Post by: Jeffrevs on December 07, 2003, 11:17:38 PM
I'd like this ball to be my control ball,......something that would even everything out when things get squirrely,...smooth, but not weak.....make sense?
Go ahead Sawheads, lay it out for me !
Do I go CG kicked right, label,.....talk to me
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: Saw Mill on December 08, 2003, 02:21:57 PM
I am not too familiar with the PP, but if you e-mail doug sterner at dougsproshop@aol.com he is VERY familiar with it. He could give you some really good info for you to consider. He liked his Pro Purple, and would know what to do. My "humble opinion" would be to go with a pin axis drilling for calmness and control, and CG near the palm, but that is an opinion
Dave
--------------------
If You Are Not Using a BuzzSaw, All You Get is SAW-dusted!!
Edited on 12/8/2003 3:22 PM
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 02:28:28 PM
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: A_P_K on December 08, 2003, 02:32:00 PM
Speak with Charlest about this, he owned at least two of these and gave me a pamphlet on long pin lay outs.
If not PM T-GOD and he will definitely tell you how to layout the ball, or I could email you the notes he PMed me about this ball. It's up to you but I'll need you're email if you want me to send them.
--------------------
"It is Origin...the pure embodiment of power!"
Pin_Krusher IS a serious threat to modern day bowling wood as we know it today.
Edited on 12/8/2003 3:35 PM
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 02:34:14 PM
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 03:04:48 PM
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: livespive on December 08, 2003, 03:10:02 PM
Mine is drilled 1:30 label also.
--------------------
Eric T. Spivey, P.E.
Visionary Test Staff Member
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 04:23:26 PM
what is your pin to pap distance ?
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: scottie on December 08, 2003, 05:22:04 PM
Post by: livespive on December 08, 2003, 05:36:13 PM
It's roughly about a 4x5
quote:
Eric,
what is your pin to pap distance ?
--------------------
JEFF
--------------------
Eric T. Spivey, P.E.
Visionary Test Staff Member
Post by: BadShot on December 08, 2003, 05:42:48 PM
how's about you sell it to me?!? i can't tell the difference!
--------------------
That which does not kill me makes me stronger . . .
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 06:43:30 PM
quote:
jeff, i just don't see how that kind of ball would help a bowler of your stature . . . it's a ball that is clearly within a hair's width of being a blem.
how's about you sell it to me?!? i can't tell the difference!
--------------------
That which does not kill me makes me stronger . . .
let me think about it Badshot, NO !
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: T-GOD on December 08, 2003, 06:56:28 PM
Another theory would be a 1:30 pin to CG, placing the CG slightly below the midline. Usually the 1:30 pin would be stronger on the backend, but later, which is why you'd want to keep the CG lower, for an earlier smoother reaction. =:^D
Edited on 12/8/2003 8:01 PM
Post by: scottie on December 08, 2003, 07:08:38 PM
Post by: livespive on December 08, 2003, 07:17:40 PM
--------------------
Eric T. Spivey, P.E.
Visionary Test Staff Member
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 08:35:53 PM
That's why I'm thinking maybe 4 label, or a 4x4........
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: rackattack on December 08, 2003, 08:41:34 PM
Bob
--------------------
If you can't join 'em beat 'em.
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 08, 2003, 08:43:23 PM
quote:
I agree with T-Go's second suggestion.That is a way out pin you've got there,may as well see if that core is all they say.
Bob
--------------------
If you can't join 'em beat 'em.
first, or second suggestion ??
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: charlest on December 09, 2003, 11:39:22 AM
--------------------
"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 09, 2003, 11:43:58 AM
quote:
Put any weight hole below your PAP, in normal place, on line fron grip center thru CG.
??? so just below my pap then?
What about thumb quadrant?
.......pin
...O.O
...cg..X
....O
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: A_P_K on December 09, 2003, 11:55:31 AM
Not trying to hijack the thread here...but,
Remember these pins are suuuupppper long, more like 5"+ so in order to keep the CG about or above the center line Jeff will have to put the pin high above the ring finger.
No matter how Jeff lays out the ball there will be a decent amount of thumb weight and any x hole in the thumb quadrant will make it more "rolly".
Maybe a 1:30 would be better after all?????
--------------------
"It is Origin...the pure embodiment of power!"
Pin_Krusher IS a serious threat to modern day bowling wood as we know it today.
Post by: seadrive on December 09, 2003, 11:55:50 AM
quote:
Try to leave a much side and top weight as you can to increase reaction.
charlest, I thought everyone pretty much agreed nowadays that static weights have a negligible effect on ball reaction. Do you disagree, or did I misread what you said?
Jeff, my Pro Purple is a 2-3" pin, laid out approx. 2 1/2 x 3 1/2. It's very even-reacting, maybe a little too so. Since the PP is by nature a control ball, you probably shouldn't give it a control drilling, if you still want it to pack some punch. I'd probably go with a label drilling, maybe 4" pin-to-pap, pin above fingers, cg near grip center.
