Author Topic: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops! (Read 7186 times)

SCOTT-Bowlingcom · « **on:** January 26, 2009, 07:40:19 AM »

We at Bowling.com are looking to branch out and to help our customers in every way possible. Many of our competitors currently offer drilling to their customers and we would like your thoughts on us doing the same thing with a twist.
It seems to us that you often get better drilling quality if you go to a local proshop and have a professional measure and drill your ball on the spot than if you send in a sheet with measurements. Proshops have the unique ability to see the bowler in action and to decide what needs to be done to a ball based on these observations. So here is our question, Would Proshops be willing to work with Bowling.com on drilling?
One possibility we see is that we could have Proshops around the country sign up through our site. If a person in that proshop's area orders through us, we could offer to have the bowling ball sent to the local proshop for drilling. In return, the proshop would allow us to advertise to the customer that they would take $5 off of the drilling fee. Bowling.Com would not collect the money for drilling and the discount would be directly to the consumer from the proshop. This could generate some good advertisement for proshops and also guarantee they get a customer for drilling. This is something we are thinking about but wanted to get your ideas. We feel like this would be a win win for our site and for proshops. Looking forward to hearing your feedback.

Thanks
Scott Pinkston
Bowling.com

sunsetlefty · « **Reply #31 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:01:44 AM »

quote:
I do like SunsetLefties idea though.

Edited on 1/29/2009 11:42 AM

Thanks. Einstein I'm not

Anytime that a pro shop can get a customer thru the front door, there is a potential for a sale. Drilling the internet ball might still offer the potential for additional revenue from shoes, bags, accessories, etc. However, there is no gaurantee, so that's why the pro shop should be allowed to recoup the discounted drilling fee.

Mike300-83's comments about ball pricing for pro shops vs. internet pricing are valid. For example, the Ebonite Striking Motion. I purchased 4 of these from my distributor. Before I could sell even 1 of them the price had dropped on the internet over $30.00. I took a loss on all 4 balls, and that isn't good for a little shop like me.
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Gary Palma
X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
PBA Member
2008 Hammer Staff Member

Smash49 · « **Reply #32 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:18:22 AM »

I have a problem with the part... If you buy a ball somewhere else I will mark down my services by $5.

? I already match bowling.com's prices anyway! Personally I'd rather bowling.com not sell anything but that's just me. We are in the business of selling bowling balls and equipment. Why would I support a competitor. Most customers know where to get ball's drilled and $5 is not enough in gas money and time to bother with. I don't think people would bother with driving from Lewisville to Irving for $5. Now that we are in Oklahoma I am the only Pro Shop for 35 miles or more in most directions.

As for bowling.com = Classic Products. From my understanding Classic supports a number of Internet dealers. So do a lot of other distributors. We purchase from a number of sources Classic, Premier, Lomar and Anchorman to name a few. Classic ships bowling.com's drop ships out of their Garland TX. location. We work with all these companies to get the best arrangements possible for us and our customers. I'm not happy about the distributors selling to Internet dealers but one Pro Shop will not stop anything.

I refuse to do business with Gran Prix even though they do not sell to the Internet dealers.

Smash49
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Smash49

Slick, tacky, wood or synthetic it does not matter your slide is correct with SLSM Designs Bowlers Slide Sock. The Finest Slide Sock on the Planet!!!
www.bowlersslidesock.com
Striking Cat Bowling Pro Shop inside Striking Cat Bowling Lanes of Duncan Oklahoma!
www.strikingcatbowling.com

jls · « **Reply #33 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:28:13 AM »

Our shop like many other shops, have customers who buy a large number of balls a year, or bring in a large number to be drilled per year. We offer them a discount. It might be $30 off on a new ball, or $20-$25 off on getting one drilled. So they can still save money and buy from us.

I have no problems with anyone buying online and bringing in a ball to be drilled. In fact, I often recommend Buddies to people looking for a deal.
Maybe they are only saving $10-$20, but to some, that is a lot.

I can plainly see that the consumers on this site really don't understand what is going on here. They think us pro shops are mad cause they are saving money. That is not so. What we are upset about is simple.

A dist, like Classic, or Ace or Cook, are suppose to sell to online and pro shops. Not set up fronts. And sell to themselves. This is what many feel is going on. Mike has had the guts to name Classic as the dist behind Bowling.com.

And he now buys from Gran prix. Now if Mike buys 2700 balls a year. That is one hell of a hit that Classic just took, losing him as a customer.

Now if more pro shops pull their heads out of their butts and do the same. Then maybe, just maybe these dist that have been playing both ends against the middle will lose enough business, and go away.

