BallReviews
Equipment Boards => DV8 => Topic started by: coasterp on December 06, 2012, 06:55:55 AM
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Purchased a Terror and G/W Misfit to fit into my arsenal. I have found these two balls to be some of the worst rolling pieces I have seen. Both are very over under and this is after numerous surface changes. The couple of times I could actually get a decent reaction out the the misfit, I could only use it for a game. I then had to put it away, as any adjustment I made resulted in the typical over under reaction. Is it just me or have others come across this also? I know there is another thread about an issue the poster had with his terror. I have seen the same thing. I am not having these issues with other simularly drilled balls from other manufacturers. Any feedback is appreciated.
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Purchased a Terror and G/W Misfit to fit into my arsenal. I have found these two balls to be some of the worst rolling pieces I have seen. Both are very over under and this is after numerous surface changes. The couple of times I could actually get a decent reaction out the the misfit, I could only use it for a game. I then had to put it away, as any adjustment I made resulted in the typical over under reaction. Is it just me or have others come across this also? I know there is another thread about an issue the poster had with his terror. I have seen the same thing. I am not having these issues with other simularly drilled balls from other manufacturers. Any feedback is appreciated.
What I have learned with the DV8 balls, is that surface changes need to be drastic. Have a friend who had a Marauder (surface was 500, rough buff, factory finish). Ball was way too squirty on the backend. I had him take the ball and put 1000, rough buff, no factory finish and the ball was easily 5 feet sooner and almost a full arrow worth of more overall hook and no squirt on the backend; very continuous. From what I have seen thus far, most of the balls seem to work best when you can take them to 1000 or 2000 and use rough buff. STAY AWAY from the high gloss polishes if you can because that is what seems to make these balls over/under.
FWIW......I have a Violent Eruption that I just drilled a few weeks ago. Even with my rev rate (500+), the ball at its box finish was pretty squirty in oil. I knocked off the polish completely (used 1000 to get it off) and then took the ball to 2000 and used rough buff instead of a high gloss polish and now the ball is a beast on the backend. Easily my favorite ball right now.
Remember that the DV8 balls were specifically designed for backend because customers wanted something from "Brunswick" that was not rolly; instead something with a sharper backend. So....these balls can be prone to over/under with the wrong surface and/or layout.
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I have had both bowling balls drilled the same as well pin under bridge cg swung out on both PAP 4 11/16 1/2 up speed is 19mph. With the misfit I didn’t like it out of box for me the reaction was either to late or to sharp. I went through several surface changes as well 360 (this worked great of course you cannot use it that long but very smooth) 500 (the motion stayed smooth and continuous not sharp of course early if you are in the dirt and will not recover in too much oil) 800 (Very good reaction almost left it like this) 1000 (very smooth no over under not to sharp not to late just right I keep this ball at 1000 and maybe twice a month I hit it with 1000). I found that the ball will give you a few different reads but we have to understand this is a med/lt to light oil ball. I have seen people make it look better then high end bowling balls but then again Rev rate, layout, hand position all play a huge part. I would say step back and find out what you want the ball to do and on what lane condition what situation and go from there.
The Terror I understand you have to play around with the drill a bit (That is not something that’s easy to do) the terror can easily be over under. For me the key for the terror to be successful look at a layout that best suites the lane condition you are trying to tackle and then after that play around with the surface sometime we look for a ball to do what we want but did we help the ball with how it is laid out and surface prep.
As far as my success with the Terror I left it at box finish after going through different surface changes, I just had to know when that wasn't the ball to use, that reaction (like many pearl pieces) can be to sharp of the spot and slide through the break point.
I am no professional in knowing bowling balls by far this is just my opinion and what has worked for me.
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I knocked the polish off of all my DV8's, everything comes shiny and that is not necessarily the ideal grit for everybody. The DV8 stuff just naturally pushes longer than Brunswick with a much more aggressive move off of the dry.
I track low and like to play inside so 500, 2000 is a happy surface for me especially on my Misfit.
