Author Topic: Layout problem... is this possible? (Read 1275 times)

lefty50 · « **on:** March 21, 2009, 12:39:10 AM »

Until last year, I could never throw asym equipment. I get a wobble, but nothing. This was true for 4 different balls. Then I saw my pro shop and changed the layout by shortening span and changing pitches. Then, I could throw asym with no problem. Not a monster reaction, but viable... even good, and a different look from my sym equipment.

At that time, my first oil ring was 1 inch from fingers and 1/2 inch from thumb.

I'm left handed, stroker, current PAP 4-7/8 by 7/8.

I stayed with it for 9 months. Although comfortable, the the span felt a little short. Last month I lengthened the span by 1/16th on each fingers and changed thumb slightly from 0 and 1/4 reverse to 1/8 away and 1/4 reverse. I know every change matters, but these were very small comfort changes. I changed everything in all 5 balls after a short test period.

Now, by co-incidence or not, every ball I have, both sym and asym, seem to be low-tracking again. Not a spinner, but a good 2-3 inches from both fingers and thumb. Reaction is down, almost zero, with asym equipment, but still a good reaction with sym equipment.

Question... Could that small layout change affect the asym release that dramatically? Is it co-incidence and perhaps I've developed a delivery problem? Even though I am now a lower track on sym, since I still have a good reaction, should I go back to just throwing sym gear?
Constructive thought appreciated.
Thanks in advance

--------------------
Signature? I don''t need no stinking signature...

tenpinspro · « **Reply #1 on:** March 22, 2009, 10:35:57 AM »

Hey lefty,

This is very possible. Here are some contributing factors that I'm picking up that may be affecting your ball track/roll and/or reaction.

1) On sym balls, our pin placement to pap is the primary key to reaction. The "decent" reaction you're getting is telling me that your pin from pap is at least in a position that is offering you this but may be borderline once your track/pap changes per release change.

2) In regards to the asym pieces, it is "very" crucial where the mass bias placement is in regards to your pap along with the strength of the mb (once at .008 or greater). The higher the mb strength, the more sensitive it becomes to positioning from pap.

3) If your mb is placed very close to your pap/val, this typically will call for an earlier rolling ball in reaction. If your pap changes (such as yours possibly did), the mb can now be past your pap/val which in reaction terms would cause for an even earlier rolling ball but also makes the total ball reaction look very smooth or even. It basically changes ball reaction to where the ball appears to do nothing but roll (not the typical skid/hook/roll effect).

4) The 1/8 left lateral (sorry, forgot you're LH). Completely different answer then. The 1/8 may be allowing you to rotate easier or around the ball. If your track has lowered, you may actually even be topping slightly vs staying behind longer with the zero pitch.

Feel free to pm me cause I have a few questions as well. This is becoming a novel, sorry about that but hope it helps explain some.

On edit: had to correct the answer on the 1/8 left lateral...

Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Tag Team Coaching - Co-Founder
"El" Presidente of the Legion

Edited on 3/22/2009 3:16 PM

TheDude · « **Reply #2 on:** March 23, 2009, 03:46:11 PM »

sounds like you are not able to create as high a track with the shorter span. It might be comfortable but if you throw the ball better, then there is an answer already obviously there.

If you were to stay at your longer span then you should have your pap remeasured. Measuring your layouts on balls that worked with your higher PAP. then taking the same distances on another ball with the longer comfortable span and lower pap and you can produce similar results. It just sounds like you need to go over your layouts again.
--------------------
Timothy @Juniors Pro-Shops
LaSalle, Quebec-Located inside Pont Mercier Lanes.
Edmonton, Alberta. -Located inside Ed's Rec Room.(WEST ED MALL)
Keep them honest!

Ebay store updated very often: http://stores.ebay.com/gumby3170

tenpinspro · « **Reply #3 on:** March 23, 2009, 04:22:30 PM »

quote:
Last month I lengthened the span by 1/16th on each fingers and changed thumb slightly from 0 and 1/4 reverse to 1/8 away and 1/4 reverse.

Ok, lets try this one more time...man, I'm getting old (too many senior moments).

Sorry lefty, I did read it correctly the first time. If you have 1/8 "away", that is right lateral for you so my first reply had the correct answer (before I corrected it, so I thought). Away pitch helps us stay in a ball longer so it can be causing you to hang up as you're trying to rotate back clockwise (around the side). If our wrist is not firm to cupped thru the release point, gravity is pulling ball weight which then pulls our thumb/hand towards the direction of the pitch.

In this case, if the 1/8 away is comfortable, I'd suggest trying a touch more reverse 1/16 to an 1/8 to help you clear your thumb faster and then the hand can rotate in any direction desired and you should be able to return to your higher track.

This stems back to our other post on pitches and the typical release angles associated with those pitches.

http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=230959&ForumID=18&CategoryID=5

Hope this helps some..
--------------------
Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Tag Team Coaching - Co-Founder
"El" Presidente of the Legion

Author Topic: Layout problem... is this possible? (Read 1275 times)

lefty50

Layout problem... is this possible?

tenpinspro

Re: Layout problem... is this possible?

TheDude

Re: Layout problem... is this possible?

tenpinspro

Re: Layout problem... is this possible?