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Author Topic: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people  (Read 2281 times)

bowler100

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Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« on: January 17, 2019, 02:06:38 AM »
Has anyone thrown both an AMB Centaur Particle and a Midnight Scorcher at one time or another? I remember throwing someone's Midnight Scorcher on a heavier house shot in my teen years and the ball rolled as soon as it hit the lane. I have never thrown a AMB Centaur Particle but I have seen it thrown and it also seemed to roll extremely early as well.

I am pretty sure the AMB Centaur Particle has a lot more hook potential on the dry boards than the Scorcher but which ball was stronger FRONT TO BACK? Not as in backend reaction but just raw early traction on flooded heads?

Is Jason Wonders still on this website?

 

bcw1969

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2019, 06:40:06 AM »
I have both......over the years I have had possession of 3 AMB Particles and 3 Midnight Scorchers. Now I have 1 amb particle and 2 Scorchers.  I have used different drillings on both balls.  Although both balls can handle lot of oil, on conditions that have a severe and heavy out of bounds, I can use the Scorcher and play up the out of bounds and am able to see the ball exit the oob and reach the pocket. The Amb Particle being reactive based, If I played it the same way with a heavy oob, it will not exit the oob and make it to the pocket(unless you put a very early and violent hook drilling on it). I prefer the Scorcher because it doesn't jump or snap on the back end. I you needed or wanted that backend jump, then the AMB would be a better choice. The Scorcher covers less boards doing what it does.  Hope that helps.

Brad

scotts33

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2019, 08:01:40 AM »
Both balls are for heavy oil IMO not house lane conditions.  BUT, depends completely on bowlers stats, lane condition and usage.  What works for one bowler like a lefty with low revs and must play straight may not work for you or vicea versa.  Total crap shoot IMO.  If you don't have low revs, high speed I'd stay away from both these balls on a medium or less house shot.  Just my experience over the years with VBP. 
Scott

JamminJD

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2019, 08:20:03 AM »
Both balls are for heavy oil IMO not house lane conditions.  BUT, depends completely on bowlers stats, lane condition and usage.  What works for one bowler like a lefty with low revs and must play straight may not work for you or vicea versa.  Total crap shoot IMO.  If you don't have low revs, high speed I'd stay away from both these balls on a medium or less house shot.  Just my experience over the years with VBP. 

scott33 is right these balls are better on oil. Hard to get them to roll on a medium house shot unless its a lot of volume. Both great balls though.

BowlingForDonuts

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2019, 10:19:21 AM »
+1 to not ideal for house shot.  I am high speed, low rev and there is only one house with enough oil in my area I can use my Granite Gargoyle at and it's low load with a weaker core than either of those balls.  Raven also only excels in the oil for me as well.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2019, 10:23:08 AM by BowlingForDonuts »
Here today.  Gone tomorrow.

bowler100

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2019, 11:35:26 AM »
I have both......over the years I have had possession of 3 AMB Particles and 3 Midnight Scorchers. Now I have 1 amb particle and 2 Scorchers.  I have used different drillings on both balls.  Although both balls can handle lot of oil, on conditions that have a severe and heavy out of bounds, I can use the Scorcher and play up the out of bounds and am able to see the ball exit the oob and reach the pocket. The Amb Particle being reactive based, If I played it the same way with a heavy oob, it will not exit the oob and make it to the pocket(unless you put a very early and violent hook drilling on it). I prefer the Scorcher because it doesn't jump or snap on the back end. I you needed or wanted that backend jump, then the AMB would be a better choice. The Scorcher covers less boards doing what it does.  Hope that helps.

Brad
Essentially, you are saying that the Scorcher reads through floods even better the AMB Centaur Particle but the AMB will cover far more boards when it does hit friction? Correct me if I am wrong.

bowler100

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2019, 11:39:50 AM »
Both balls are for heavy oil IMO not house lane conditions.  BUT, depends completely on bowlers stats, lane condition and usage.  What works for one bowler like a lefty with low revs and must play straight may not work for you or vicea versa.  Total crap shoot IMO.  If you don't have low revs, high speed I'd stay away from both these balls on a medium or less house shot.  Just my experience over the years with VBP.
Yeah, I remember even on a very slick, hard wall; the Scorcher wanted to read at about 20 feet haha.

bcw1969

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2019, 11:43:21 AM »
The Scorcher being a particle urethane(non reactive) is going to want to move earlier than the AMB, which for me, helps to get the movement started on longer heavier sport shots with a severe out of bounds. The Scorcher is not the kind of ball you would want to move in deep and swing with, it is better with straighter more direct lines. The AMB being reactive particle will start its movement slightly further down the lane, but still much sooner than any other ball you could get, and in most cases will move more on the backend than the Scorcher(that's not what the scorcher was designed for).