At one of the seminars, it was stated that there are 17 dist. and by the end of the year, there may be only 12 left!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mike, thanks for posting. I especially liked how you handle it when one guy made some kind of service remark!!!!!! That is so typical of what goes on, on this site. It's called, geek bashing 101. The do it and hope you would run away.

Glad to see you didn't!!!!!

Have a good day Mike.
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jls

Edited on 1/29/2009 12:30 PM

Kid Jete · « **Reply #34 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:39:18 AM »

jls, I understand where you guys are coming from but most of what you said has nothing to do with this thread. Scott just came on here with an idea and you guys are now babbling on about who and how distributors sell their equipment. All Scott wanted was opinions on the idea. If you don't like it it isn't that hard to just say that without bashing and ramble on about the state of B&M shops. I'm not trying to start an arguement on this thread because like I said I do totally understand. I just think Scott deserves a little more courtesy as his intentions are good.

Edited on 1/29/2009 12:39 PM

SCOTT-Bowlingcom · « **Reply #35 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:42:52 AM »

quote:
The point that I was trying to make in my original post was that the pro shops provide the experience, equipment, etc. necessary to provide the bowler with the correct fit and ball layout.
To ask each shop to drop $5.00 is the wrong way to go.
IMHO bowling.com should do something different, such as this:

Go ahead and provide the $5.00 coupon. Let's say it's numbered BOWL0001. The ball is sent to the pro shop along with the coupon.
The customer sets an appointment to get the ball drilled up.
The pro shop provides the service and deducts $5.00 from the final fee.
The pro shop logs onto bowling.com and enters the coupon code.
The pro shop receives $5.00 back in product from bowling.com.

This is just my idea, there may be better ones out there.....
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Gary Palma
X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
PBA Member
2008 Hammer Staff Member

This sounds like a great idea. Let me know if there are any other ideas that could help us work together on this. What are the next steps we should look into?

Thanks
Scott Pinkston
Bowling.com

Spider Ball Bowler · « **Reply #36 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:45:24 AM »

This is a very interesting topic. I figured there would be some bashers and some lovers, but the passion from each side is pretty good.

If I were in the proshop business and decided to jump on board, I would raise my drilling prices $10 and then give a $5 discount.

What I have seen in the shop I frequent is that the prices with drilling and tax and all of that are very comparable to what I would pay if I bought it online and brought it in. For instance the Sauce was going for $189.99 drilled at the shop, and if I bought online for $145 and got it drilled, the prices would be the same.

The only reason I could see a proshop jumping on board with Bowling.com is to perhaps get a new customer or two and show them how their prices compare. Let them see for themselves that here is the price at bowling.com, this is what you pay for drilling, now here is our price drilled. See there is no difference. I would explain what is covered with buying the ball from me, and the hassle involved in returning items and all of that when buying from online.

I honestly don't see many shops jumping on this, but if they do, hopefully they will use their heads and try and completely take business away from the online shops.
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Ahhh Disco Biscuits!

Mike Austin · « **Reply #37 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:45:45 AM »

After reading Mike300's rant, I thought I had written it. I had the EXACT same scenario with Classic while in Houston. The last 3-4 years I was there, I went away from Classic, more toward Gran Prix, for all the same reasons and conversations.

Glad somebody else is catching that the etailers are not the biggest problem, the distributors are. I would have to research my recent diatribe about this in the Brunswick and Misc forums.

Smash makes a good point. Wouldn't be a good program for him, he has a monopoly on his market, why should he give back $5? He has a captive audience, they aren't going anywhere else.

If I was in Houston, I would have to have a guarantee that you are referring people ONLY to me, and for about a 50 mile radius. If you are going to refer to any shop that signs up, then big deal, I'm already getting my percentage of those people, don't want to give back $5. Shoot, I think I would go UP $5 minimum on blank fee, and that would be for all, not just bowling.com referrals.

Kidjete, lighten up on Mike300. Yes, he may have sounded harsh, that is his perogative, let SCOTT-bowling.com decide if he is harsh. Mike300 and MANY other honest hard working pro shop operators have had their living slowly eroded away over the years, and by many consumers, shops are seen as the bad guys. Until you can walk a mile in his shoes...... Hell, I think he took my shoes, or I took his??

Laufeye, you are funny!

It's really too late. If the etailers WANTED to help, they would have kept their prices above what pro shops can buy for and let them compete. The distributors should sell to shops at the same price as the nets, or at least give us the chance to.

