Post by: tenpinspro on July 26, 2007, 10:43:59 AM
Just want some feedback on how much monetarily it takes you to save to buy on-line vs buying at your local pro shop. Thanks for your feedback...
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Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Intl - Tech Support
Vise Inserts Staff
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See profile for Track Ball videos
*El Presidente of the Track Legion
Edited on 7/26/2007 9:18 PM
Post by: MegaMav on July 26, 2007, 07:01:43 PM
On ebay, a newer release usually goes for around $90 shipped.
Online retailers are usually $115 shipped.
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USBC Certified Bowler
2006-07 Average: 209
BowlingChat.net
(http://"http://www.bowlingchat.net")Post by: spinner031 on July 26, 2007, 07:06:17 PM
Whatever!
Post by: nicknefarious on July 26, 2007, 07:11:51 PM
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good transactions with:
D Scott Johnson
Post by: spinner031 on July 26, 2007, 07:13:56 PM
So you'll have to save more than that. Plus, you'll have to wait while it goes through the mail. Sometimes you'll want to buy from the proshop, spending $20 more just to know that you have it.
I also bought a new Machine from cheapbowlingballs.com. (
) That's a special thing. NO ONE has brand new discontinued Machines lying around anymore, so if you can find a site like this (which has $5 off coupons at the top of the page) you can save A LOT on an NIB ball. The shipping came on time too; another good thing. The next best place to save is eBay, but they might not always have what you like, so...Other stuff that isn't discontinued you may not want to bother with, ebcause between waiting for shipping paying for shipping, and the cost of drilling together with the ball, I'm not sure it's worth the time. BUT everyone has a niche - proshops, internet sellers...
Edited on 7/26/2007 7:14 PM
Post by: bowler257628 on July 26, 2007, 07:15:10 PM
Now, I look online and see a ball for 120-140.. Put in the 55 to drill with grips/slug and it comes out to 170-195... I still saved anywhere from 40-90 bucks that could have gone into lessons..
I know pro shops have to pay rent, bills, and get a pay check.. But the bowlers can't afford to put their pay checks into a new ball.
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Cody
Track Hitman!
Post by: solid9 on July 26, 2007, 07:29:25 PM
Post by: c-hop on July 26, 2007, 09:08:23 PM
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Chris
Post by: Gunny on July 26, 2007, 09:20:23 PM
Post by: Xfest on July 26, 2007, 09:29:20 PM
High End Balls
Pro-Shop
Black Widow Pearl:
179.00 Blank Ball
40.00 Drill free
21.95 Slugs and Grips
______________________
240.95 drilled.
Online
Black Widow Pearl:
123.95 Blank Ball
60.00 Drill Fee
21.95 Slugs and Grips
______________________
205.90 drilled.
You saved 35.05
-----------------------------------
Mid Priced ball
Pro Shop
Hammer Anger:
129.00 Blank Ball
40.00 Drill Fee
21.95 Grips and Slugs
______________________
190.95 drilled.
Online
Hammer Anger:
103.95 Blank Ball
60.00 Drill Fee
21.95 Grips and Slugs
_______________________
185.90 Drilled
You saved 5.05
------------------------------------------
Low End ball - Not Plastic
Pro Shop:
Storm Tropical Storm:
59.99 Blank Ball
40.00 Drill Fee
21.95 Grips and Slugs
_______________________
121.94 Drilled
Online
Storm Tropical Storm:
75.90 Blank Ball
60.00 Drill Fee
21.95 Grips and Slugs
_______________________
157.85 Drilled.
You lost $35.91
I've learned my lesson.
. The Pro-Shop is the way to go.Post by: Xcessive_Evil on July 26, 2007, 09:30:11 PM
quote:
Rick, I'll chime in on this.. If I went into my local proshop I would have paid 255 drilled with grips and slug.
Track Hitman!
Exactly. When my pro shop knew I was interested in a 2nd Power Machine, they offered to sell me their last one for 175$ plus 50-60 for drill. So yeah, if my brother(and fellow bolwer) can't get his typical hookup for me(like the NIB TNV I paid 60$ for) I go online, and the shop always get mad when I don't buy from them.
175 through the shop, or 80-90 online? Hmm...
--------------------
My current arsenal-www.putfile.com/trackbowler627
High game-300
High series-796
After 7 weeks out due to a wrist injury, I'm finally back!
Post by: bowler851 on July 26, 2007, 09:32:04 PM
Post by: strikestriketapped on July 26, 2007, 09:35:04 PM
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www.stormbowling.com
Post by: Xfest on July 26, 2007, 09:38:42 PM
Post by: bowler851 on July 26, 2007, 10:30:48 PM
50% so that ball in the pro shop that is $219 should only cost $164. Then we would not have to buy ball of the internet and ccn return to the local pro shop.
