and has never trolled and never will troll. Bassace must be confused as he is way off base here.
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"Whenever I feel the urge to exercise I lie down until the feeling passes away."
Brick
Edited on 5/4/2009 2:12 PM
Ok..I removed my original post because I used the wrong words. It just seems funny that he has taken such an interest in this thread when he is not involved with the transaction.
I see him blaming Brunswick for taking so long but not the online retailer who is really at fault.
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"So here's my sound advice: shut your trap, get a life, and make a quick run to the store so you can buy yourself a clue." - Uncle Crusty to Mike James 9/15/08
Post by: JohnP on May 04, 2009, 07:42:36 PM
Post by: on May 04, 2009, 07:58:12 PM
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Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff
www.brunswickbowling.com
The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer and not of Brunswick Corporation.
Post by: JOE FALCO on May 04, 2009, 07:59:10 PM
Sorry BASS .. but I must tell you that if this customer was YOU and a Pro Shop owner like JohnP said it looks like the ball had a FLAW I would say the same words in your defense. I said that JohnP stating that there was "a Black robbery material in the balance hole" should have been sufficient evidence that the ball had a problem. There was a lot of time lost sending the ball back and NOW there seems to be a delay with BRUNSWICK sending the replacement ball.
I don't feel like I was jumping on BRUNSWICK and I do believe everything I said!
Maybe I'm wrong but I've heard from BR members who have made trades with other BR members and were angry because they didn't receive their goods in 10 days .. Brunswick has taking 20 days! I HONESTLY DON"T THINK THAT'S FAIR!
I'm positive Brunswick will come through .. however I DON'T CONSIDER THAT GOOD TREATMENT OF CUSTOMERS!
I also apologize for ruffling your feathers and I hope I have explained my thought process!
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
RIP Thong Princess
Post by: bassace on May 04, 2009, 08:17:25 PM
No problems here.
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"So here's my sound advice: shut your trap, get a life, and make a quick run to the store so you can buy yourself a clue." - Uncle Crusty to Mike James 9/15/08
Post by: JohnP on May 05, 2009, 10:44:39 AM
Post by: JohnP on July 08, 2009, 10:22:16 AM
Post by: JOE FALCO on July 08, 2009, 12:46:26 PM
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
RIP Thong Princess