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THIS SPACE FOR RENT

sdbowler · « **Reply #38 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:49:37 AM »

I see both sides of this. From working at a center that operated its own pro shop we did not want to lose money. So for a ball to bought off the internet to come in and we were suppose to drop the price by $5 for drilling is not the best idea. The "rebate coupon" idea is a good idea. Pro shops are in a tough time right now. Bowling numbers are down and with the shape of the country right now I don't know how many people are actually buying new equipment. I have seen it first hand myself what JLS and Mike300 are talking about with ball prices. It is frustrating to try to compete with the internet for prices. Some times you win on a selected ball some times you lose.
As far as a customer stand point I think it is a good idea. I can order a ball have it drop shipped to the pro shop of my choice IF they are on board. I then can turn around and save another $5. Depending on the ball it could be a very good savings.
To me the advantage of going into a pro shop is lost with the internet shops. You can't walk in and have somebody watch you for a bit and then recomend a ball for you. There are many more advantages of having a local pro shop to deal with. I have to be careful on what I say about supporting local shops since I get my stuff from a friend down in Alabama and have it shipped to me. With that said though I always tell people to visit the local shop to deal with the pro shop guy there. When I was in Sioux Falls I would recomend the center's shop that I was bowling in at the time.

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Kyle

Kid Jete · « **Reply #39 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:49:56 AM »

MA, like I said I understand completely we went through the same thing in the golf industry at the turn of the century. I'm just saying Scott is just trying to help, if someone needs to vent start another thread. You know what I mean?

jls · « **Reply #40 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:51:03 AM »

quote:
jls, I understand where you guys are coming from but most of what you said has nothing to do with this thread. Scott just came on here with an idea and you guys are now babbling on about who and how distributors sell their equipment. All Scott wanted was opinions on the idea. If you don't like it it isn't that hard to just say that without bashing and ramble on about the state of B&M shops. I'm not trying to start an arguement on this thread because like I said I do totally understand. I just think Scott deserves a little more courtesy as his intentions are good.

Edited on 1/29/2009 12:39 PM

Kid, no you don't understand.

Mike hit it right on the head. Some of these dist. are HURTING. MIke bought 2700 balls a year from them. Now nothing. And that was just balls, not talking about shoes and bags etc.

That dist. LOST boo koo sales. And each and everyday, more and more pro shops are doing the same thing. Buying from dist. they TRUST.

Now to me KID, that is the only reason b.com is coming on. He needs to stop the bleeding. So he wants to get friendly with pro shops.

Now if any pro shops out there like his idea, then go for it. Mike answered, and so did I. We don't like it, and we told you why.

Therefore sir, My reply does indeed pertain to this thread.

BTW, for 2 days I stood out of this thread, but then some others IM me and ASKED me what I thought. So I answered. After all If Mike has the guts to post, they I felt that I should show him some support and post.

KID, No Taylormade for you, come back one year

>>>> soup nazi
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jls

Spider Ball Bowler · « **Reply #41 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:52:20 AM »

quote:
quote:
The point that I was trying to make in my original post was that the pro shops provide the experience, equipment, etc. necessary to provide the bowler with the correct fit and ball layout.
To ask each shop to drop $5.00 is the wrong way to go.
IMHO bowling.com should do something different, such as this:

Go ahead and provide the $5.00 coupon. Let's say it's numbered BOWL0001. The ball is sent to the pro shop along with the coupon.
The customer sets an appointment to get the ball drilled up.
The pro shop provides the service and deducts $5.00 from the final fee.
The pro shop logs onto bowling.com and enters the coupon code.
The pro shop receives $5.00 back in product from bowling.com.

This is just my idea, there may be better ones out there.....
--------------------
Gary Palma
X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
PBA Member
2008 Hammer Staff Member

This sounds like a great idea. Let me know if there are any other ideas that could help us work together on this. What are the next steps we should look into?

Thanks
Scott Pinkston
Bowling.com

Scott how does that sound like a great idea? You must be saving a lot of money by not shipping to a residential address if that sounds like a great idea. Why would you want to lose an extra $5 per ball you sell for no reason?
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Ahhh Disco Biscuits!

Kid Jete · « **Reply #42 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:55:51 AM »

quote:
quote:
jls, I understand where you guys are coming from but most of what you said has nothing to do with this thread. Scott just came on here with an idea and you guys are now babbling on about who and how distributors sell their equipment. All Scott wanted was opinions on the idea. If you don't like it it isn't that hard to just say that without bashing and ramble on about the state of B&M shops. I'm not trying to start an arguement on this thread because like I said I do totally understand. I just think Scott deserves a little more courtesy as his intentions are good.

Edited on 1/29/2009 12:39 PM

Kid, no you don't understand.

Mike hit it right on the head. Some of these dist. are HURTING. MIke bought 2700 balls a year from them. Now nothing. And that was just balls, not talking about shoes and bags etc.

That dist. LOST boo koo sales. And each and everyday, more and more pro shops are doing the same thing. Buying from dist. they TRUST.