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I haven't had much luck with my Terror either. From the reviews I thought I would be stronger. It seems like when the back ends are clean which is not that often the ball will carry alright for me but not that backend I was hoping for. When the lanes
Transisition the ball needs to be high flush to carry for me . Granted I don't have 400 revs but I was hoping for a little stronger ball. I don't get drier conditions that often. I am going to try putting another hole in it to see if that helps and if it doesn't help I'll sell it and get a Brunswick Aura.
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Thanks kong. You are the one I spoke about in regard to the terror. At this point, I'm going to hang on to the both of them. They will only be used when I go to practice though. With the way they roll, they kind of create a tournament condition out of a house shot. Makes for a good practice session. I'll just leave them home when I do go to a tournament, as I don't think they are worth hauling along.
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The Reckless and Too reckless at box finish I loved. My first Misfit (orange/blue) was drilled pin down 70x5.25x60 with a p3 x-hole and the ball was extremely strong. Way too much ball for the price point. If was very clean through the front of the lane and extremely angular down lane. I ended up using a 2000 pad to knock the shine off and it helped but it was still a lot more ball then I was looking for.
On my second Misfit (green/white) I went with a pin up 70x5x30 and left the ball at box finish with no x-hole. The ball gives me the length I like with a hard reving down lane reaction and a lot of hook. More controllable then the first misfit I had.(still very strong)
I will eventually be getting a Terror because of it being a lighter oil ball then the rest of the HR series it will fit my style a little better for playing on the right side of the lane. A friend of mine loves his Terror. Says it is very similar to his Nexxxus f(P+S) only not as angular off the spot.
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I had a marauder and posted something very similar to this. I did extreme surface work to it and that night went out and shot 814 with it so yes take the polish off of these balls then try them.
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don't buy junk that is made in Mexico.
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don't buy junk that is made in Mexico.
Based on the number I've been seeing crack lately, I would agree with that. There is also a ton of seconds on ebay. Other brands don't seem to have that issue. I'm wondering if this is why some people love the DV8 stuff while others say they are not happy. I'm thinking something is happening during manufacturing.
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A big prob with Dv8 and Bruns. balls coming from mexico is the pin and mass bias are miss marked. Make sure your pro shop guy has a Determinator machine that finds the true mass bias of every ball. I have been using mostly bruns. and dv8 and some off the balls were way off on pin location and or mass bias mark. This would be huge when it comes time to put your favorite drill pattern on a ball. This is what happens when you pay someone 25 cents an hr . to work
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Just buy ROTO GRIP and you will be happy.
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Wow, again with the libel.
First off, I don't see any 2nds on ebay as claimed.
Our pins and mass bias are not mis marked, and our warranty rate (even with an unmatched 2 YEAR warranty) is a fraction of a percent.
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My buddies love theirs...i dont have one yet...cuz i usually side with storm and roto...but the masses are digging dv8, the price is lower, there is a 2 year warranty...and the shelf appeal is through the roof..what more do you want? I see great quality control thats only improving over time.
I get a bad ball match up every now and then...for example EVERYONE loved the marvel pearl...i completely sucked with it. I had 5 300s with the solid....nothing over a 240 with the pearl lol...bad match up.
i would get a dv8 but then id make my buddies look bad haha just kidding haha
im always a fan of oob and wearing it in using it on the apropriate condition instead of changing it to be soething its not...but thats me.
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I think that DV8 stuff looks awesome. I would totally put holes in a couple of them. I didn't match up with Brunswick stuff at all, so I would like to see how the DV8 stuff rolls. If surface changes are what is needed, so be it. I know that on all the pearl balls I drill out of SA, I have to break the surface and repolish them.
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Wow, again with the libel.
First off, I don't see any 2nds on ebay as claimed.
Our pins and mass bias are not mis marked, and our warranty rate (even with an unmatched 2 YEAR warranty) is a fraction of a percent.