Brad

scotts33

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2019, 11:50:00 AM »
Just an FYI so it's known Brad is a lefty low rev stroker so be aware of how he look at factors vs. how you may.  BUT maybe you are a lefty low rev stroker.  This is why when folks ask for advice they (the OP) should put in more info. about themselves so better educated guesstimates may or may not work for them.  JMO.  BTW my stats. are in my profile.

Midnight Scorcher is RG 15 2.58 .038
Centaur AMB Particle is 15 2.56 .062 

Both OOB 320.  You can ruin the surface on either ball using the wrong procedure and therefore change the original ball motion by quite a bit.  In my experience that's the main issue with those using them not on a heavier pattern.
Scott

bowler100

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2019, 06:46:40 PM »
The Scorcher being a particle urethane(non reactive) is going to want to move earlier than the AMB, which for me, helps to get the movement started on longer heavier sport shots with a severe out of bounds. The Scorcher is not the kind of ball you would want to move in deep and swing with, it is better with straighter more direct lines. The AMB being reactive particle will start its movement slightly further down the lane, but still much sooner than any other ball you could get, and in most cases will move more on the backend than the Scorcher(that's not what the scorcher was designed for).

Brad
The R.I.P tide and Tombstone (R.I.P) might have something to say about that. I would not be surprised if they rolled even sooner than the AMB Centaur Particle.   

bowler100

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2019, 06:53:56 PM »
Just an FYI so it's known Brad is a lefty low rev stroker so be aware of how he look at factors vs. how you may.  BUT maybe you are a lefty low rev stroker.  This is why when folks ask for advice they (the OP) should put in more info. about themselves so better educated guesstimates may or may not work for them.  JMO.  BTW my stats. are in my profile.

Midnight Scorcher is RG 15 2.58 .038
Centaur AMB Particle is 15 2.56 .062 

Both OOB 320.  You can ruin the surface on either ball using the wrong procedure and therefore change the original ball motion by quite a bit.  In my experience that's the main issue with those using them not on a heavier pattern.
I use a maroon pad so close enough!

TWOHAND834

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2019, 07:30:54 PM »
While I never had a Scorcher, I did have the AMB Particle and it was virtually impossible keeping it right of the headpin at OOB surface.  I rarely saw enough oil to use that ball.
Steven Vance
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Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

scotts33

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2019, 06:50:04 AM »
While I never had a Scorcher, I did have the AMB Particle and it was virtually impossible keeping it right of the headpin at OOB surface.  I rarely saw enough oil to use that ball.

Good to see you post in VBP again Steven! 
Scott

TWOHAND834

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2019, 02:05:38 PM »
While I never had a Scorcher, I did have the AMB Particle and it was virtually impossible keeping it right of the headpin at OOB surface.  I rarely saw enough oil to use that ball.

Good to see you post in VBP again Steven! 

I havent been on here much in quite a while.  I have a new addition to my family and cant wait to drill his first bowling ball.  So between work and my little boy; it doesnt free up the time I used to have. 

Truth be told; I do miss being on the lanes and feeling that competitive side.  I am hopeful I will be back sooner than later.
Steven Vance
Former Pro Shop Operator
Former Classic Products Assistant Manager

bcw1969

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Re: Calling all knowledgeable Visionary people
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2019, 02:26:52 PM »
The Scorcher being a particle urethane(non reactive) is going to want to move earlier than the AMB, which for me, helps to get the movement started on longer heavier sport shots with a severe out of bounds. The Scorcher is not the kind of ball you would want to move in deep and swing with, it is better with straighter more direct lines. The AMB being reactive particle will start its movement slightly further down the lane, but still much sooner than any other ball you could get, and in most cases will move more on the backend than the Scorcher(that's not what the scorcher was designed for).

Brad
The R.I.P tide and Tombstone (R.I.P) might have something to say about that. I would not be surprised if they rolled even sooner than the AMB Centaur Particle.   

interesting enough, I do also have a Riptide and 2 Tombstone's.  With similar drillings the Tombstones resemble my Scorchers. The Riptide is very very grabby. I had to tone down the cover to very fine grits just to use it on heavier sports shots. If I were to give my preference of the 4 balls it would Be the Scorchers, mainly due to the consistent control I have with them.

Brad