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Author Topic: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss  (Read 20364 times)

morpheus

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How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« on: February 17, 2016, 06:02:32 PM »
This seems to be stirring some conversation on social media...not saying I agree with all these points but I respect his perspective.

https://www.11thframe.com/news/article/8199
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Gene J Kanak

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2016, 06:40:35 PM »
I think that both Voss and Murphy make worthwhile statements within their respective responses. I guess while part of me, like BV, longs for what bowling was like when I first started, where a 200 average was considered good, and people all crowded around to watch someone go for 300/800 because it just wasn't something that happened all that often, I'm not about digging in my heels. I believe that things adapt over time, and we must adapt with them. To me, the best bowlers are still the best bowlers. The two-handers out there winning tournaments are the ones who can execute shots. If winning were as simple as switching, everyone would do it. In the end, I don't know that there is much to take from this. People will dig their heels in on one side and trash the other, and we're likely to continue with this stalemate, which accomplishes very little.

ThomasBowling

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2016, 06:55:42 PM »
I'll never agree with someone who say 2 handers are cancer to the sport.
Nah they're not, they're attracting young people to the sport. The sport needs young people. Those people might get friends to join the bowling club they're in.

And as the USBC Masters show, it's very possible for us 1 handers to beat the 2 handers. Belmo didn't make it passed the qualifying rounds.
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Juggernaut

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2016, 06:56:04 PM »
 What happened was bowling lost its identity, and didnt know which way to turn, or what it wanted to be. When that happened, the floodgates were opened for all manner of changes to the sport, because there was nobody left to agree to say "NO" to anything that came along.

Traditionalists (I am one) wanted the sport to stay truer to its roots. Keep the game as simple as possible to play, limiting the technological advances to a minimum, and create and enforce rules of play designed to keep the sport simple to play, yet hard to master.

 What we got was a "free for all" because the leadership we had at the time was asleep at the wheel. Too many changes came along too quickly, and there was nobody left to say "Were not doing that, because it isnt good for the sport in the long run". Instead, and probably because of financial greed, anything that came along was deemed OK for bowling, and looked on as an improvement.

 Many of the things werent really improvements though. Change for improvement is one thing, but change simply for the sake of change is not improvement, its your leadership being financially coerced into allowing the people with deep pockets to instill anything beneficial for them into the sport, whether its good for the sport or not.

 The two handed thing is different. Mark Roth changed bowling forever, but not with technology. He used a superior athletic ability and style to create power that most did not have, and was able to use it to dominate, at least until that style became prevalent. I look at the two handers the same way. They have a style and ability that allows them to create more power than others. It may create a paradigm shift in who is considered "good" and who isnt, but at least they are a NATURAL progression, and not an artificially created "technological" one.

 Technology should've been granted a much more limited access to the arena, but to try to limit a players PHYSICAL ability is wrong. Mark Roth dominated because he could do something special and different with his own abilities. He changed the game forever with raw physical ability, and THAT is how sports should advance and change, not through artificial, technological means.

 Two handers? I say leave them alone and let them play. They have a special physical ability that SHOULD be dominant. You want to compete with it, then either get as good as you possibly can one handed and take your chances, or learn the two handed style yourself.

 Technology is artificial and should've been banned, or at least somewhat limited. Physical ability is NOT artificial, and should NEVER be banned, OR limited. The sport should ALWAYS progress along natural lines. Its slower that way, but better for the sport IN THE LONG RUN!
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morpheus

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2016, 06:57:36 PM »
Again, I don't agree with all of the points made, but at least Voss is trying to get people discussing the issues. The problem with Mr. Murphy's "future" is that it pales in comparison to the past and he seems to completely dismiss anyone that has an alternate point of view. I am admittedly not a fan of Mr. Murphy, but his response seems to have a very condescending tone and I'll leave it at that.
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Juggernaut

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2016, 07:01:00 PM »
Again, I don't agree with all of the points made, but at least Voss is trying to get people discussing the issues. The problem with Mr. Murphy's "future" is that it pales in comparison to the past and he seems to completely dismiss anyone that has an alternate point of view. I am admittedly not a fan of Mr. Murphy, but his response seems to have a very condescending tone and I'll leave it at that.

 I wondered if I was the only one who thought that.................
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DP3

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2016, 07:18:30 PM »
All of these guys with all of these "GRAND IDEAS TO FIX THE GAME" are completely neglecting the equipment side of the industry which employs tens of thousands of hardworking Americans.