Post by: on July 26, 2007, 10:36:52 PM
Quote
Here is an example:
High End Balls
Pro-Shop
Black Widow Pearl:
179.00 Blank Ball
40.00 Drill free
21.95 Slugs and Grips
______________________
240.95 drilled.
Online
Black Widow Pearl:
123.95 Blank Ball
60.00 Drill Fee
21.95 Slugs and Grips
______________________
205.90 drilled.
You saved 35.05
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Our shop price:
Black Widow Pearl 180.00
slug & inserts 18.00
drilling is included in the ball price
Total $198.00 + tax
(Just an example of why you may not need to buy online)
--------------------
notclay
Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
"The problem is no that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem." ~ Theodore Rubin
Edited on 7/26/2007 10:37 PM
Post by: bowler851 on July 26, 2007, 10:50:08 PM
Post by: someguyintucson on July 26, 2007, 10:57:42 PM
Post by: williewc on July 26, 2007, 11:01:07 PM
if i was only saving $20 or less then i wouldnt worry about it, i would pay teh extra money to be able to get it right then
the proshop in my regular house had the Machine for $229, drilling and grips and slugs included, i could order it online for $129, and pay $65 for drilling and grips/slugs, still saving around $40, thats enough for me to shop online
--------------------
Proud member of the Track Legion
Tag Team Coaching Success Story
Post by: shelley on July 26, 2007, 11:26:45 PM
quote:
You lost $35.91 I've learned my lesson.
Yeah, it's been pretty well known for a long time that you don't usually save much, if anything, until you get to the mid-line balls. I'd save on a mid-line ball here, they want about $180 before inserts and tax on BVP-priced stuff. Another $30 for inserts. Plus tax. No discount for league bowlers, either.
High-end stuff is $230 from any company. Brunswick, Storm, Ebonite, Lanemasters, Lane 1, anyone. Plus $30 for inserts. Minus 15% for league bowlers. Basically you get the inserts for free.
Thanks, but no thanks. I'd save $50+ buying online for a high end ball, probably $30 on a mid-line ball.
If I could get strikestriketapped's Secret Agent for $190 locally, I'd never look at another online shop again. The shop I go to that's two hours away is more like $180-200 drilled, grips, tax for a high end ball. With gas, I break even versus coming locally. But I don't support the guy who charges $30 for $3 worth of inserts.
SH
Post by: drillbit on July 27, 2007, 12:06:02 AM
drillbit
Post by: on July 27, 2007, 08:33:05 AM
quote:
$180 for Black widow pearl, $18 for inserts what do you make off that transaction I would guss you have around $110 in the ball and less than $5 in the inserts(what a mark up for thumb slug and grips). $83 for half hours work not a bad payday.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well maybe you should go into the pro shop business... Priced a good drill press lately? How about a spinner, Revivor, drill bits, ball inventory, shoe inventory, supplies, wrist gadgets, etc. We have over $1500 of finger inserts in stock at any given time, not to mention the thumb slugs. We just bought another "round piece of plastic" that we use to measure hands for $300! Don't forget shipping costs on all the above. Running a shop isn't only the cost of a ball and drilling it...
We do drill lots of balls purchased online, and don't mind it at all. Those balls are ones that we don't have to inventory and have shipped. I just wanted to debate that your figure of $83 for a half hours work is not all profit, since it does have to go towards buying the next inventory and staying in business.
The online distributors buy in huge quantities so their cost for the ball is much less than ours, too. Did you think that they don't have a mark-up? Believe me, they do, and that's why they're in business. A good shop does not have to apologize for making a profit and staying in business.
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notclay
Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
"The problem is no that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem." ~ Theodore Rubin
Post by: Lillen on July 27, 2007, 08:46:44 AM
But then a High End ball costs about $420 here..
And if you buy a ball from an on-line proshop somewhere else in the world the drilling & grips & slug is $100
Edited on 7/27/2007 8:50 AM
Post by: Joeyd on July 27, 2007, 08:54:18 AM
quote:
I've learned my lesson.
Will there be a time where a post of yours does NOT make it seem as though you think you know everything?
Guys, you obviously can't use one pro shop as an example here. Also, as far as repeat customer discounts go, who's to say that they don't happen online also? Or maybe you bring a few customers over to this online pro shop, and they give you a discount for that.. You could throw in a bunch of different variables here..
Oh, and please please PLEASE tell me where you're paying $60.00 to drill a ball online and then paying $22. for slug and grips ON TOP of that. I'll use Kenny's example and compare his shop to Buddies..