But hey, I suck, so why listen to me?
--------------------
seadrive
Cogito ergo bowl
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 09, 2003, 01:01:09 PM
quote:
But hey, I suck, so why listen to me?
I was thinking even 3 3/8 x 5...........and oh, by the way....I suck even more !
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: charlest on December 09, 2003, 01:22:22 PM
quote:quote:
Try to leave a much side and top weight as you can to increase reaction.
charlest, I thought everyone pretty much agreed nowadays that static weights have a negligible effect on ball reaction. Do you disagree, or did I misread what you said?]
They still, in my opinion, have a negligible contribution to the overall dynamics. All I would try, by asking that they be taken into consideration in this case, to do is to add whatever degree of snappiness they can add to this ball. This ball is so even that the relatively large pin-CG distance forces some unusual position of the CG and the core, making an even ball even more even. Jeff's high track makes the ball more even still.
In 99.99% of all cases I would virtually ignore static weights.
--------------------
"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."
Post by: charlest on December 09, 2003, 01:25:25 PM
quote:
Charlest,
Not trying to hijack the thread here...but,
Remember these pins are suuuupppper long, more like 5"+ so in order to keep the CG about or above the center line Jeff will have to put the pin high above the ring finger.
I did not say,
put the CG abbove the "center line"
quote:
No matter how Jeff lays out the ball there will be a decent amount of thumb weight and any x hole in the thumb quadrant will make it more "rolly".
with a long pin-CG, there's only so much you can do.
quote:
Maybe a 1:30 would be better after all?????
-------------------
don't like that for him and this ball and this pin-Cg, but the decision is his to make.
--------------------
"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."
Post by: charlest on December 09, 2003, 01:26:48 PM
quote:quote:
Put any weight hole below your PAP, in normal place, on line fron grip center thru CG.
??? so just below my pap then?
What about thumb quadrant?
.......pin
...O.O
...cg..X
....O
--------------------
JEFF
one should normally put the wt hole, on line from center of grip thru the CG to the desired distance. How far below the PAP it winds up is yours and the driller's decision.
--------------------
"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."
Post by: A_P_K on December 09, 2003, 01:34:29 PM
quote:
I'd place the CG about 4-4.5" from your PAP,a s long as it did not wind up ->too far below the midline, maybe 1" max<-
The way it is now, the CG is practically parallel to the thumb hole, so even if you raised it two inches to get it under the center line an inch, the pin would be very high above the ring finger.
What would happen then, the ball probably would roll and roll and roll and never really have ANY type of POP Jeff was looking for????
I don't think in this case with this ball and pin out distance there's much of a choice. Like you said you can't really do anything with it and it will be very even just about drilled any way.
That's why I now think that 1:30 could be the best bet, and I guess that's what I wanted to say earlier but I couldn't get it out.
--------------------
"It is Origin...the pure embodiment of power!"
Pin_Krusher IS a serious threat to modern day bowling wood as we know it today.
Edited on 12/9/2003 2:44 PM
Post by: Jeffrevs on December 09, 2003, 01:40:59 PM
quote:quote:
I'd place the CG about 4-4.5" from your PAP,a s long as it did not wind up ->too far below the midline, maybe 1" max<-
The way it is now, the CG is practically parallel to the thumb hole, so even if you raised it two inches to get it under the center line an inch, the pin would be very high above the ring finger.
What would happen then, the ball probably would roll and roll and roll and never really have any POP Jeff was looking for????
I don't think in this case with this ball and pin out distance there's much of a choice. Like you said you can't really do anything with it and it will be very even just about drilled any way.
That's why I now think that 1:30 could be the best bet, and I guess that's what I wanted to say earlier but I couldn't get it out.
Charlest, do you agree with the BOLD ??
AND...
(clarification)
I don't expect a big POP, I just don't want it to be a dud either, it's a control ball to begin with, so I want to utilize the little pop it has....
--------------------
JEFF
Post by: charlest on December 09, 2003, 01:58:27 PM
quote:
I don't think in this case with this ball and pin out distance there's much of a choice. Like you said you can't really do anything with it and it will be very even just about drilled any way.
That's why I now think that 1:30 could be the best bet, and I guess that's what I wanted to say earlier but I couldn't get it out.
--------------------
"It is Origin...the pure embodiment of power!"
Pin_Krusher IS a serious threat to modern day bowling wood as we know it today.
maybe I should just step out. I don't like 5,6" pins. They are 2nd class balls EXCEPT for a small minority of bowlers.
1:30 is more of a control drill, I'd rather have a 12:00, 12:30, 1:00 drill and I'm not talking clock here, but 75-90 degree maximnum, because this is such an even ball.
--------------------
"Just because you can do something does not mean you should do it."
Edited on 12/9/2003 2:58 PM
Post by: Strider on December 09, 2003, 06:45:03 PM
--------------------
Penn State Proud