Post by: charlest on November 13, 2006, 05:46:24 AM
Is the Threshold's "NexGen Reactive w/MicroParticles" considered to be a Soaker coverstock?
I sure hope so. Just threw a few games on medium oil with either a slightly longer than average pattern (or slightly heavier oil in the heads), after sanding the stock one to 2000 grit, with an Abralon pad. It hardly ever made the turn, playing a slight swing (16/17 at arrows, out to 8/9 at breakpoint), that (theoreticallY) milder balls had no trouble making. Threw a sheen finish solid particle and polished solid resin, both of which hooked more and more consistently.
So I'm praying this ball needs some "break-in" like all Soakers ....
(I sanded it from its base 1000 grit, because when I tried it at another house, also with medium oil with a heavier dose in the heads on Anvillanes synthetics, it made an uncontrollable left turn.)
Post by: boomtown24 on November 13, 2006, 01:47:48 PM
Post by: legend4life95 on November 13, 2006, 02:28:53 PM
I also found the Threshold to be VERY strong OOB and had to have plenty oil to use it. I figured I would play with the cover some and see what happens.
I first took it to 1500 sheen with Tracks Clean N Smooth. It gave it more length and tamed down the backend a bit. It was ok, but I was curious to see what other surfaces would do. I took it to 2000 abralon and it made it a semi-mild medium oiler. 4000 abralon just pretty much killed it. I took it back to 800(grey pad) and added a coat of Brunswick Factory Finish and it made it more skid flippy. I liked the reaction because it looked good, however I could not control the break. I tend to need more dull balls because of side roll so it will read earlier and smooth out the break a little. I ended up going back to OOB with it and just using it on what it was intended for. It seems to give the best reaction OOB for me. 800 dull.
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****Kids in the back seat cause accidents; accidents in the back seat cause kids.****
Post by: 230-n-up-or-bust on November 13, 2006, 02:36:14 PM
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Save this site's bandwidth. Don't write a novel. Please keep your signature to a minimum.
Post by: 230-n-up-or-bust on November 13, 2006, 02:38:03 PM
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Post by: shelley on November 13, 2006, 02:46:23 PM
SH
Post by: legend4life95 on November 13, 2006, 03:07:25 PM
quote:
I think it's burning up. Most of the posts about it say nothing but how strong it is and how much oil it requires.
It is very strong OOB, but at 2000 grit on medium oil I don't think it would burn up. Unless the heads are lighter or burned up. It needs head oil for sure.
--------------------
****Kids in the back seat cause accidents; accidents in the back seat cause kids.****
Edited on 11/13/2006 3:59 PM
Post by: 102101 on November 13, 2006, 04:50:10 PM
read what new guy says in his response. Not sure what to make of it.
Hope this helps.
http://www.ballreviews.com/Forum/Replies.asp?TopicID=142414&ForumID=14&CategoryID=2
--------------------
102101? Hmmmm
Dyno-Thane Soaking up the competition
www.blackhawklanes.com
Post by: shelley on November 13, 2006, 05:23:02 PM
quote:
Hi guys I just found this one the Track forum you might want to
read what new guy says in his response. Not sure what to make of it.
Hope this helps.
Not particle but is Soaker. Kinda goes against what's been said in the past. DT's own website says particle pearl.
SH
Post by: charlest on November 13, 2006, 05:31:16 PM
quote:quote:
Hi guys I just found this one the Track forum you might want to
read what new guy says in his response. Not sure what to make of it.
Hope this helps.
Not particle but is Soaker. Kinda goes against what's been said in the past. DT's own website says particle pearl.
SH
You found something of interest, Shelley. Phil said:
"Remember the Threshold is not a particle ball but uses the soaker cover."
Phil (or other guy),
If you read this, can we get a clarification? The D/T website says it's a particle pearl, with no mention of it being a Soaker.
Are your comments in that Track thread correct or is the D/T website correct?
Thanks.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Edited on 11/13/2006 6:28 PM
Post by: 102101 on November 13, 2006, 05:35:07 PM
the Threshold be a pearl particle soaker?
Maybe the "NexGen Reactive w/MicroParticles" is a new version of Soaker?
Just speculating and hoping here.
--------------------
102101? Hmmmm
Dyno-Thane Soaking up the competition
www.blackhawklanes.com
Post by: bamaster on November 13, 2006, 07:41:00 PM
We can wait for him to chime in and correct himself or the ball ad.
--------------------
Tony
My Bowling Classifieds (http://"http://www.allbowling.com/classifieds/showcat.php?cat=500&ppuser=3")
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Post by: crankncrash on November 13, 2006, 09:50:21 PM
quote:
(I sanded it from its base 1000 grit, because when I tried it at another house, also with medium oil with a heavier dose in the heads on Anvillanes synthetics, it made an uncontrollable left turn.)
I think you answered your own problems right there without knowing. The OOB surface got you a strong reaction. Sanding it, as I'm sure you know, offers more chance to bleed energy and is causing it to burn up on lighter shots. It has seemed to be to be nothing short of an oil HOG from the ones I've seen.
