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Author Topic: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation  (Read 878 times)

Ensio

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Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« on: December 30, 2018, 10:36:04 AM »
Hi all,

Just started to bowling and got my first arsenal, and I want to keep it simple.

Couple surface questions still confuses me.

Arsenal:

BW Plastic Ball , Straight , Shiny -> Spare Ball
BW Rhino, Angular , Pearl, Long distance -> Light to medium condition
BW Fearless, Continuous, Medium distance -> Medium
DV8 Pitbull, Traction, Shortest distance -> Heavy Oil

Finnish of the balls (according to BW website):

Rhino: 500 Siaair / Crown Factory Compound / Crown Factory Shine
Fearless: 500 Siaair / Crown Factory Compound
Pitbull: 1000 Siaair

I want to have a maintenance / performance of the ball easy and simple.

At the moment Fearless and Pitbull surface  feels like the same with finger tip feeling?

My plan was to use 4000 grit on the Rhino, 2000grit on the Fearless, and 1000 grit on the Pitbull after reading the Wikis (http://wiki.bowlingchat.net/wiki/images ... _Table.pdf)

PDF says:
Wet sanded with new 4000 grit Abralon/Siaair -> Good starting point for light-medium conditions
Wet sanded with new 2000 grit Abralon/Siaair -> Good starting point for medium conditions
Wet sanded with new 1000 grit Abralon/Siaair. -> Good starting point for medium-heavy to heavy conditions

Is this a good plan?

Please let me know what is the difference between Brunswick grit?

How much higher will the compound go from 500 grit? Can it be 2000 grit?

Finnish of 500 siar with Crown Factory compound
Finnish of 500 siar with Crown Factory compound with shine

Do I now have the Rhino and Fearless almost in the same grit category without any sanding adjustments?

Please advice also other options? Or just trial and error  ;D


Happy bowling!

Ensio

 

vwDiesel

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2019, 10:31:08 AM »
My 2 cents:

If "keeping it simple" is a goal, I suggest avoiding compound (at least at first.) I find compound to be very finicky because it is extremely sensitive to both the amount of pressure applied and the amount of water used when spinning.

Compounded surfaces usually scan in the 4500-5000 grit range. Polished surfaces scan in the 5000+ grit range. (This is based on BJI's reviews of OOB balls.)

For replicating a 500-compound surface I go with 500-4000, 500-used 4000, or 500-5000 (CTD pad).

I would try those. Much easier to repeat IMO... using pads and water in a well-lit work area you can easily see the reflections sharpening to use as a guide to get the surface you want.
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication."

SVstar34

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2019, 12:07:39 PM »
My 2 cents:

If "keeping it simple" is a goal, I suggest avoiding compound (at least at first.) I find compound to be very finicky because it is extremely sensitive to both the amount of pressure applied and the amount of water used when spinning.

Compounded surfaces usually scan in the 4500-5000 grit range. Polished surfaces scan in the 5000+ grit range. (This is based on BJI's reviews of OOB balls.)

For replicating a 500-compound surface I go with 500-4000, 500-used 4000, or 500-5000 (CTD pad).

I would try those. Much easier to repeat IMO... using pads and water in a well-lit work area you can easily see the reflections sharpening to use as a guide to get the surface you want.

This covers it pretty well. I'll add that it also depends on the lane conditions you'll see often plus your release.

If you're rev dominant, that could potentially be too much surface. I'm rev dominant and can't use strong surface unless there's a good amount of oil.

I'd personally recommend keep the Rhino at box surface for now or go with 2000 + polish so you can replicate it easier.

For the Fearless I'd just smooth out the surface with 3000 or 4000 by hand. I personally like 3000 as my middle of the road grit and do 500/3000

The Pitbull is in a different category of needing oil. I would leave as is for now until you figure out what you need to do with it. 1000 is a good starting point but strong ball with strong surface is going to puke without enough oil
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BowlingForDonuts

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2019, 02:06:51 PM »
Does Brunswick use compound for same reason I do because it saves on buying new pads?  Seems like from the BTM reviews even the factory surface finishing with compound isn't always super consistent (for example see how badly off the Black Quantum #s were).  Good advice above to not get hung up on factory finish with compound.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2019, 02:12:06 PM by BowlingForDonuts »
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bowler851

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2019, 06:36:31 PM »
My 2 cents:

If "keeping it simple" is a goal, I suggest avoiding compound (at least at first.) I find compound to be very finicky because it is extremely sensitive to both the amount of pressure applied and the amount of water used when spinning.

Compounded surfaces usually scan in the 4500-5000 grit range. Polished surfaces scan in the 5000+ grit range. (This is based on BJI's reviews of OOB balls.)

For replicating a 500-compound surface I go with 500-4000, 500-used 4000, or 500-5000 (CTD pad).

I would try those. Much easier to repeat IMO... using pads and water in a well-lit work area you can easily see the reflections sharpening to use as a guide to get the surface you want.
accually it is 500 then 1500 then 5000 pad

Ensio

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2019, 01:12:48 AM »
Thanks for the replies, this confirms that my feelings was right.

