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Author Topic: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men  (Read 5984 times)

MarvinsSkeleton

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Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« on: July 09, 2003, 11:20:15 PM »
While reading the Fort Worth Star Telegram today I saw the following article.  It is an interview with Carolyn Dorin-Ballard.  Just thought I would pass it on for my fellow BR.com readers.  Enjoy.

Click Here to view the article.
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Corey
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charlest

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #16 on: July 10, 2003, 09:04:11 PM »
quote:
Nice observation, MI_2_AZ!

 
quote:
(I believe the summary as to why professional bowling did not have more corporate sponsors was the demographics of the audience were not the people to whom they wanted to market their products: read that - they don't have enough money!)


I think the same could have been said about NASCAR 10-15 years ago.  Now look at it.  So am I to believe that bowlers make less money than the stereotypical Red Neck NASCAR fan?  Funny, I see the same people who are at the track on the lanes during the week.  Fact is, no matter how poor a person is, they will spend money if they see VALUE in it.


Not a question of what you believe. Sponsors do not care what you and I believe. They are totally concerned with the sale of their product. If they saw the watchers/viewers of professional bowling do not earn enough to buy enough of their product to make it worth their while, belief nevers enters into the picture. Demographics rule Madison Avenue. period. end of story. Poof!

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Black_Balled

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #17 on: July 10, 2003, 09:04:15 PM »
You guys act like we're talking about basketball or football, or some other highly physical sport.  The number of games to be bowled in a period of time on PBA vs. the PWBA could be a factor in her performance, but she can condition herself.  I usually bowl 40-50 games a week recreationally.  There are days that I do well and days that I don't do so well.  And on those off days, I struggle to hit the pocket, control ball speed, revs etc.  I beat myself up for not being able to bowl well on that day when the previous days I had been doing well, but, all athletes - ALL ATHLETES - will have bad performances from time to time.

So for any guy that believes that she can't do it, that she can't go the long haul, that she can't win a PBA championship, well, I just hope she's not having an "on" day when you're having an "off" day, cuz' I sure would hate to hear about you on the 6 o'clock news!

charlest

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #18 on: July 10, 2003, 09:05:43 PM »
quote:
i think she'd do fine...cuz i mean think of what it'd do the guy's ego if they got there butt whooped by a girl?
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Damn those 10 pins!  I swear they got stick-it on the bottom of them...damn them to hell!!!



exactly the point!!
The women have nothing to lose; the men have everything to lose.
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"Those who do not remember history are doomed to repeat it."
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DON DRAPER

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #19 on: July 10, 2003, 09:47:02 PM »
carolyn dorin-ballard is an excellent player---i wish i was that good. she cannot, however, consistently beat the best the pba has to offer. the pwba is for WOMEN who aspire to be the best. the pba is for MEN.

TwoFourEightNineNine

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #20 on: July 10, 2003, 11:21:11 PM »
quote:
NO SHE SHOULD NOT BE ALLOW TO BOWL IN THE PBA

PBA IS FOR MEN AND MEN ONLY!

IF SHE BOWLS IN IT EVERY WOMAN IN AMERICA WILL WANT TO BOWL IN THE PBA, PLUS SHE WOULD NEVER WIN BECAUSE SHE COULDN'T HANDLE THE OIL! (HA HA HA0

HOPEFULLY THEY NEVER ALLOW HER TO BOWL IN THE PBA IT WOULD RUIN THE PBA (NO OFFENCE TO WOMEN) BUT YOU DONT SEE MEN WANTING TO BOWL IN THE PWBA?!!?!?!?!?!!?!?


Better yet, who would want to bowl in the PWBA? The payouts are just sad.

I'll disagree with you. She's trying to make a living bowling, and if she'd like to continue that (if and when the pwba decides to fold), she should join the pba. I wouldn't be suprised that the pba would allow their tournaments to become open tournaments.

