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Author Topic: why Brunswick.... why  (Read 22359 times)

bighook69

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why Brunswick.... why
« on: June 16, 2005, 10:46:43 AM »
I really like the fact that bowling balls are made in the USA... but, Brunswick, who has a plant near me (Muskegon, Michigan) is moving a ball making plant to Mexico...

any reason  besides its cheaper behind the move?
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tekneek

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #106 on: June 21, 2005, 11:28:03 AM »
Many large companies have moved production plants south of the border due to financial reasons. Gm engines and seats are assembled in Mexico, Dodge engines as well, overseen by Gm and Dodge quality control. Motorola components are shipped to Mexico and are assembled there, telephones,TV's, Radios electrical components and switches, panel boxes for Square D and other electrial giants. Boots and jeans for Wrangler, Levi's and Lee are produced in Mexico just to name a few. If it means the stability of a company it will happen regardless of you or my wishes. It all comes down to the bottom line, it is called business, keeping the stock holders happy and the CEO's getting their huge bonuses.
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Bjaardker

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #107 on: June 21, 2005, 01:59:21 PM »
quote:
It all comes down to the bottom line, it is called business, keeping the stock holders happy and the CEO's getting their huge bonuses.


And there you have it. So let's just all roll over on our backs & let businesses run wild.

I'll be sure to keep a seat warm for you on skid row.

Bjaardker

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #108 on: June 21, 2005, 03:11:09 PM »
quote:
It is probably already too late to stop Brunswick, but by the time the plant in Mexico is operational, it will definitely be too late.  For that reason, I am ceasing purchases of Brunswick products immediately.


Ditto.

KDawg77

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #109 on: June 21, 2005, 03:47:37 PM »
WHY BRUNSWICK WHY DOES THIS D#MN TOPIC KEEP GOING!

sdbowler

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #110 on: June 21, 2005, 04:39:43 PM »
quote:
well thats why I like small bowling companys, they dont care about money as much as big corporations, i use visionary and they beat out any other ball company on the market, enough said....

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I have to argue with you on that one. EVERY company is in business for one thing and that is to MAKE MONEY. Tell me one company that is in business that is not that they hope to just stay even. I can't think of one.
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TheDude

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #111 on: June 21, 2005, 10:09:04 PM »
those are non-profit charities. brunswick hasn't seen over 100 years of billard and bowling business for nothing.

quote:
quote:
well thats why I like small bowling companys, they dont care about money as much as big corporations, i use visionary and they beat out any other ball company on the market, enough said....

--------------------
VPB Test Staff 2005



I have to argue with you on that one. EVERY company is in business for one thing and that is to MAKE MONEY. Tell me one company that is in business that is not that they hope to just stay even. I can't think of one.
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Bjaardker

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #112 on: June 22, 2005, 11:01:33 AM »
quote:
Who said there wasn't any racist individuals on this board?

From Hammerbowler.
"Dexter moved their plant to china or some sh!t like that"
"hell, if you want to hire mexicans to do more work for less money, move the plant to my next of the woods, we've got friggin day-laborers on every corner..."

Sounds pretty racist to me...

And you don't like stupid people? Damn, don't be so hard on yourself.


I don't think that anyone said there weren't racist people on this board. As a matter of fact I think there are a great deal of people who need help with their preconcieved notions of other peoples.

However, this issue isn't about race & playing the race card is non-topical & getting away from the point.

Brunswick is laying off people everywhere & moving TONS of their production to Mexico to "maximize their profits". Mind you, profits are way up without these measures being taken, it's just that the CEO feels 4.14 million a year just isn't enough for him.

quote:
While the CEOs of major corporations made an average of 42 times the pay of an average worker in 1980, today the top bosses make a staggering 419 times the average pay.


quote:
Executive pay jumped 571 percent between 1990 and 2000. CEO pay rose even in 2000, a year in which the S&P 500 suffered a 10 percent loss. The explosion in CEO pay over the decade dwarfed the 37 percent growth in worker pay."


quote:
"If the average annual pay for production workers had grown at the same rate since 1990 as it has for CEOs, their 2000 annual earnings would have been $120,491 instead of $24,668. Likewise, if the minimum wage, which stood at $3.80 an hour in 1990, had grown at the same rate as CEO pay over the decade, it would now be $25.50 an hour, rather than the current $5.15 an hour."


quote:
"The startling hike in CEO pay, which has gone from 42 to 400 times that of the average worker in the past two decades, is 'terribly bad social policy and perhaps even bad morals,' William McDonough, President of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, has said."


Even Business Week calls CEO pay "out of control."