They do not list them as 2nds in the listing header. However, once you open the listing and read, they are clearly listed as seconds, thankfully due to honest sellers. I could have kept going but here is a few to see:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRUNSWICK-Nexus-f-P-Pearl-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-259-BRAND-NEW-IN-BOX-/300838524590?pt=Bowling&hash=item460b5f96ae
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRUNSWICK-Nexus-f-P-F-Solid-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-259-BRAND-NEW-BALL-IN-BOX-/300838525234?pt=Bowling&hash=item460b5f9932
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRUNSWICK-Nexus-f-P-Pearl-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-259-BRAND-NEW-IN-BOX-/290837909355?pt=Bowling&hash=item43b74a4f6b
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DV8-MISFIT-GREEN-WHITE-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-BRAND-NEW-IN-BOX-/290838246301?pt=Bowling&hash=item43b74f739d
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DV8-HELL-RAISER-REVENGE-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-269-BRAND-NEW-BALL-IN-BOX-/300840705579?pt=Bowling&hash=item460b80de2b
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DV8-Marauder-Hybrid-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-199-NEW-IN-BOX-/290838804732?pt=Bowling&hash=item43b757f8fc
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Wow, again with the libel.
First off, I don't see any 2nds on ebay as claimed.
Our pins and mass bias are not mis marked, and our warranty rate (even with an unmatched 2 YEAR warranty) is a fraction of a percent.
They do not list them as 2nds in the listing header. However, once you open the listing and read, they are clearly listed as seconds, thankfully due to honest sellers. I could have kept going but here is a few to see:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRUNSWICK-Nexus-f-P-Pearl-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-259-BRAND-NEW-IN-BOX-/300838524590?pt=Bowling&hash=item460b5f96ae
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRUNSWICK-Nexus-f-P-F-Solid-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-259-BRAND-NEW-BALL-IN-BOX-/300838525234?pt=Bowling&hash=item460b5f9932
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRUNSWICK-Nexus-f-P-Pearl-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-259-BRAND-NEW-IN-BOX-/290837909355?pt=Bowling&hash=item43b74a4f6b
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DV8-MISFIT-GREEN-WHITE-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-BRAND-NEW-IN-BOX-/290838246301?pt=Bowling&hash=item43b74f739d
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DV8-HELL-RAISER-REVENGE-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-269-BRAND-NEW-BALL-IN-BOX-/300840705579?pt=Bowling&hash=item460b80de2b
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DV8-Marauder-Hybrid-BOWLING-ball-14-lb-199-NEW-IN-BOX-/290838804732?pt=Bowling&hash=item43b757f8fc
BOOOOOOOM
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OK, I see it.
Looks like the seller has 2nds from many different companies.
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For the record I'm not knocking Bruns. Just talking fact from my ball driller that balls coming from mexico are notorious for being mis marked. more so than the ones coming from the U.S. All I use is Bruns. Aura, Nexus, Marauder Mad., Versa Max, Diamondback. They Are the best balls for my game. I have never had a quality issue with brunswick dating back to my scorchin inferno and all the way back to my LT48. My Diamondbacks pin was mis marked by about an inch and a half. I am not a ball driller but I assume this would make a big diff. if he didn't catch it with the Determanator
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The arrow is only as good as the indian shotting it.
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Thank you for your support, glad you like your stuff. :)
For what it's worth, a DeTerminator can only locate the mass bias of a ball. On a symmetric core ball, the "6 3/4 rule" is not always true if he's trying to measure back to find the Low RG (pin). It can range anywhere from 5.5-7" depending on the core shape and pin distance on an undrilled ball. Sometimes, a ball will never stabilize when spun.
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I can appreciate people not liking a particular ball, and sometimes, even a brand... It happens. As a DV8 staffer, I'm sure people will view my opinion as leaning, but bad ball reaction is dictated by one major factor... Using it under the wrong circumstances. That is accentuated by a layout/surface combination that is so poor, that it requires the most random sequence of conditions for it to function at a higher level than something else in your bag. It likely has VERY LITTLE to do with the ball itself. It is a combination of factors that make up bad ball reaction. A good pro shop person should be able to cure the problem. And that goes for any major ball brand and their bowling balls. Man, it bugs me to no end when people rail on a ball of any brand as a "Bad Ball." It is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO much more complicated than the ball. It happens all the time at league and I spend a few minutes helping them and they can start to see the reasons why the ball reaction hasn't been to their liking.