Anyway, by all means, all pba events are sanctioned by the ABC... in which ABC is a co-ed organization.
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10 In The Pit

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2003, 02:35:41 AM »
It wouldn't bother me one bit to see the women take on the PBA members in competition.  Bowling isn't necessarily all about power and muscle.....technique and expertise are far more of the equation, and this could easily allow some of the better female bowlers to compete head to head with the men.  I say that the PBA should let 'em in and see if they can compete!

I look back to another sport that is near and dear to me.....NHRA Drag Racing.  Nobody thought that a woman could be competitive in the NHRA, much less in the Professional categories such as Top Fuel or Funny Car.  Well, a nice lady by the name of Shirley Muldowney proved, and proved very convincingly that she could take on the best male opponents and WIN!!!  To me, drag racing and bowling have a lot of similarities (just like Sawbones and his endless referrals to golf and bowling).....both sports depend more on sheer ability, technique, and expertise, rather than muscle and muscle power.  It doesn't take a man that is 6'6" tall and weighing 275 pounds of pure muscle to drive a Top Fuel car (making some 7,000 horsepower).....a lady who is 5' tall and weighs in at a soaking wet 100 pounds can get the job done just fine!  Bowling is the same way when it comes to size and muscle requirements.....you don't have to be big and muscular to knock down pins and do it effectively.  Most of you would be surprised if you walked up to the recent winner of two PWBA tournaments (Tiffany Stanbrough).....Tiffany probably isn't more than 5 feet tall, but she can knock down pins with the best of them.  Pete Weber would blow over in a good gust of wind, but he has won 20-something PBA titles.  Bowling isn't about size and muscle....it is expertise and accuracy and technique (again, the same thing as driving a 7,000 horsepower Top Fuel car).

If the PBA would open their doors today to the women, I would expect to see some of the women cash in each event, and it wouldn't surprise me to see some of them make it to the finals.  I don't know if there is a stipulation in the PBA bylaws that require male competitors only, but if there isn't, then I say let the women compete too!  And if there is such a restriction in the PBA, then I would say that it needs some serious rethinking about letting women compete with the men.

There's one female bowler in my state (actually who bowls in my house) who can compete head to head with the best male bowlers in the state, and she is only about 5'4", not muscular, doesn't put a ton of revs on the ball, yet she carried a 233 average a year or so ago.  She hasn't shot 800 yet, but she has been in the 790's on several occasions, and has some 4 300 games to her credit thus far.  To meet her, you would never really expect a powerhouse bowler....and to watch her bowl, you can easily see that she doesn't overpower the lanes at all....but, she gets the job done, and done VERY effectively.  At some 26 years of age, she has already recorded over 170 700+ sanctioned series, which is waaaaaaaay ahead of any other woman in the state, and most men too.  Basically, she uses accuracy and technique to get the job done, and not raw power....but you know when she smacks the pocket square, because you still hear a good crack out of the pins, and it all comes from ball placement.

Women in the PBA???  I say, "let 'em in"!!!

Jeffrevs

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #22 on: July 11, 2003, 07:46:48 AM »
My .02 ...it'll just be like Annika Sorenstam. They'll give it a whack, and probaby ...(I said probably) get their butts handed to them and won't come back.   Now, I'm not saying they can't compete and they're not good, because they ARE !! I'm just guessing that the "Annika" thing will happen...
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JEFF
Just chimin' in !

JoeBowler

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #23 on: July 11, 2003, 08:21:33 AM »
Why would they try?

The top women are virtually guaranteed checks each week, larger checks than what they would earn by making the 1st cut in a PBA event. And since the top women seem to make the show every other week (or more often) they would loose TV incentive money.

I say they should allow women to join and bowl in PBA events. The only stipulation is that they cannot belong to both the PWBA and the PBA with a one year layoff clause if they switch back to the PWBA.

michelle

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #24 on: July 11, 2003, 08:56:25 AM »
Why would they try...easy...after this week, we may not HAVE a PWBA.  Bowling three game sweepers on a house shot is not what anybody wants to have to resort to.  Most of the PWBA members would be looking for someplace with a truly competitive environment.

Doc Hollywood

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #25 on: July 11, 2003, 09:32:38 AM »
My personal feeling is that there will be too many politics involved with letting a woman compete in men's bowling.