One final quote that pretty much explains it all:

"Tying a CEO's salary to his stock options is wrong for a number of reasons, but let's start with the economic reasons, the business reasons. One thing it does when you're a CEO, and now 80 percent of your salary on average comes from stock options, is it ties your own personal fate to the stock price of your company. And many studies have shown it's led C.E.O.'s to take decisions which are good in their short-term stock price interests but not good in the long-term interests of the country, the economy, the community. For example, if you slash your work force by 10,000 workers, the stock market likes that. It shows you're cutting costs. The stock price goes up. It may be -- and this often is the case after six months or a year -- bad for the company; it's certainly bad for the community; it's bad for the tax base, but by being paid through stock options, you have that incentive. I should also say it has shown in many companies morale goes down as the CEOs salary goes up through the roof, not only among lower wage workers but among managers and the government is also hurting from this because companies deduct CEO pay. As it goes up through the roof, the share that corporations pay to our tax base goes down."

Mustang Guy

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #113 on: June 22, 2005, 01:29:04 PM »
I didn't read all these posts, so I'm not sure if this was already mentioned.  

A Roto Grip staffer who lives in Michigan is sending me an article.  In this article it states that 115 jobs were lost and they are going to be saving a total of $2.43/per ball (labor costs) by moving to Mexico.  I'm sure there are other reasons behind the move, but that was the information given in the article.  

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Bjaardker

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #114 on: June 22, 2005, 11:52:08 PM »
quote:
roger,

i, also, have not waded through this whole post, but from a local news source here in MI...

 
quote:
Brunswick said that estimated transition costs of approximately $7 million will be incurred over the next two years and will not materially affect its overall financial performance for 2005. The move will save the company between $5 million and $6 million annually once the transition is complete in 2007.


thats a bunch of balls at $2.43 a pop (labor or otherwise)...


KOTM,

Had you read through, you would have seen that the top 4 people at Brunswick make over $7.25 Million a year. Just 4 people. Now, there is nothing in their financials that is saying they wont continue to make that. The Bowling/Billiard division is making money to the tune of a 41.4 million dollar operating margin.

So they are cutting 115 jobs, hurting a Michigan community, and uprooting families all for what??? Greed.

bighook69

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #115 on: June 23, 2005, 05:09:20 PM »
quote:
WHY BRUNSWICK WHY DOES THIS D#MN TOPIC KEEP GOING!


HAy, dont mock my topic or wish death on it

It is a big issue you know...

the people of Muskegon are not too happy eigher
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Edited on 6/23/2005 5:04 PM

qstick777

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #116 on: June 23, 2005, 07:45:35 PM »
quote:
eventually the people who lost their jobs,or any job from production sent away will not have the $200 for an inferno,an extra league,because they had to settle and work at quiznos. then they have no cash to spend where you work either, and you lose yourself.simple.


That is true.  People look at this and say "good for Brunswick, they are making moves to ensure their future," and "tough luck for those people, but it's only 115 people, big deal - life it hard, deal with it it."

Fact is 115 are "affected."  That is 115 people (and their families) that no longer have a salary to depend on.  "So, just find another job!"  Anybody know how plentiful jobs are in Muskegon, Michigan?  I sure as h3ll don't, so unless you live there you really shouldn't be commenting.  So, these 115 people don't have a job, so maybe they go on welfare.  Or, maybe they take early retirement and start drawing social security.  Or, maybe they resort to crime, or alcohol, or drugs to ease their "pain."  Who knows what happens to them, but I don't see how the move is good for the US economy - the only people benefitting are Brunswick stockholders, upper management, and the newly employed mexican workers.  Maybe we get some new technology that gives us some great new bowling ball that can hook the lanes - read the forums, people are already complaining that the game is too easy!  It's a friggin game - you throw the ball at some pins and try to knock them all down - yee haw!  Do you think the 115 "affected" families care how many strikes we make?  Maybe they used to when they had pride in their job, but I beat they could care less when they no longer have a job.

"People shouldn't depend on manufacturing jobs to survive - this country needs to become more of a service industry oriented country.  Take up plumbing or become an electrician!"  Great idea!  We can have 18 billion plumbers and electrians all fighting for customers!  "I'll charge $5 less per hour than Larry so people will call me - at least my family will be eating, too bad for Larry!"

Both sides of the discussion have valid points, and we can discuss this all we want, but it isn't going to change anything.  The facts are: a) people are losing their jobs, b) a large corporation is making moves to make more money for a selected few, and  c) people are upset.

I for one am glad to see the passion in this discussion (from both sides!), but really how much longer are we going to beat this thing?  Write a letter, start a petition, go picket the factory - complaining on this board isn't going to do anything.

bighook69

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Re: why Brunswick.... why
« Reply #117 on: June 23, 2005, 07:49:52 PM »
you want to know how hard jobs are to get now in Michigan? We are ranked among the top 5 states for the highest un imployment rate right now... It is a mess, you better have a job and you better have work to do right now, it took my Mother 1 1/2 years to find an office job... For the most part it is near impossible to find a job in Michigan right now...

like i said, its a mess... and people in Muskegon are not happy about this
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Edited on 6/23/2005 7:45 PM