Shiny balls are more sellable. :o

I wish though that the local proshop owner would had notified me of the specs on the surfaces when I bought them. "btw. OOB Pitbull surface is not 1000 grit its probably little bit more, here is an abralon pad so you can change the surface if needed, Fearless is almos the same grit as the Rhino, the motion is different, so I would suggest you change the surfaces to get different lenghts"

I will go for the option to sand the Fearless with 2000 grit Abralon, probably will end up somwhere between 2000-3000 grit. I was planning that this would be my benchmark ball for medium oil. Then sand the Rhino with 4000 and Pitbull with the 1000 grit.

Then I have at least different lenghts of balls, now they seem almost to be the equal lenght.

Im not bowling only on THS so the lanes can be from 35 feet up to 44 feet with different oil patterns. Makes the game more intresting and fun. (hard also) 

Even as newbie to bowling I have never understood the THS thrill, its like going to the same resturant eating the same dessert each time ;D




notclay

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2019, 10:34:27 PM »

I'm at the other end of the spectrum regarding compound.  I LOVE it. 

Yes, the abrasives in it change your underlying grit, but you can compound finish a ball anywhere from a dull (2000 like) finish to a higher gloss when used at high speeds and more water, especially when using multiple abrasive steps before the compound. 

Simply put, I can get the benefit of polish without using a polish.  Most polishes use slip agents (some more than others) that can give you the dreaded over/under reaction.  No hook at all, then unpredictable hook after it finally grabs the lane.

Compounds give me some push through the heads and a more predictable read once it finds friction.  To each their own, I guess.



Lane Carter
Brunswick Regional Staff
Salt Lake City, Utah

BowlingForDonuts

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #7 on: January 03, 2019, 11:38:57 PM »

I'm at the other end of the spectrum regarding compound.  I LOVE it. 

Yes, the abrasives in it change your underlying grit, but you can compound finish a ball anywhere from a dull (2000 like) finish to a higher gloss when used at high speeds and more water, especially when using multiple abrasive steps before the compound. 

Simply put, I can get the benefit of polish without using a polish.  Most polishes use slip agents (some more than others) that can give you the dreaded over/under reaction.  No hook at all, then unpredictable hook after it finally grabs the lane.

Compounds give me some push through the heads and a more predictable read once it finds friction.  To each their own, I guess.

+1.  Love compound as well but does take some experimenting and experience to get the reaction you are looking for which is why I guess most steer newer people to pads until they are comfortable managing and replicating surface.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 11:40:41 PM by BowlingForDonuts »
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Ensio

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2019, 12:53:34 AM »
Thank you all for the valuable comments!

For me as a beginner its easier to understand grits than compound.

I guess you need a ball spinner to able to replicate your favourite surface with compound?

Ps. I also understand that you dont want to give all your ball preperation tips for free as its a competition game after all  :)

Probably I will be a compound man after I have tried to sand my balls.  ;D ::)

I got my lesson also yesterday!(during holidays I had a chance to play on very oily conditions) went to a local Specto hall (to check my speed and rev rates) and found out that the lanes where super dry! I found out that the Fearless was way too aggressive, not a dip of oil on the ball after 2 hours of play.

In the end I was bowling BW Tzone spare ball from 3-5 board in to the pocket. (speed 18-19mph, with revs around  380-430)

Didn't have my shiny Rhino with me. :'(

So yes, you need to have a shiny pearl ball  ;D ;D

I like the Brunswick products but there should be some kind of tutorial on ball motion on the website and comparision charts like Rotogrip has.

The old Brunswick balls seems to have good tutorial/grading.


https://bowlingballexchange.com/showthread.php?t=27309


Hook potential is not so informative for a beginner, every ball hooks.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 01:17:03 AM by Ensio »

BowlingForDonuts

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Re: Brunswick ball arsenal - understanding surface preperation
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2019, 05:06:30 PM »
Thank you all for the valuable comments!

For me as a beginner its easier to understand grits than compound.

I guess you need a ball spinner to able to replicate your favourite surface with compound?

Ps. I also understand that you dont want to give all your ball preperation tips for free as its a competition game after all  :)

Probably I will be a compound man after I have tried to sand my balls.  ;D ::)

I got my lesson also yesterday!(during holidays I had a chance to play on very oily conditions) went to a local Specto hall (to check my speed and rev rates) and found out that the lanes where super dry! I found out that the Fearless was way too aggressive, not a dip of oil on the ball after 2 hours of play.

In the end I was bowling BW Tzone spare ball from 3-5 board in to the pocket. (speed 18-19mph, with revs around  380-430)

Didn't have my shiny Rhino with me. :'(

So yes, you need to have a shiny pearl ball  ;D ;D

I like the Brunswick products but there should be some kind of tutorial on ball motion on the website and comparision charts like Rotogrip has.

The old Brunswick balls seems to have good tutorial/grading.


https://bowlingballexchange.com/showthread.php?t=27309


Hook potential is not so informative for a beginner, every ball hooks.

Yeah Brunswick latest web re-brand is trash.  Went full DV8 hipster and it sucks.  Yeah blisters were a powerful motivator for me to get a spinner.   Once you do have a spinner surface becomes a breeze plus great way to clean your stuff as well.  Makes it much easier to find the surface that works for you. 
Less is more especially with forum posts.