First off if there was enough pressure to allow a woman to bowl it would happen.

Second, Whomever the woman was, the association putting on the event would make the playing condition one that she has difficulty playing.  This would make it much more difficult for her to compete.  Percentage of players who could play her tough condition versus one woman.

She would fair better than some but maybe not enough.  Then the promoters would make air about how tough the male competition would be.

There are to many controlled variables that can change the outcome of an event like this.

The same holds true when Annika played the PGA event.  They let her play but put her on a longer demanding course than what she normally would play.  If they put her on a course that was closer to an LPGA event I bet she would have faired much better.

There is still too much chauvinism in these sports and will be kept that way for a long time.


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card79

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #26 on: July 11, 2003, 09:35:10 AM »
What is the big deal.  CDB said she wanted to try it.  She agreed that the tours should stay split.  I say let her make a run at it like Anika did.  Get it out of your system.  Now if the PWBA folds that is a whole different situation.  They should all be permitted to bowl all the time.  They have no alternative.

Let CDB take on the men.
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BackToBasics

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #27 on: July 11, 2003, 10:01:51 AM »
What's the big deal?  When I made Team USA, Tammy Turner would have qualified 3rd for the men's team in average alone (like 205+ for 48 games) and I had no problems whatsoever that she beat me because she can flat out bowl.  Of course, it was a lot different game back then where strikes were a luxury and spares were a premium.  It might be a little different now with the PBA tour being donimated by the power game but if she or any other woman want to try it out, let them. It only hurts the bruised ego men and they aren't good for the sport anyhow.  As I stated in the golf forum, if the PBA wants to be considered the tour with the best bowlers in the world, then let ANYONE, male or female, who wants to compete against the best in the world play.  Very simple to me.

Edited on 7/11/2003 10:27 AM

cosmo

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2003, 10:18:31 AM »
The women already have a chance to compete with the men, at the ABC Masters. Granted it's not the same as the Tour, but some of them have done alright there. Given a chance to compete over a period of time, they just might be able to make the adjustments and stand a chance to be be competive. It also might make some of the men take their game to another level not wanting to get beat by a female.

Where's my Mule?

JoeBowler

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #29 on: July 11, 2003, 10:25:19 AM »
While not a PBA run event, in a since she (and others) have already tried it. The ABC masters have several women entries each year, Ballard among them. Some have gotten checks (Ballard among them). A couple has even made match play, although I don’t believe any has survived more than 2 rounds.

You can argue this event is watered down by a lot of amateurs who have no chance of winning making it easier to cash but virtually all the top pro’s and “amateurs” will be bowling there.

Doc – I can argue your chauvinism is showing in that you feel they couldn’t handle all the conditions that could be laid out. And the Colonial course is one of the shortest used on the PGA tour and is one of the reasons Annika picked that tournament to play in. The biggest disadvantage I felt Annika had was all the media attention taking energy away from her golf game.

I really don’t know why the PBA doesn’t open the doors. If they want to say that the best bowlers in the world compete there then it should be open to all comers. But members should not be allowed to bowl on competing tours. And if that kills the PWBA then so be it.

HamPster

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Re: Dorin-Ballard would like to take on men
« Reply #30 on: July 11, 2003, 12:40:43 PM »
I can see her wanting a higher level of competition, but it's just not fair.  Women's rights have gone overboard now, they're all stuck up and defensive.  They say they can do anything a guy can, fine, whatever.  But yet they still want certain things all to themselves.  Their attitude is that it's just women finally getting their dues, and that the men should shut up.  How about letting youth bowlers into ABC events, hmm?  Just give them their payouts in scholarships.  There are a lot of them that are definitely talented enough to play among the best, why not?  The bottom line for professional sports is all in revenue.  If there isn't enough interest in women's sports for them to be supported, how is that our fault?  The only people that watch the PWBA are the die hard bowling fans.  It's just painful to sit through the telecasts sometimes.  The new PBA telecasts are just flashy enough to draw somebody in.  I'll probably draw some flak for this, but when is it ever enough?  Maybe men should just disappear, that'd probably make them happy.
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