BallReviews
General Category => Drilling & Layouts => Topic started by: Dan Griffin on March 14, 2016, 08:52:33 AM
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So, I've had this problem for a while now and I haven't been able to find a solution. I can usually bowl the first few games with no problem at all. However, after about 3 or 4 games my hand starts to swell some and my thumb constantly gets stuck in the ball on release. Last night it was especially bad and I was lofting the ball almost to the arrows.
I've tried everything I can think of to fix this, but nothing has helped. I've tried using more reverse pitch, larger thumb holes, tape in the front and tape in the back. I've tried using the white and black tape with the same results. My thumb doesn't sweat that much and I always make sure my hand is dry inside the ball.
My span is 4 3/8 with 3/16 reverse and 0 lateral pitch in the thumb. Could shortening my span be a possible solution? I remember using a ball with a span of 4 1/4 a while back and never got stuck in that.
If anyone has any advise on this I'd really appreciate it.
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Sounds like you're a candidate for switch grips.
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With that span and that much reverse pitch I'd guess that you're squeezing the heck out of the grip, which makes your thumb swell more than normal. The further into your set, the more time it has to swell.
My span and yours are extremely close (1/16") and I've gone to 1/8" forward so I don't need as much hand pressure. Many years ago I had 3/16 reverse and needed a "death grip" to hold on to the ball. I gradually changed to 0/0 and then to 1/8 forward (I'm contemplating even more forward, but haven't done it yet).
If you try more forward pitch you'll want to slightly shorten the span (depending on your fit now) to get your thumb out cleanly.
Try it on a ball for a few weeks before changing all your equipment, but I really think that excessive grip pressure causes swelling.
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With that span and that much reverse pitch I'd guess that you're squeezing the heck out of the grip, which makes your thumb swell more than normal. The further into your set, the more time it has to swell.
My span and yours are extremely close (1/16") and I've gone to 1/8" forward so I don't need as much hand pressure. Many years ago I had 3/16 reverse and needed a "death grip" to hold on to the ball. I gradually changed to 0/0 and then to 1/8 forward (I'm contemplating even more forward, but haven't done it yet).
If you try more forward pitch you'll want to slightly shorten the span (depending on your fit now) to get your thumb out cleanly.
Try it on a ball for a few weeks before changing all your equipment, but I really think that excessive grip pressure causes swelling.
I've actually been thinking about trying that. Generally speaking, if I shortened my span 1/8", how much more forward pitch would I need to use? I was thinking about reducing my span to 4 1/4 with zero thumb pitch.
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A couple of Vise IT's could help with that also. I drill two for almost all my customers and for myself
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Get your spans right first, to check them insert your thumb fully and lay your fingers over their holes. The gripping surface of each finger should fall half way between the first and second joint.
If you still have a problem with swelling when the spans are correct an interchangeable thumb will be great, but you may be able to get by with using a Magic Carpet. -- JohnP
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Notclay and John P have you going in the right direction here. Make sure your spans are correct first. Then adjust the forward and reverse in your thumb pitch based on the correct spans.
Sounds like too much reverse based on your current span.. And if the span is long for your hand, that is why you need the reverse to even get out of the ball at all.
There are a lot of other factors involved, but start with checking your span and go from there.
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Everyone has different joints and each joint has different flexibility, but my span is very close to Notclay and I have 0/0 forward/reverse and 0 lateral in my thumb currently, so I concur in general with Notclay. Go to a qualified pro shop operator (if you are serious about bowling, even if you have to drive and hour+ to get to one, it is worth it) to measure your hand, gauge your pitches and drill a test ball with the new span/pitches.
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Just wanted to post an update on this. I recently started using 1/8 left pitch in my thumb hole and it's helped a lot. I still occasionally get stuck in later games, but not nearly as bad as before. The pitch change combined with a good amount of bevel seems to have done the trick. It also feels much more comfortable to my hand overall.
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If you want to get rid of that late game sticking, open the thumb hole up a little more, 1/64" - 1/32", and use a Magic Carpet, as I mentioned earlier. The website is
www.bowl4fun.com
Contact Ron Clifton at the phone number on the website or by e-mail and he'll probably send you one for free, that's how he gets us hooked. Don't open the thumb hole up until you have the Magic Carpet in hand. While you're on the site look at the great information in his hints section. -- JohnP
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If you want to get rid of that late game sticking, open the thumb hole up a little more, 1/64" - 1/32", and use a Magic Carpet, as I mentioned earlier. The website is
www.bowl4fun.com
Contact Ron Clifton at the phone number on the website or by e-mail and he'll probably send you one for free, that's how he gets us hooked. Don't open the thumb hole up until you have the Magic Carpet in hand. While you're on the site look at the great information in his hints section. -- JohnP
1. I have same span, well, my cut is at 4 3/8 as the OP.
2. I have forward/side left thumb, reverse fingers
3. I switch from traditional thumb slug to Vise IT. (glad I did)
4. I use Magic Carpet for almost 10 years and I love it....but...
Right now, I'm trying to get used to not using magic carpet, I'm trying different tape combinations and it's not the same. Magic Carpet just allows for good timing and a more relaxed hand. Dan, give MC a try. Hopefully your PSO sells them, it's $2 each.