For years before I was on as advisory staff to Brunswick/DV8, I worked in and was sponsored by a pro shop and I threw everything at the pins. I threw Storm, Columbia, Hammer, Mo Rich, Track... You name it, I threw it.. (Except Lanemasters. LOL).
Anyways, my job was to get a read on the equipment so the right balls would match up to what a customer was seeking. And here's what I learned about the bowling ball business...
If your pro shop guy doesn't take a moment to get to know their customer, their ball roll, and their needs on the lanes they compete on, then you are getting at best, an uneducated guesstimate likely based off of some other information that might not even be reliable or current. Most really good pro shop people are going to sell and drill a ball to precisely fit that bowlers needs and desires. So many bowlers these days want that "Magic Ball" that works on everything... IT DOESN'T EXIST.
In today's game, you can not just pick up a ball, drill it over the bridge, under the bridge, or leverage and expect success. Bad ball reaction is dictated by one major factor... Using it under the wrong circumstances. Carry is not dictated by the ball, but by entry angle. Entry angle is dictated by playing the lanes right. And it's all magnified by using a bowling ball designed and drilled to function at it's best in the right playing environment. You don't see dudes hitting wedge off the teebox on a 4oo yard par 4. I guess since bowling balls are all the same size, they should all work on everything?
As for quality... I have never had a quality issue with any Brunswick or DV8 ball. Ever. I have been exclusively throwing it for roughly 4 years at this point Maybe 30 balls or more. Now throwing 100% DV8. People will argue it's made in Mexico, yet it has one of the best warranties out there. This thread started out regarding ball reaction on two particular balls and somehow manifests into a discussion about Mexican made. Unreal. Interestingly enough, I haven't had a quality issue with any other brand either in the past, but none of them offer the warranty you get with DV8/Brunswick. Then again, I take pretty good care of my stuff.
DV8 balls have worked very great for me. You can read all of my reviews and in most I try to give an optimum condition for the ball in comparison to others. They are flashy, colorful, stand out, and have provided me a great variety of ball reactions so I can be competitive on any condition. I have very little axis rotation and so the length built into the balls has really been a benefit to me. However, I know when the Revenge came out, the ball hooked at my feet with the box finish. We did a little surface adjustment and it's become one of my best rolling balls on tougher patterns that require I get a good early roll going or for a more typicaly heavy oil pattern. The G/W Misfit is very strong off the friction and although it is advertised at entry level, is significantly stronger than other entry level equipment. On a traditional house shot, the G/W Misfit should be plenty of ball, but you have to be careful with any ball designed for maximum length and strong sharp movement off friction as it's going to give you an over/under reaction if you let it store all that axis rotation for the end of the pattern. I've been able to stay right longer and play much closer to the Friction (or even in the friction) with the G/W ball and the reaction has been very even and controllable. I've used it so much in league, others in the league expect are calling it the Green Monster because I shoot very big scores with it and it's bright freakin green. When I get left and try to play in the oil, I can create an over/under reaction just like the topic starter. If playing left in the oil is necessary, I would use a stronger ball. In this original users case, he has two very long and strong balls including the Terror, which are likely accentuating the problem he's having. Cover changes may help, but I don't think they need to be significant. Too much surface can kill a ball reaction too and can counteract the layout. The best advice I can give it to go and find a very knowledgable bowler / pro shop guy and go practice one day and fiddle around with surfaces to see if you can create the reaction you desire. Maybe drill an axis hole to increase flare. Just remember, once you leave that bowling center and that pattern, what you encounter in another center might require additional surface maintenance. Surface accounts for over 50% of the balls reaction. The other 50% is dicatated by cover/core/layout. You can get plastic to hook at your feet if you put enough grit on it. lol. Otherwise, you can also get a 2nd opinion on the layout from another pro shop in the area. Sometimes, a very poor layout can kill a very good bowling ball.
The Terror and G/W Misfit are very long and angular and this will accentuate the Over/Under Reaction you are referring to. You can reduce that by taking the cover down a bit or playing closer to the friction so the core of the ball will begin to migrate sooner. You can also have your pro shop guy drill them to enter into the roll phase sooner so they settle down before they get to the backend of the lane. Some of this can be done with an Axis hole in the right spot. Many different options to get your money's worth out of the equipment.