O and I don't know or care what the cover is, it works
Post by: shelley on November 13, 2006, 10:33:59 PM
quote:
Shelley if the ZR40 is a pearl reactive soaker couldn't
the Threshold be a pearl particle soaker?
Maybe the "NexGen Reactive w/MicroParticles" is a new version of Soaker?
Just speculating and hoping here.
If you're asking whether they could make a particle pearl Soaker ball, then sure. I don't see why not. The Pure Energy was a particle ball, the only particle Soaker that comes to mind. There have been several pearlized and solid/pearl blends Soakers (Thing, AU79, CM, High Energy).
But I remember seeing one of the guys say that it was not a Soaker ball but that the next high-end ball would be (Ne10).
I agree that Phil's off his rocker. He forgot to take the Track hat off and put the DT hat back on.
SH
Post by: charlest on November 14, 2006, 06:21:58 AM
quote:quote:
(I sanded it from its base 1000 grit, because when I tried it at another house, also with medium oil with a heavier dose in the heads on Anvillanes synthetics, it made an uncontrollable left turn.)
I think you answered your own problems right there without knowing. The OOB surface got you a strong reaction. Sanding it, as I'm sure you know, offers more chance to bleed energy and is causing it to burn up on lighter shots. It has seemed to be to be nothing short of an oil HOG from the ones I've seen.
SOrry, crankncrash, but yo umissed something. I sanded it finer. I took the stock finish (I had said it was 1000 grit, but now I think it is 800 grit) and sanded it to 2000 grit. That can't make it grabbier; it adds more length. It should bleed less energy.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: crankncrash on November 14, 2006, 02:51:59 PM
quote:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(I sanded it from its base 1000 grit, because when I tried it at another house, also with medium oil with a heavier dose in the heads on Anvillanes synthetics, it made an uncontrollable left turn.)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you answered your own problems right there without knowing. The OOB surface got you a strong reaction. Sanding it, as I'm sure you know, offers more chance to bleed energy and is causing it to burn up on lighter shots. It has seemed to be to be nothing short of an oil HOG from the ones I've seen.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SOrry, crankncrash, but yo umissed something. I sanded it finer. I took the stock finish (I had said it was 1000 grit, but now I think it is 800 grit) and sanded it to 2000 grit. That can't make it grabbier; it adds more length. It should bleed less energy.
Yes sir, I stand corrected. I did mis-read that. So to that end I will say that I have no clue, but I would continue to play with the surface a bit and maybe not judge it soley on its performance for the first few attempts with it. I've had balls that I hated for a while and all of a sudden fell in love with, go figure.
Post by: tekneek on November 14, 2006, 03:00:47 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Post by: charlest on November 14, 2006, 04:28:38 PM
quote:
Yes sir, I stand corrected. I did mis-read that. So to that end I will say that I have no clue, but I would continue to play with the surface a bit and maybe not judge it soley on its performance for the first few attempts with it. I've had balls that I hated for a while and all of a sudden fell in love with, go figure.
No offense intended. I've done that more times than I care to admit.
For whatever it's worth, the D/T website actually said sand it to 2000 grit to make it work on medium oil. Since I have quite average "hand" by most standards, maybe the oil amount/pattern I thought was medium+ was closer to medium heavy in length and/or amount.
I have changed the cover to approximate 1500 grit and will try it at my next practice opportunity.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: charlest on November 14, 2006, 04:32:15 PM
quote:
the cover is not Soaker, rather an inovative blend of reactive solid and pearl mix with ib-tw particles otherwise know as micro particles, almost said something else, that would have been a big no-no.
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Solid/pearl blends are an old Phil/Track trick which has worked wonders on many balls. Phil and Bill seem to be continuing that pattern here at D/T with the Thing, the 44 Magnum (I believe) and many others in between. I've been quit elucky with my use of them so far. Maybe it will continue with this one.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: tekneek on November 14, 2006, 06:00:04 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Edited on 11/14/2006 6:53 PM
Post by: tekneek on November 17, 2006, 05:46:30 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Post by: charlest on November 17, 2006, 08:04:34 PM
I modified the cover back down to 1200 grit, from 2000 grit, but didn't use it in league because I didn't want to waste the scores (could have after all was said and done); so I used my Big Kahuna. Will test the modified Threshold on Monday or Tuesday.
Edited on 11/20/2006 1:55 PM
Post by: bigearv14 on November 18, 2006, 05:25:08 AM
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When having trouble, just throw it harder!!!
Post by: tekneek on November 19, 2006, 09:42:36 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Post by: charlest on November 20, 2006, 01:04:47 PM
I would have expected such a difference between 600 grit and maybe 4000 grit, not between 800, 1200 and 2000 grit.
Nice thing was once it hit the dry, the ball never overreacted, but it was not a continuous hook/backend either. I tried 2 releases: my standard one and one with much more revs and more tilt. The 2nd one, of course, got a much more significant ball reaction and I had to stand 6/8 boards deeper.
A 2nd good thing was that because the ball didn't overeact, with my first release, and a tiny bit of added ball speed, I could play an outside line, standing 19/20, laying down around 12/13 at the foul line playing a breakpoint of around 3/4. This, I liked a lot. My normal line at this house is standing 25-30 (depending on the oil and the ball I have in hand) and sending it out to 7/8 at breakpoint.