Black Widow Pearl
$129.50 - ball
$50.00 - drilling
$0.00 - shipping
$179.50 - total (You save $61.45)
Raw Hammer Anger
$101.50 - ball
$50.00 - drilling
$0.00 - shipping
$151.50 - total (You save $39.45)
Tropical Storm
$75.00 - ball
$50.00 - drilling
$0.00 - shipping
$125.00 - total (You lose $3.50)
It's pretty much common knowledge (as it was said earlier) that the discounts don't happen until you get to the mid-line bowling balls. However, if I'm saving $60. a pop on high-end stuff, then after 3 I've saved enough to buy another one.
--------------------
Joeyd
Shop www.buddiesproshop.com
http://joeyd.bowlspace.com
AIM - JoeydfromNB11
Edited on 7/27/2007 8:55 AM
Post by: pnj1967 on July 27, 2007, 08:57:00 AM
I did get a Total NV locally from the Pro Shop, who had completed the "Ebonite Advanced Ball drilling Certification" according to the Certificate.
I hated the ball when I got the thing. Come to find out the guy DOES not use a persons PAP, and places the pin where he thinks it should be, never knew this till after getting the ball. The fit was Ok.
I thought by going to him things would be OK (Ebonite). Yes I did supply him with my Axis, PAP , Ball speed, Spans and Pitches, etc.
I have had better luck with getting from on line so far. drillwizard allstarjoe,Doug Sterner and Rick.
--------------------
Enjoy the people on the ballreview.com forum. Like to help when I can.
Users I wont deal with, read my profile.
Edited on 7/27/2007 8:58 AM
Post by: Dan Belcher on July 27, 2007, 09:01:33 AM
Post by: williewc on July 27, 2007, 09:04:54 AM
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Proud member of the Track Legion
Tag Team Coaching Success Story
Post by: DanH78 on July 27, 2007, 09:23:10 AM
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How about a Fresca?
Post by: Robadat on July 27, 2007, 09:46:58 AM
For me, I would buy online over the pro shop if I can save over $40 on the complete purchase /w drilling & slugs. My pro shop has reasonable prices and I have made most purchases from him.
For most hi end balls, he will charge around $10 to $20 above what the best deal I can usually find online when all costs are factored in. Total nv in his shop is $205 out the door w/grips and slug and tax included. Tnv online $140 f/s plus $55 drilling w/ grips and slugs total $195. Since my pro shop will do free surface adjustments on any balls he sells, that extra $10 is a great investment IMHO and I won't hesitate to give him the sale for that ball.
His mid and lower priced lines also are similarly priced ($155 for the Whirlwind) in comparison to online deals so I will use his shop for those purchases also. My only complaint is that he does not carry a huge inventory, so many balls have to be ordered and he will have it in two days, but I can call ahead and he will have it when I show up, so it's really not a big deal. He knows my specs and style so he will get a blank with good specs that are favorable to drilling for my needs.
--------------------
"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." Ben Franklin
Enjoy,
Bob
Post by: Atochabsh on July 27, 2007, 09:51:57 AM
quote:
and as far as the local pro shop $45 for half hours work
That's an awfully quick drill. By the time we measure up someone, discuss drill patterns, map the ball, weigh the ball, drill the holes, reweigh the ball, get your hand back to the shop to fit and align the grips and fine tune the thumb hole, we have well over an hour into our customer. Of course our bridges don't crack from dull bits getting too hot from trying to drill too fast.
Erin
Post by: COYOTE on July 27, 2007, 10:47:01 AM
Post by: johns811 on July 27, 2007, 03:08:05 PM
Post by: 9orbetter on July 27, 2007, 03:44:37 PM
--------------------
We all can hit the pocket,just carry the damn corners
www.coachscornerproshop.com
Post by: chitown on July 27, 2007, 03:56:56 PM
If you are a bowler that knows layouts and don't need advice from the pro shop guy, then buying online is probably your best bet.
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This fall it's Raw Hammer Time!
Post by: Joe Jr on July 27, 2007, 04:13:14 PM
Example, I just drilled a Mystic that I bought NIB off Ebay for $78shipped
--------------------
My Vid (http://"http://media.putfile.com/new-48-28")
Formerly Brunswick Lefty & Richard Cranium
Quote from Conspirator300:
And yeah, I do know it all.. I don't spend 30+ hours a week learning more about bowling for my heatlh... I do it so I know more than all of you.. which I do. (besides the random few that are staffers/work in the bowling business.. which that population is decreasing little by little)
Post by: brinen28 on July 27, 2007, 04:27:58 PM
What if the price included Drilling, Inserts, Resurface, Revivor, and 5-10 cleaning/sand(or polish)
More of a maintenance package... Would you see the value in that, even though it would cost you more up front still?
