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Author Topic: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER  (Read 3238 times)

Ric Clint

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I've been using Doc's ELIXER on most of my balls, and I seem to have gotten alot more useage and life span out of my Particle balls than if I had NOT been using it.

One of my particle balls (that was treated with ELIXER) lived for about 175-200 games, where as one of my others (that was NOT treated with ELIXER) died at a very, very young age of about 55-65 games!

My point is that I got ALOT more useage out of a "elixer" ball than I did with a "non-elixer" ball... eventhough it did eventually die in the long run.

So what if I wanted to put the ball in the Ebonite HOOK AGAIN... would the Hook Again still work on the ball eventhough the ball is actually saturated with the ELIXER?

Ebonite doesn't believe that OIL absorbtion is the reason for Particle Death... they think that "plastisizers" are the reason for Particle Death. (you'll have to read about it on Ebonite's website to know what I'm talking about.)


So think about it - if the Elixer keeps the oil from getting "in" the poors of the ball, then wouldn't the Elixer also keep the pastisizers from getting "out" of the poors of the ball when processed in the Hook Again stuff???


Make sense???






Edited on 3/22/2004 0:59 AM

 

Strider

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2004, 01:02:39 AM »
Actually, I think Ebonite says the plasticizer migrates mostly to the track area where most of the friction occurs.  The Elixir is also eventually worn away.  As long as the theories are correct, Hook Again would still be an effective product for balls that have been treated with the Elixir.

I use Doc's Elixir on my particles, but I can't remember the last time I used one.  I haven't had any performance issues, so I can't tell you firsthand whether Hook Again would actually work on an Elixir treated ball.
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Ric Clint

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2004, 04:23:24 PM »
Thanks for the replies so far!


And I know that if you sand the ball with some Scotchbrite that it's suppose to take the Elixer off of the ball... but I just wonder if there is still some Elixer left "IN" the actual little poors that maybe the sanding process wouldn't take off? If so, then that may keep the Hook Again from working to it's full potential because the Plasticizers may be trapped inside the poors because of the Elixer.

If that makes sense?

 




Edited on 3/23/2004 5:20 PM

a_ak57

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2004, 04:25:19 PM »
You're welcome.
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Hey, everyone else has it too!

Ric Clint

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2004, 03:15:51 AM »
quote:
about this docs elixer, it is supposed to stop or slow oil absorption right?  to me this doesnt seem all that great. the reason that reactives (with or without particles) have more reaction than a normal urethane ball is because they absorb the oil while rolling down the lane, thereby making more contact with the lane and gripping better. it seems that if the elixer reduces oil absorption it would only reduce the hooking capabilities of a reactive/particle ball. i dunno, i dont use the stuff so i dont know first hand, but it just doesnt seem like a great idea to me. or am i just waaaay off base here ????


You know... I've wondered this same EXACT thing! The reason balls hook is because they absorb oil - so if the Elixer stops a ball from absorbing oil, then how does the ball still hook?




charlest

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2004, 04:08:14 AM »
Ric,

1. Since, from most reports on the Hook Again System, it seems to require a ball to be sanded to about 320-400 grit before putting it into the container in order to get the best results, that process should solve your problem about the Elixir, because sanding removes the Elixir coating. YOu obviously refinish/resurface the ball to wear it needs to be after the Hook Again process; then you re-apply the Elixir.

2. Oil absortion seems to be more a by-product of resin's hooking ability rather than the cause of the ball's ability to hook more than urethane coverstocks. Part and parcel of resin balls is the dynamic property of their cores to flare and thus expose more fresh surface to the oil. It is not that oil absorption has no effect, but it does help that oil is removed from the surface by absorption; so that surface has better grip; remember that they also skid a lot more than urethane balls and that is part of the reason for their power.

If you note that when urethane balls use dynamic and flaring cores, that type of coverstock also hooks a lot more than the old pancake core urethane balls. That was on of the reasons why the old Black Hammer was such a great ball: it flared.

Remember Doc's Elixir does not totally prevent absorption; it only slows it down to some degree.



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JohnP

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2004, 12:29:49 PM »
charlest -- Are you sure that the old Black Hammer flares?  I've had one for about 10 years and still use it for spares and when the shot breaks down with my other equipment, and I've never seen but the one oil ring on the track.  --  JohnP

charlest

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2004, 01:24:06 PM »
quote:
charlest -- Are you sure that the old Black Hammer flares?  I've had one for about 10 years and still use it for spares and when the shot breaks down with my other equipment, and I've never seen but the one oil ring on the track.  --  JohnP


Sorry. which one of those Hammer urethanes came with the 2 pice, dynamic core? It wasn't very dynamic, but it had some flare. Pretty sure it was the Black. I bought an old one from Doug Sterner with a 1.5" pin, drilled it "strong" (a relative term) and it does flare a little.

Yeah, John, pretty sure it was the Black that had the 2 piece core:
http://www.bowlingballreviews.com/ball.asp?ballid=290

Just checked mine (hadn't used it since the Summer); it has a good 2" of flare. Maybe yours had the CG and pin co-located or you did not drill it with the pin in a strong position?

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JohnP

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Re: Using HOOK AGAIN on a ball that has been treated with Doc's ELIXER
« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2004, 05:49:12 PM »
charlest -- Yes, that's the ball.  I sure didn't know it was a two piece, thought it was pancake.  When I bought it I didn't know a thing about drilling.  The ball was drilled "straight up", with the cg at the gc.  I have no idea where the pin is, but I'll look Monday when I go back to the center.  It must be drilled weak, because I don't see any sign of flare.  --  JohnP