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I can understand where staffers and Bruns employee's are coming from BUT on the other hand most of us BR regulars who are NOT affiliated with any manufacturer and would like to hear from other BR users who have no axe to grind.
Case being most would not say when that have had issues negative or otherwise. I was shot down on some new VBP pieces and heard from the VBP crew I wasn't positive enough....sorry I tell it like I see it. Like it or not.
On the other hand, those that come on BR hiding behind a keyboard without any real info. other than that they have an axe to grind screw them also. :)
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A big prob with Dv8 and Bruns. balls coming from mexico is the pin and mass bias are miss marked. I have been using mostly bruns. and dv8 and some off the balls were way off on pin location and or mass bias mark.
How can a pin be mismarked? If I'm not mistaken, the pin isn't "marked." Its attached to the core because it's the hole through which they pour material?
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Yes seconds are available from anyone.
Boom would be appropriate when you over charge for them and call them pro pin and pro cg balls. They are blems not meeting 1st run quality for one reason or another. It is good to see someone get good customer service even if they dont contact the manufacture directly. Cant say that for every company.
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Rocker,
Only if you knew how a pin could be mismarked. Find some threads years ago when Brunswick poured Lane 1 balls in Michigan....
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The pin is the fill they use to fill the void where the hanger for weight block was during pouring of the ball. The pin is ( Suppose to be on the top of the weight block ) Sometimes that doesn't work out.
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@ Andyman3333, well said and a very good read!
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Wow, again with the libel.
First off, I don't see any 2nds on ebay as claimed.
Our pins and mass bias are not mis marked, and our warranty rate (even with an unmatched 2 YEAR warranty) is a fraction of a percent.
Wanted to comment on this while i remember, friend of mine bought a dv8 hellraiser revenge. Hated the layout on it so he had it plugged and redrilled. Well long story short, somehow the core is seperated. Was making a really funny sound when it would hit the pins. The guy that plugged and redrilled it is a brunswick staffer and told him there is nothing they can do, then when he called dv8 they apparently cant do anything either. Why is this?
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The biggest thing with dv8 is that i haven't seen that one ball that is good in nearly everyones hands. I've seen a lot of them look good in peoples hands and I've seen a lot of them look bad.....which is typical of most companies but the thing that gets these companies ahead is getting that ball that matches up to so many people it can't be ignored. A ball like the iq tour, hyroad or versa max....etc...
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Jonesy, once you plug a ball, it is not under warranty any longer.
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This is just coming from your average house hack with no skin in the game. I am not loyal to any particular ball company. I have hammer,columbia,storm and dv8 in my bag. I bought the reckless at the end of last year and this for me has been the best bowling ball I have ever owned. I just match up with it I guess. I bowled my first 800 with this ball, and I am averaging higher this year than I ever have. The last 2 weeks I have bowled a 298,and 290 which I have never had in back to back weeks.I will absolutly be getting another one. Any suggestions from the Dv8 crowd?
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@Tim, if I were you, I might hold out until the release of the Brutal Nightmare. As it looks to be a monster. It appears that it is going to work extremely well on typical house conditions. I should get mine in a few days and can let you know. It will be stronger than your reckless so will allow you to maybe open up the lane a little and then as they break down, go back down to the reckless. Whatever you do, you should try to find something to compliment your existing arsenal so you have a wide variety of reactions to cover a variety of conditions. This will elevate your game (or at least your equipment) from that of an average house hack as you so eliquently put it.
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Thanks Andy. I was looking for something a little stronger to go with the reckless.
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Jonesy, once you plug a ball, it is not under warranty any longer.
I already know that. I was asking the brunswick rep what my friend should do. The ball never made the sound until it was plugged then suddly the core separates and its not the pro shops fault? hmm... thats why was asking the brunswick rep
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Once a ball is plugged, a lot of things could happen out of our control. The plug could have cured too fast, too hot, created stress cracks inside, who knows to be sure.