Post by: Doug Sterner on July 27, 2007, 04:36:32 PM
$195 drilled, out the door with inserts and slug for anything high end like Ones, Infernos, Actions, Shifts, PAradigms etc....
$175 drilled for the Storm Fire Line or Black Widows
$155 drilled for the Thunderstruck or RAW Hammer line
$21.95 for inserts and a slug? I have a tough time getting $15
Wow...I am in the wrong area of the country.....
--------------------
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY
http://dougsproshop@aol.com
www.dougsproshop.net
Lane 1 Buzzsaw...The Official Power Tool Of Bowling
Post by: DanH78 on July 27, 2007, 04:41:04 PM
quote:
More of a maintenance package... Would you see the value in that, even though it would cost you more up front still?
The previous owner of the shop I go to used to offer that. One free set of grips, one (maybe 2 can't remember) resurface and 2 clean/polish. I thought it was a BRILLIANT idea. He didn't raise his prices when he did that either.
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How about a Fresca?
Post by: jls on July 27, 2007, 04:48:51 PM
quote:
Pro Shops charge way to much and if it was not for the internet we would not Know this. If we can purchase balls for $110 less then they are charging (you know they are paying less then this), They are charging way to much a 100% mark up should be
50% so that ball in the pro shop that is $219 should only cost $164. Then we would not have to buy ball of the internet and ccn return to the local pro shop.
sir, most prices that you pay online are in the same range as a pro shop pays from their dist.
if you really think pro shops are buying these balls so cheap and making a killing, RUN don't walk to your bank, get a loan, and open a pro shop.
and then you will see just how much they really pay for a ball.
AND YOU WILL NOT BE HAPPY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
--------------------
jls, proud owner of an American made car
Post by: on July 27, 2007, 04:55:37 PM
quote:quote:
Pro Shops charge way to much and if it was not for the internet we would not Know this. If we can purchase balls for $110 less then they are charging (you know they are paying less then this), They are charging way to much a 100% mark up should be
50% so that ball in the pro shop that is $219 should only cost $164. Then we would not have to buy ball of the internet and ccn return to the local pro shop.
sir, most prices that you pay online are in the same range as a pro shop pays from their dist.
if you really think pro shops are buying these balls so cheap and making a killing, RUN don't walk to your bank, get a loan, and open a pro shop.
and then you will see just how much they really pay for a ball.
AND YOU WILL NOT BE HAPPY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
jls, proud owner of an American made car
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------
AMEN!!!
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notclay
Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
"The problem is no that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem." ~ Theodore Rubin
Post by: jls on July 27, 2007, 05:09:14 PM
what really cracks me up is when some people come on and knock pro shops for trying to make a profit. yet these same people, work a job, and expect to get paid, plus benifits.
i wonder what they would say if they were asked to work for no pay { no profit }
but you see, its ok, cause its them, and they feel they have a right to get paid for working. but pro shops who have boo koo expenses, don't have a right to make a profit.
and what really cracks me up is that so many of these "paid workers" spend most of their day online, while being paid to work.
and they have the nerve to knock pro shops for making a profit!!!!!
unbelievable.
Edited on 7/28/2007 8:45 AM
Post by: jls on July 27, 2007, 05:15:36 PM
quote:
Playndag's got 15lb NIB Track stuff out the wazoo (Rick). Just bought a (once again) 15lb NIB Track EQUATION for $60, shipping included! Unbeatable. His e-mail address is 300 Global related. Maybe that has something to do with these things selling so dirt cheap.
Whatever!
yes if so, it is so nice to see the people at global 300 undercutting pro shops.
yes, that makes me want to run out an order their new line of balls.
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jls, proud owner of an American made car
Post by: qstick777 on July 27, 2007, 07:17:54 PM
For me, most shops don't have what I'm looking for in my weight (14lb), so they have to order it.
I have 30-45 minutes to drive to the shop, another 30-60 minutes of hanging out, shooting the breeze and catching up and finally getting the ball ordered.
Then I have to wait a couple of days for the ball to arrive, drive another 30-45 minutes to the shop, spend another 60-90 minutes for them to either a) pull measurements off existing equipment, b) find my drill sheet, or c) remeasure me, discuss the layout, drill and adjust the fit.
Or, I can go on-line and order the ball and take it in to be drilled.