One not so nice thing was once the ball sniffed dry, it made a quite sudden move but that may be more a result of the MB being 4" from my PAP. Pin is also at 4" but just outside the ring finger. This is a very strong drill for me. I did it because I haven't had a lot of luck with asymmetric balls.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: thirtyclean on November 20, 2006, 01:27:18 PM
your style and speed, but this ball hooked from day
one on any condtion, in box finish, then I took it to 2000
abralon, shot 300 with that surface, and it remains at
that surface. There was no breakin period for this ball.
This ball did not even show any burn-up, even with my
15mph average speed. I just kept going left on the
approach. Now, the drilling I have is a 4 X 4 with the
pin 1 inch above the finger, and 1/2 inch over to the
right. The best ball I have thrown in awhile !
--------------------
Thirtyclean (Well maybe 29, or 28, most of
the times !)
Post by: charlest on November 20, 2006, 02:01:57 PM
quote:
I do not know what conditions you are throwing, nor
your style and speed,
Style and speed is in profile. I've ramped down my revs to better coordinate with my lower ball speed, but sometimes I have to invoke my old game, now my "B" game, as mentioned above.
Oil is probably medium-heavy on Brunswick Anvillanes, but the oil is not what it used to be - some new type. It breaks down very suddenly and you have to move 5 boards deeper in one frame, almost like the old Guardian overlays.
quote:
but this ball hooked from day
one on any condtion, in box finish,
as already mentioned stock, 800 grit, was too strong and too early.
quote:
then I took it to 2000
abralon, shot 300 with that surface, and it remains at
that surface. There was no breakin period for this ball.
This ball did not even show any burn-up, even with my
15mph average speed. I just kept going left on the
approach. Now, the drilling I have is a 4 X 4 with the
pin 1 inch above the finger, and 1/2 inch over to the
right. The best ball I have thrown in awhile !
--------------------
Thirtyclean (Well maybe 29, or 28, most of
the times !)
Glad you had no problems with it.
Not sure if I need break-in or have to get used to it or what. It was better today, but not what I'd want such a ball to be ... yet.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: 230-n-up-or-bust on November 20, 2006, 02:10:31 PM
--------------------
Save this site's bandwidth. Don't write a novel. Please keep your signature to a minimum.
Post by: scotts33 on November 20, 2006, 02:41:28 PM
--------------------
Scott
Post by: 230-n-up-or-bust on November 20, 2006, 02:49:11 PM
quote:
I've heard 230's ball speed is cannon like.
--------------------
Scott
I'm not too sure about cannon-like. Only around 17.2-17.6 MPH. Enough to get by!
--------------------
Save this site's bandwidth. Don't write a novel. Please keep your signature to a minimum.
Post by: tekneek on November 20, 2006, 10:01:08 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Post by: charlest on November 21, 2006, 04:24:35 PM
quote:
Scott most old men can wing a 12 pounder, the secret is in the carry of the "Hell-o Kitty" ball 230 rockets down lane. The first time 230 threw it the kitty lost all its fuzz.
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
Steve,
Surprised you had not comment on my next test with the threshold ...
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"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: 230-n-up-or-bust on November 21, 2006, 10:47:10 PM
quote:quote:
Scott most old men can wing a 12 pounder, the secret is in the carry of the "Hell-o Kitty" ball 230 rockets down lane. The first time 230 threw it the kitty lost all its fuzz.
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
Steve,
Surprised you had not comment on my next test with the threshold ...
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
So, out with it.
How did it go?
--------------------
Save this site's bandwidth. Don't write a novel. Please keep your signature to a minimum.
Post by: tekneek on November 21, 2006, 10:51:28 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"
Post by: charlest on November 22, 2006, 06:33:08 PM
quote:
I've held back to see what others have had to say before jumping in. As you probably already know, basic rule of thumb is for every 100 grit 1 foot of length. Now from day to day I would not think the lanes would change or the shot would, unless the lane machine is not putting out the same pattern or consistant volume. My first question is what are your finish weights finger to thumb, side and top to bottom?
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
Every 100 grit is 1 ft longer??
Sorry, never heard that one. So, going from 600 to 1000 grit gets you 4 ft more length? Hmmm.
I went for 800 grit (stock) to 2000 grit and seemed to get a lot more length than that. Then I went from 2000 down to 1200 grit and got the needed midlane read.
I'm fairly certain the lanes I tried it on, this Monday and last Monday were fairly close, as it was the same day of the week, same time of day and the exact same pair in the same house. I brought other balls to compare; so their reaction was more my gauge of what I was on. That made me fairly positive of what I was seeing. I rarely post any observances unless I am close to being 100% positive of what I had seen.
--------------------
"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Post by: tekneek on November 22, 2006, 07:07:24 PM
--------------------
Steve
Leading Edge Pro Shop
512-755-2947
e-mail tekneek@281.com
www.dynothane.com
D/T Customer Service 1-877-828-7177
Use option #1.
Capt Ramius "Vasili, give me one ping, and one ping only"