These grand plans will eventually put 90+% of the workers employed by the ball companies and pro shops. Everytime something like this comes up it's ridiculous to me/. Now if you want to mandate those rules for your own competitive bowling tour to showcase "proper bowling" then what's stopping you from starting it? Oh yeah, cause you don't really want change, you just want to complain about how these "millennials know nothing about the good ole days".

trash heap

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2016, 07:21:46 PM »
Hate to use a comparison to another sport but here it goes:

What is the main reason that Major League Baseball prohibit the use of metal bats?

 

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xrayjay

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2016, 07:27:02 PM »
two handed delivery? how can this be physically possible?
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ThomasBowling

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2016, 07:33:53 PM »
two handed delivery? how can this be physically possible?

It's not really 2 handed delivery, it's still 1 handed on the delivery part.
Right when the 2 handers is about to rev the ball they move the supporting hand away.
They use an extra hand to support the ball until it's at the part of the swing where you're supposed to rev the ball to get the best hook.

If they'd use the supporting hand to create extra rev with that too, then they'd break the fingers that are in the ball :P
Most used:
Motiv Venom Shock (14)
DV8 Grudge Hybrid (14)
Hammer Scandal (14)
DV8 Freakshow (14)

Sometimes.
C300 Swerve (14)
Motiv Jackal LE (14)

Retired:
Roto Grip Sinister (13)
Motiv Jackal (14)

Given to a no-thumber in the club:
Brunswick T-zone (13)

Might stick with Motiv from now on.

kidlost2000

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2016, 08:27:05 PM »
Read the article and I think Brian Voss has a great idea for completely killing bowling. I think it is nothing short of insanely awful.

All these people and their brilliant ideas for saving bowling really seem to miss something similar to one of my local bowling centers. Have a local bowling alley that thinks it is only required to open the doors and bowlers should fill the place and that is all that is required.

Never read much about people trying to talk with friends or co-workers into going bowling for fun, or joining a league together. Maybe having a work league. League bowlers in a lot of ways are dicks to the rest of the population when it comes to bowling. They typically do nothing to try and bring more bowlers in, only complain and gripe about others that are bowling for any number of reasons.

Can't imagine why this along with other factors out dated in bowling would drive people away. Adapt and change to stay current or get left behind. Bowling in many ways is getting left behind.
…… you can't  add a physics term to a bowling term and expect it to mean something.

bcw1969

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2016, 09:44:02 PM »
I appreciated what Voss had to say. Although I disagree about the 2 handers and thumbless--have no problem with it. I recall years ago when I was in the YABA , it was in the national rules about having to deliver a ball with the thumb in it..maybe now that we have the usbc governing everything, maybe that rule is no longer in effect?

It would seem that many people think that bowling has come too far one way, to now all of a sudden backtrack in equipment and oiling etc. ....but one thing bowling could do is address the pins.  Over this past new years weekend I bowled in a couple events in my state one day. One was a lumberjack event, where they were using heavier pins--5 pounds I believe--they put out just a house shot for the event--I had never done this type of event before and it was tough, strikes were really hard to come by. Actually the day before I went there...Walter Ray Williams Jr. tried a couple squads in this tournament.. it was 2 games ...and his best 2 game block he only averaged about 190 or so.  Maybe not 5 pounders, but I believe that would be a way to bring the scoring and "competitive" environment back to where it used to be without messing with the modern equipment and oils/oiling patterns.

Brad

guysensei1

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2016, 10:16:51 PM »
two handed delivery? how can this be physically possible?
https://youtu.be/vOij1prDhmI

northface28

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2016, 10:44:03 PM »
All of these guys with all of these "GRAND IDEAS TO FIX THE GAME" are completely neglecting the equipment side of the industry which employs tens of thousands of hardworking Americans.

These grand plans will eventually put 90+% of the workers employed by the ball companies and pro shops. Everytime something like this comes up it's ridiculous to me/. Now if you want to mandate those rules for your own competitive bowling tour to showcase "proper bowling" then what's stopping you from starting it? Oh yeah, cause you don't really want change, you just want to complain about how these "millennials know nothing about the good ole days".

Exactly, just another old time stuck in the glory days. Its really sad actually to see BV old and bitter and longing for something that is totally ridiculous. Funny how guys complain about this "powerful equipment" but have bags full of these "cheater balls". Voss is a cry baby, has been for awhile, but since he is revered by a lot of old farts, his points are "valid".
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xrayjay

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Re: How to fix bowling by Brian Voss
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2016, 11:49:53 PM »
The Bottom line is......... hook really does sells. And bowling can't go backwards permanently with rubber balls and white dots. BV and Machuga really do love their sport, but what can they do? Nothing, but voice their opinion.

Well, I guess continue to have their "no two handed" bowlers allowed tourney.
Does a round object have sides? I say yes, pizza has triangles..

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