Of course I have my own drill press now, so I can just do it myself. I'm still learning, so I still give business to the local shops on new stuff. For the most part it is hard to beat the local prices - rarely see anything over $210 drilled, although they all charge for inserts and slugs.
The use the Black Widow as an example, I believe the shops are selling them for $195. Add another $15 for inserts and slugs, so that's $210. If I buy it on-line it's $120-130 shipped, and another $10 for inserts and slug ($2.50 per insert and $5 per slug). I'm just using Buddie's as an example.
So, I have $128.50 for ball, and $10 for inserts and slugs. That's $138.50. If I drill it myself (because doesn't everybody have their own drilling equipment?) I've saved around $70 (actually it's less because I forgot about tax at the local shop). Now, since most don't have their own drilling equipment, let's say I take it to the shop to drill. That's $60 for the drilling (no tax). I don't know if there is additional charge for installing my own inserts and slug (never tried that or asked about it), so I'm down to saving $10 and that first trip to the shop. Not really worth it to order on-line for me.
Savings are even less (or actually negative) on the mid-price and entry level balls! Most BVP type balls are $140-150 drilled, and I think Power Grooves are right around $100 (or less) drilled.
It's really only worth it when the ball is discontinued and/or heavily discounted.
Much better deal for me is to buy used balls as the local shops only charge $40-50 for a complete plug and re-drill, or $20 for just the thumb.
--------------------
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Edited on 7/27/2007 7:20 PM
Post by: Derek on July 27, 2007, 07:48:06 PM
too bad the dick drilled it for early rolling when i asked for late...so i traded it off....
took the big shot i got in trade to a pro shop 3 miles away from that one...they are pretty much out of employees...so it was not quick...but after shooting the crap with the pro shop guy for an hour or so...and really letting them take their time with the ball...over a month...
plugged + redrill + inserts cost me $23.
i will be going there from now on...even with the wait...at least they will drill what i want....
Post by: on July 27, 2007, 07:54:54 PM
Give the customer a reason to want you to be profitable, so you'll be around for years to come taking care of their bowling needs.
--------------------
notclay
Lane Carter, Strike Zone Pro Shops - Salt Lake City, Utah
"The problem is no that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem." ~ Theodore Rubin
Post by: fins4ever88 on July 27, 2007, 07:58:05 PM
I recently bought a Red Zone from one of my "local" pro shops (half an hour away, not exactly local), for $205 drilled. I did this because I wanted a new opinion on drillings, rather than seeing the same guy. He was able to replicate my span perfectly with the Red Zone and the Power Drive I asked him to fix, which is something 2 other pro shops couldn't do correctly in multiple balls. At his shop, he charges $50 for drilling with inserts and slugs. My actual local pro shop, though he's not much of a driller, also charges $50 for drilling with inserts and slugs. The pro shop that I go to the most charges me $30 for drilling a blank, but I get a discount for being a youth bowler in his program.
The pro shop I go to the most charges about $210 for high-end equipment, $170 for mid-price, and then $100 for the entry level stuff. Inserts are another $20 for slugs and tips. Though, if you're a league bowler, I think there's a 10% off discount too.
--------------------
---Ryan
Post by: Gunny on July 27, 2007, 09:42:29 PM
i'm sure you wouldnt go to one dealership and pay top dollar for the car you want. a smart person would shop around to get the best deal. but according to some, that would be wrong because that dealership you just left, the salesman came up with empty pockets and we are suppose to worry about it. if your smart you check the internet, cause most dealerships will give 1-3000$ off because you saw it on the internet and drove the extra 50-70+ miles to come get it. you can call it penny pinching or whatever, but to me its smart shopping. remember, not everybody has a pro shop who works with their customers and gives deals and whatnot. if everything was the same everywhere, life would be boring.
some shops do have decent prices and some are through the roof. but regardless, my money goes where i feel it should, and most people feel the same.
Post by: Gunny on July 27, 2007, 10:29:45 PM
quote:
but you have to watch out because some proshops charge more for a nib ball that you bring in. my friend bought the gforce online and paid 90 bucks to get his ball drilled. (switchgrip, finger/thumb inserts) i couldnt believe it.
ouch!
Post by: Xfest on July 27, 2007, 11:57:13 PM
I simply stated our pro-shop's prices. 60 Dollars for an outside ball, grips and slugs 21.95. 81.95$ to drill an online ball. 61.95 to drill an in shop ball.
I support my shop, but hey, I work there part-time, why not? I get employee discounts, so I could careless how much we are making on customers. I know we do get about 50% markup on our prices although. I was stating our prices if a customer were to buy from bowling.com - and to the pro-shop.