Now to me KID, that is the only reason b.com is coming on. He needs to stop the bleeding. So he wants to get friendly with pro shops.

Now if any pro shops out there like his idea, then go for it. Mike answered, and so did I. We don't like it, and we told you why.

Therefore sir, My reply does indeed pertain to this thread.

BTW, for 2 days I stood out of this thread, but then some others IM me and ASKED me what I thought. So I answered. After all If Mike has the guts to post, they I felt that I should show him some support and post.

KID, No Taylormade for you, come back one year>>>> soup nazi
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jls

I guess if his intentions are to "stop the bleeding" and not to actually get friendly and help out then you have a foot to stand on. I am just giving him the benefit of the doubt at this point and not assuming there's some alterior motive going on here.

sdbowler · « **Reply #43 on:** January 29, 2009, 11:59:48 AM »

quote:
quote:
quote:
The point that I was trying to make in my original post was that the pro shops provide the experience, equipment, etc. necessary to provide the bowler with the correct fit and ball layout.
To ask each shop to drop $5.00 is the wrong way to go.
IMHO bowling.com should do something different, such as this:

Go ahead and provide the $5.00 coupon. Let's say it's numbered BOWL0001. The ball is sent to the pro shop along with the coupon.
The customer sets an appointment to get the ball drilled up.
The pro shop provides the service and deducts $5.00 from the final fee.
The pro shop logs onto bowling.com and enters the coupon code.
The pro shop receives $5.00 back in product from bowling.com.

This is just my idea, there may be better ones out there.....
--------------------
Gary Palma
X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
PBA Member
2008 Hammer Staff Member

This sounds like a great idea. Let me know if there are any other ideas that could help us work together on this. What are the next steps we should look into?

Thanks
Scott Pinkston
Bowling.com

Scott how does that sound like a great idea? You must be saving a lot of money by not shipping to a residential address if that sounds like a great idea. Why would you want to lose an extra $5 per ball you sell for no reason?
--------------------
Ahhh Disco Biscuits!

The one thing that comes to mind real quick would be that they suggest people to go to the site to order off the internet. That way it creates business both ways.
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Kyle

jls · « **Reply #44 on:** January 29, 2009, 12:06:19 PM »

Kid, your in the business. If you bought 500 drivers a year from brand A, and then found out that they were cutting your throat, and you stopped dealing with them. And then starting buying 500 drivers more from brand T. Do you think brand A might feel it. Especially if many accounts started doing this.

Answer YES

Mike use to buy up to 2700 balls from them. Now ZERO!!!!!!!

Now I do not deal with them, so the 3 or 4 balls a year I buy, will have no affect on them!!!

Mike, I love you. Boy I hope Jorge doesn't see this.

Kid
No taylormade for you, come back one year

<<<< soup nazi

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jls

qstick777 · « **Reply #45 on:** January 29, 2009, 12:17:37 PM »

quote:
If you want to help the BOWLER just reduce the price of any purchased ball by $5 so that the bowler can use that for drilling! If I liked the way local drillers DRILLED I'd use them!

Your plan doesn't appear to HOLD WATER unless you have a large percentage of buyers asking you to drill. If BUYERS are already going to local shops for drilling where's the incentive?

From what you are offering it appears that bowlers have to make the decision .. and what are you helping them with?

That's my thoughts .. I'm not a Pro Shop!
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O

I'm going to agree with Joe.

The customer is going to have to get the ball drilled somewhere.

The only way this helps the pro shop is those that are unknown.

The concept sounds similar to purchasing tires from tirerack and then choosing a local installer. Unless you are going to provide a warranty to the customer and pro shop on that ball (something that you currently charge $9.95 for on the site - drilling protection, and an additional $6.95 to double the manufacturer warranty), what is the incentive to the pro shop? You are actually asking them to reduce their fee by $5 so that they can be listed on your site.

Your company is in no way attempting to certify that these shops are even any good. There are plenty of poor pro shops out there. You risk losing customers because you could potentially be sending them to a shop that will mess up the drilling.

Like Mike said, you asking the shops to reduce their fee on top of undercutting them on a ball sale. By having their pro shop listed on your site, the shop owners are ultimately admitting that they endorse customers to purchase balls on-line instead of from the shop.

And yes, shipping to a business address costs less than shipping to a residential address.
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Author Topic: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops! (Read 7186 times)

SCOTT-Bowlingcom

Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

sunsetlefty

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Smash49

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

jls

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Kid Jete

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

SCOTT-Bowlingcom

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Spider Ball Bowler

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Mike Austin

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

sdbowler

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Kid Jete

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

jls

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Spider Ball Bowler

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

Kid Jete

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

sdbowler

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

jls

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!

qstick777

Re: Bowling.com INTERESTED in working with Proshops!