It sells for $20 for 10 and they go a long way. Now that I have the IT system, I'll have enough for a long while.
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I'll give the Magic Carpet a try soon. Thanks for the suggestion!
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Jay - Why do you want to stop using the MC? -- JohnP
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In order to get the correct span, is it not best to check this with a ball that has a zero pitched thumb?
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Jay - Why do you want to stop using the MC? -- JohnP
I haven't completely stopped. I'm testing the waters without it, but I'm finding it difficult. I'm so used to the feel, fit, and the timing of the MC tape. In fact, last night, I had placed MC tape on my Slug IT for tonight sweepers.
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I just wanted to post an update on this since it's been a while.
I tried using the Magic Carpet, but it just wasn't for me. Could never get used to the feel on the back of my thumb. And even when using it, I still got stuck pretty often.
One thing I've found that has helped is reducing my span by 1/8" with zero pitch in my thumb hole and a good amount of bevel. I think the slightly more relaxed span is helping me to not squeeze the ball during my swing.
The idea of trying a shorter span came to me after open bowling with some friends and having to throw a house ball. When using a conventional grip house ball my thumb never got stuck once. That's when it occurred to me that my span might be a bit too long.
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Keep enlarging the thumbhole and keep moving the pitch to under if you need. Then work on using the base of your thumb to "squeeze the ball" if you need to. Don't try holding the ball with your thumbpad. At some point you will hit a comfort zone. Also, practice holding the ball wt. with your fingers and wrist and less with your thumb.
People who strive to have that "perfect" thumbhole size will usually have some problems in warmer, higher humidity houses.
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As I'm reading this thread from April onward to the present, I keep wanting to say, that possibly not only were your span and your forward/reverse pitches off, but very possibly your left/right pitch was also off. Many times people assume they need no left or right pitch in their thumb, but few people need 0 left/right.
Make sure the left/right pitch, as well as the forward reverse is right for your hand. The fact that 1/8" left pitch started to feel better, makes me think that you might really want to try 1/4" left pitch to see how comfortable that is.
Have you ever gone to a better pro shop, one noted for its ability to do the grip right? That may be THE one most important thing you do in bowling. Just like "you can't outbowl a bad ball reaction," you also can't outbowl a bad grip. Almost every aspect has to be right for most people; a few rare people with a lot of strength AND flexibility can get away with more errors in the fitting. Most of us can't.
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Have you ever gone to a better pro shop, one noted for its ability to do the grip right? That may be THE one most important thing you do in bowling. Just like "you can't outbowl a bad ball reaction," you also can't outbowl a bad grip. Almost every aspect has to be right for most people; a few rare people with a lot of strength AND flexibility can get away with more errors in the fitting. Most of us can't.
I haven't had much luck finding a pro shop that's willing to work with me on this. The first place I went to measured me pretty much by the book and don't seem very willing to try different things. Another place I found does good work, but the guy basically just does whatever I ask him to do. So, I've just been trying different things to see what works. If you can recommend a good driller around Nashville, TN, I'm all ears. :)
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Have you ever gone to a better pro shop, one noted for its ability to do the grip right? That may be THE one most important thing you do in bowling. Just like "you can't outbowl a bad ball reaction," you also can't outbowl a bad grip. Almost every aspect has to be right for most people; a few rare people with a lot of strength AND flexibility can get away with more errors in the fitting. Most of us can't.
I haven't had much luck finding a pro shop that's willing to work with me on this. The first place I went to measured me pretty much by the book and don't seem very willing to try different things. Another place I found does good work, but the guy basically just does whatever I ask him to do. So, I've just been trying different things to see what works. If you can recommend a good driller around Nashville, TN, I'm all ears. :)
If you're in Nashville, you are just a short drive (1.5 to 2 hours) from Huntsville. If you can drive down to the Pin Palace Lanes on north parkway and see Chris in the pro shop there. He's one of the best around and I feel sure he can get you fixed up. Better hurry though cause they will change their hours in a couple of weeks and won't open till late in the afternoon. If you can't get there, go to the Plamor on south parkway and see Bobby. He's also good and they are open pretty much all day. Hope this helps.