Post by: strikestriketapped on July 28, 2007, 12:05:56 AM
--------------------
www.stormbowling.com
Post by: Strider on July 28, 2007, 12:13:46 AM
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Post by: Smash49 on July 28, 2007, 06:34:39 AM
Smash49
--------------------
Smash49
Slick, tacky, wood or synthetic it does not matter your slide is correct with Bowlers Slide Sock. The Finest Slide Sock on the Planet!!!
www.bowlersslidesock.com
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Post by: laufaye on July 28, 2007, 12:16:47 PM
The imbalance in pricing between the local pro shops and internet retailers is the problem here, its not a how pro shop should make money and is not where the customers should buy.
Bottom line is the online price is too close to the cost of the pro shop from distributor. So either the distributors selling to internet retailers lower then what they charge us or the distributors carging pro shop a lot more. Remember only need 1 distributor sell to internet retailers then the system is done.
Solution is manufacturer enforce MSRP on all retail levels, internet or local pro shops.
--------------------
Laufaye
Post by: laufaye on July 28, 2007, 12:27:30 PM
quote:
I have got to say that if I could get the prices in my shop that some of you guys are quoting I could quit my day job and drill fulltime.
$195 drilled, out the door with inserts and slug for anything high end like Ones, Infernos, Actions, Shifts, PAradigms etc....
$175 drilled for the Storm Fire Line or Black Widows
$155 drilled for the Thunderstruck or RAW Hammer line
$21.95 for inserts and a slug? I have a tough time getting $15
Wow...I am in the wrong area of the country.....
--------------------
Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY
http://dougsproshop@aol.com
www.dougsproshop.net
Lane 1 Buzzsaw...The Official Power Tool Of Bowling
Doug,
No disrespect Doug. I am pretty sure you know your price is a tad low compare to most others. If you are good and I beleive you are, you raise the price they still come to you, point is if your price is too low, you are not making decent living, and you are not happy, and the shops next door can not charge more, assuming you are the best in the area, when they cannot charge more they cut corners, lower the quality of services, the is a dead end street.
I am the highest in the area, I wish the other shops charge more as well, we need to make a living, and the pricing in the pro shop business now, we all under pay.
I charge $50 for a blank drill, grips 15, slug 15, switchgrip 35. I spend atleast 45 mins on a customer to drill a ball. I call a plumber to fix something $96 an hour and parts extra.
Lets charge what we deserved.
--------------------
Laufaye
Post by: Kinalyx on July 28, 2007, 06:33:31 PM
BWP - $125 shipped online, $75 total for drilling, grips, slug & tax, & sometimes i get a break on that.
BWP - $219 at the pro shop, then add the $25 for grips, & tax on all of it & im over $250.
Im sorry, but pro shops just cant compete with onine shops, they cant order the amount online shops do, thus, online shops get more discounts from suppliers.
Shawn
Post by: nextbowler on July 28, 2007, 08:28:50 PM
your money?
Post by: Doug Sterner on July 28, 2007, 08:36:31 PM
You are getting raped by your shop guy for slug/inserts...Inserts are $5.00 per pair and slugs are $5.00 each. Would make more sense to me to buy your own slugs and inserts and take them in with the ball.
Would he charge you the slug/insert fee even if you brought your own???
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Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY
http://dougsproshop@aol.com
www.dougsproshop.net
Lane 1 Buzzsaw...The Official Power Tool Of Bowling
Edited on 7/28/2007 8:52 PM
Post by: toomanytenpins on July 29, 2007, 03:12:50 AM
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my style, the art of bowling without bowling
Post by: Buzzhead on July 29, 2007, 08:47:33 AM
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FAILURE IS FEEDBACK. AND FEEDBACK IS THE BREAKFAST OF CHAMPIONS THAT GOT DIGESTED!
Ten pin?????? Where?? I throw a BUZZSAW there is NUTTIN left on the deck...
Proud MEMBER of the FOS!!
Member of the FOS, if there happens to be a 9 pin standing just toss a saw and cut it down~~!
Post by: 1MechEng on July 29, 2007, 09:21:22 AM
The interesting thing is that the cost of shipping is approx. to the cost of tax in my area (on a med. level ball), so that part is a wash.
Generally, the problem I have with the local pro-shops is the hours and selection. They are smaller shops, and don't have the variety that I can easily find online. They are also not open until 9pm - when I can do most of my shopping in the evening. (They close right after leagues start at 7-7:30pm)
My $.02 worth.
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======================
Dan
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Engineering * Bowling = a fun and practical application of rotational kinematics.
Post by: Doug Sterner on July 29, 2007, 09:32:27 AM
I try to keep my overhead as low as possible to keep the funding as liquid as I can since I can order anything and have it within 2 days. I'll order in whatever you want.