When I worked in pro shops and saw separated cores, more often than not you could blow into the thumb hole and feel it come out of the fingers or weight hole. I would then mix more plug and pour it down the hatch and let the core rebond itself.
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What i see as a proshop owner is that, the DV8 and Brunswick balls needs to have stronger layouts than EBI and Storm/Roto.
It might be due to the length build into te cover. But a good 1" inch shorter pin to pap and they behave better.
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Could very well be the case, the covers are a lot cleaner and more responsive downlane than in years past.
I'm sure in other parts of the country someone sees it different and drills them weaker. Strange world of bowling I tell ya!
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I just recently drilled my first DV8 ball (coincidentally a Terror) having used Brunswick, AMF and 900Global for the last 5 years. My PAP is 5 across by 3/8 up, speed 17mph at 275rpm. We are currently using Kegel Boardwalk for the singles league I bowl in. The Terror is drilled 70 x 3 x 40 with a hole next to the MB. cover left in box condition. I am a 53 year old lefty.
On that pattern the Terror gives me easy length but the strongest backend motion I have encountered in a ball, bar none! My only carry issue was a couple of 4 pins (!!!!) from half pocket. Now, at my rev rate, that should never happen, but it has the strongest backend motion of any ball I have ever thrown.
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Half pocket 4 pins for a lefty... wow! That's a right turn and a half lol
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Especially for a fluffer like me.
I had to wait 2 games to use it (4 game series) until the backend had mellowed out a little. Prior to that I used an Aftermath drilled at 45 x 1 x 45 (weak drill strong cover option).
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Further to the previous, I used the Terror in my doubles league on Kegel Beaten Path (AMF Golden Grove house shot) last night shooting 748. The interesting thing was, that for the first time in my 34 year career, I had 100% carry percentage from pocket hits (26/34). THe only times I didn't strike was when I missed the pocket. The only over/under was created by my own mistakes.
So yeah, I can safely say this one is a keeper.
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i have not thrown a dv8 so this is just off of watching a couple of friends of mine who bowl alot like me. i did see a little over under. however, i have found that you need to match up to a ball. I like throwing roto grip, but not so much storm. i only use two main balls right now a defiant soul, and a dark star. I tried a brunswick ball, the c system ball that is all black, don't remember. My pro shop guy, who i totally trust, told me not to buy the ball because it would not match up, but i thought i knew better and bought and drilled it. i threw 40 or so games and just did not get any carry, or any good consistant roll with it. is it the ball's fault? don't think so, as my pro said, i just did not match up to what the ball does well. i gave it to a kid in the jr's program who loves it.
i don't like that people bash a ball. figure out what works for you and what doesn't and stick with it. just my two cents
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i have not thrown a dv8 so this is just off of watching a couple of friends of mine who bowl alot like me. i did see a little over under. however, i have found that you need to match up to a ball. I like throwing roto grip, but not so much storm. i only use two main balls right now a defiant soul, and a dark star. I tried a brunswick ball, the c system ball that is all black, don't remember. My pro shop guy, who i totally trust, told me not to buy the ball because it would not match up, but i thought i knew better and bought and drilled it. i threw 40 or so games and just did not get any carry, or any good consistant roll with it. is it the ball's fault? don't think so, as my pro said, i just did not match up to what the ball does well. i gave it to a kid in the jr's program who loves it.
i don't like that people bash a ball. figure out what works for you and what doesn't and stick with it. just my two cents
Your need to match up to a ball is directly related to your pro shop's knowledge and capabilities as an operator to understand and apply modern techniques to putting three or more holes in a ball.
If they don't know what they are doing then the chances of you matching up to any particular ball are greatly reduced.
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i would totally agree. that is why he is such a good pro shop guy. i average around 200 in multiple leagues, i have won the city tournament scratch singles last year and this one, and this year will win scratch all events. evidently, the guy knows what balls to put me in.
don't get me wrong, we have a lot of guys who throw Brunswick/dv8 including the pro himself. he knows the look i want to see on the lanes, knows how i throw and is pretty much right on in his selections of balls and the layouts that will and do work for me, as evidence shows