Just let me know.
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Doug Sterner
Doug's Pro Shop
Owego, NY
http://dougsproshop@aol.com
www.dougsproshop.net
Lane 1 Buzzsaw...The Official Power Tool Of Bowling
Post by: C-G ProShop-Carl on July 29, 2007, 10:17:24 AM
I will give you an example of my problem with online bowling retailers. There is an online retailer that is LOCAL....roughly an hour from me. He was selling a ball for $119 SHIPPED! I know for a fact that he goes through the same distributor that I do. For me to purchase this same ball cost was $143. For a pro shop that makes it very difficult to be competitive.
One of the major things that customers do not think when they walk into a pro shop is about the overhead that we have. We have to stock equipment to have a respectful looking business. I am not sure if many of you realize how much equipment is that is used to drill in a pro shop. Just the mills in both of my locations total cost of $21,000. I know what many of you are thinking, "I bought my drill press and jig for "$500". There is a huge difference in quality between what most of you have at home and the equipment required by most pro shops. The mills that I have are accurate far beyond what the old style presses and jigs are. I need this type of accuracy when it comes to my customers' equipment. How about the price of a Haus Machine and ball spinner? You can throw in an engraver as well. Measuring tools for spans. Lets not forget the Kaufman scale and drill bits. Nothing related to bowling is cheap....particularly the equipment required to run a pro shop PROFESSIONALLY.
Other things to consider are the utility bills, various insurances, and the necessary training to run and operate a pro shop. By training I am talking about properly fitting someone. I know not alot of pro shop operators do this, but I am using myself and my employees as examples.
With everything above stated....let me say this: I have no problem with someone bringing me a ball they purchased online. I tell customers if they can find a ball online and save $40+ on a ball then it is worth it. The only thing they need to be made aware of are the warranty issues. If the ball cracks they have to go back through online retailer.
The new program being put in place will help pro shops. One price selling to distributors will assure the pro shops that they are getting the same prices as the monster online retailers.
-Carl
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Carl Hurd
C-G Pro Shop (owner/operator)
with locations in:
Youngstown Ohio (West Side Lanes)
and
Boardman Ohio (Camelot Lanes)
Track Intl- Tech Support
The Legion Lives @ www.trackbowling.com
Tag Team Member #1
TAG TEAM COACHING!!!!!!/Co-Founder
Post by: Smash49 on July 29, 2007, 12:42:46 PM
I know you were out in Las Vegas back in June. Don't know how much you dropped there but I can tell you about our bills. Our companies dropped $7000 between Pro Shop Operations and Slide Sock trade show. We were there for 2 weeks taking the IBPSIA HOTS Technical and HOTS Business classes for running a Pro Shop. Not to mention the 2 weeks hotel rooms, some meals, tips, and other expenditures. Our Pro Shop was manned with a limited staff for that time and that cost us. The experience was fantastic and the knowledge/information is already being put to use.
Many people do not have a clue as to what is involved in running Pro Shop. It's expensive and time consuming. We spend more time working at other areas of the business than actually drilling. Over the last week we have been upgrading our register system with a new version of Ebonite Pro Shop Coordinator, taking inventory, assigning stock numbers and creating bar codes. Yesterday we installed new cabinets. Today I am creating signage for displays and making up flyers. Ask someone that thinks they can drill out of their house about marketing??? HMMMM. It takes some thought to have business. Why do Pro Shop do these things??? To provide a better service and keep cost down for their customers.
Smash49
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Smash49
Slick, tacky, wood or synthetic it does not matter your slide is correct with Bowlers Slide Sock. The Finest Slide Sock on the Planet!!!
www.bowlersslidesock.com
www.strikingcatbowling.com
Post by: laufaye on July 29, 2007, 01:38:36 PM
Great points there, some customer will understand and some don't even care. As long as they can save a dime they go somewhere else. They only talking about bottom line, and also same as pro shop owners. Of course, this kind of customers are still small portion.
Again, I really hope the big boys can really implement a better pricing structure in the distributors level. Wait and see....
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Laufaye
Post by: Gunny on July 29, 2007, 02:12:21 PM
quote:
Ask someone that thinks they can drill out of their house about marketing??? HMMMM. It takes some thought to have business. Why do Pro Shop do these things??? To provide a better service and keep cost down for their customers.
Smash49
not everyone is inferior to a pro shop owner. i drill out of my home...and hmmm.....i have run a 20 million dollar a year business in retail, marketing, and merchandising. in a business where you only make pennies off the dollar. so marketing and merchandising and having "THOUGHT" was well amongst my abilities. to humbly think that nobody knows the ins and outs of a business, is foolishness. in all my years in business only one thing is held above others and that is customer satisfaction. years ago, service and loyalty were the "KEY", but all that has changed.
customers are now satisfied with reasonable prices and decent service. and sure, there are pro shops that offer those things. but like myself and others we have pro shops who charge $175-200+ for a high end ball, drilling free $15 for grips, $10 for slug....=$210-240w/tax on a ball! i can get that same ball for $75-125+, take to pro shop(if you dont have a press), $35 for drilling, $15 for grips, $10 for slug....=$140-190w/tax....you would save anywhere from $50 to 100 bones. and you call us stupid because we saved money. i think we are pretty smart. if i had a pro shop that would sell me a high end ball for $175, including grips, slug, tax drilling fee, hell i would by from them. but i dont have that luxury.
and as smart as i am, i will find optional routes. if you claim that you have too much inventory in your shop and thats why your prices are high, than you are not a very smart business man. a smart one would only purchase what he needs and as needed. having "DEAD STOCK" in a store is the downfall of any business. if that "DEAD STOCK" doesnt turn, your stuck with having to make up for the loss.
some say a pro shop shouldnt apologize for making a huge profit, well dont complain when the consumer goes elsewhere to purchase....that amounts to the majority of all consumers.
bottom line, like myself and others have stated, our money will be spent how we decide fittingly. whether online or out of a pro shop. it doesnt make neither parties wrong, its a business, and consumers and owners will do as they please!
remember its not about living life, but how you live it!
Post by: Spider Ball Bowler on July 29, 2007, 02:16:58 PM
If every shop offered the services of measuring things like PAP and whatever else and took the time to watch you throw a ball in order to recommend drillings and also to properly measure PAP and the other stuff, I don't think it would be a bad thing to spend more on their services.
However when I can go online and get a ball for $100 and pay $40-$60 for drilling and save $50-$70 on something when regardless of where I bought the ball I'd be getting the same crappy service, well I think I would go with saving the money.
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Formerly SGC300
Post by: Smash49 on July 29, 2007, 04:44:21 PM
quote:
not everyone is inferior to a pro shop owner. i drill out of my home...and hmmm.....i have run a 20 million dollar a year business in retail, marketing, and merchandising. in a business where you only make pennies off the dollar. so marketing and merchandising and having "THOUGHT" was well amongst my abilities.
Nobody said anything about inferior!!! ??? (The intent of the post.)
I am saying is that some people all they see is the cost of a slug and the cost of an insert and think Pro Shops are ripping them off. Some may be who knows. $21.95 is high???
You must know then the cost, time and effort it takes to market???
$35 to drill a ball is also cheap in some areas.
Sure there are good and bad drillers in garages and Pro Shops both. Just because you own a Pro Shop doesn't mean you are a good ball driller and just because you drill out of your hose doesn't mean you are not.
I don't remember stating I had an inventory problem because I do not? Some people may but ours turns fairly quickly. We take the top 3 Internet dealers average the price tack on drilling and that's the price. Slugs and inserts are additional. No we do not charge $21.95, more like $12.50 if you buy the ball from us.
We offer Internet competitive prices, quality services and coaching. If your Pro Shop in your area is not doing the same that is up to them. It is also up to you to decide if you want to do business with them.
This every week turns into a flame war that Pro Shops gouging people and blah blah blah.
Smash49
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Smash49
Slick, tacky, wood or synthetic it does not matter your slide is correct with Bowlers Slide Sock. The Finest Slide Sock on the Planet!!!
www.bowlersslidesock.com
www.strikingcatbowling.com
Post by: laufaye on July 30, 2007, 01:30:08 AM
Take those comment lightly, its not worth it at all. We are doing everything we can to make a living, and at the same time to service the customers the best we can, so they can have a better pro shop experience. Thats all it matters. Customer comes and goes, thats life.
By the way, I am charging $30 for grips and slug.
If its too high, I will be out of business soon, we'll see.....--------------------
Laufaye
Post by: Smash49 on July 30, 2007, 07:11:37 AM
Good point. You are in one of the most expensive areas of the country to live. Land prices are very high. You have to adjust for cost of living also. Where we are housing is about 1/3 the cost. $21.95 for Slug and inserts seems outrageous but so do $700,000 homes. It all depends upon where you are.
Smash49
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Smash49
Slick, tacky, wood or synthetic it does not matter your slide is correct with Bowlers Slide Sock. The Finest Slide Sock on the Planet!!!
www.bowlersslidesock.com
www.strikingcatbowling.com