BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: suhoney24 on September 05, 2014, 09:03:51 PM
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Can someone please recommend a really good ball for when they are super heavy? I have tried everything and nothing wants to move all...straight as an arrow not matter where I move or what line I try...so far I have tried a deadly aim sanded to 500, crazy antics at 1000, widow assassin at box, original dude at 2000 and a vibe envy at 360...I have medium rev...
Was looking at a...cruel intent, original mastermind or a marvel s
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With those outrageously low grits, you make me wonder if you are seeing much lighter oil than you think you are and the balls are burning up.
The Hyper Cell is a particle ball, one of the most aggressive balls on the market right now. If you're truly seeing heavy oil, drill it for an early roll with pin and PSA set for that (2.5" pin-PAP, short Drill angle, like 25-30 degrees) and sand it to 500 grit. If that ball doesn't hook, drop your ball speed down to 15 mph or take up needlepoint.
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I would say Mastermind , Ruckus Feud or Hyper Cell. If you cant get those to move something is wrong.
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pivot point
absolute beast
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With those outrageously low grits, you make me wonder if you are seeing much lighter oil than you think you are and the balls are burning up.
i had all balls at box finish and was slowly tinkering with surface to see if i could get any type of reaction...
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Go To BOWLERSCELLAR.COM and grab yourself a visionary centaur amb particle bowling ball...they still have 14 pounders available. The most aggressive "reactive" bowling ball ever. I had one and a teammate of mine had one around the time they came out, and that ball is ridiculously strong, that'll get it done.
Brad
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Of the three you were pondering, my vote would be the original mastermind. It has proven to perform well on heavy oil. Currently that is my go to heavy oil ball. No complaints with it on a lot of oil, but will burn up on light conditions, just like any other heavy oil ball.
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My original mastermind is my best scoring ball ever when I see enough oil to throw it (more oil than I am comfortable throwing my primal rage on)
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Is anyone else having a problem?
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My vote would be a Sinister. I drilled one up a few days ago and this thing hooks for days, plus it's more angular and continuous than any other heavy oil ball I've seen. The hit and drive is significantly better. Where other heavy oil balls may be sluggish and flat on the backend, this one still hooks AND transitions well.
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Is anyone else having a problem?
yes...everyone seems to be...the best 2 guys in our league last year that were averaging 220+ are only at 190 and 195 so far...and everyone else is in the 160-180...it seems that some of the guys that throw a straight ball are having the best games so far
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Go To BOWLERSCELLAR.COM and grab yourself a visionary centaur amb particle bowling ball...they still have 14 pounders available. The most aggressive "reactive" bowling ball ever. I had one and a teammate of mine had one around the time they came out, and that ball is ridiculously strong, that'll get it done.
Brad
+1
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9xGfFsQlgDQ
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Like the others have said, there is the Hyper Cell, Mastermind, and the Ruckus Feud are all solid choices for the soup. You could even get the Motiv Raptor Talon which is up there in strength too. A new option that's just coming out is the Seismic Equalizer, which looks really good based on the reaction videos posted.
There was a similar situation last season at the start in my league where the people who would normally play in ran into a ton of problems whereas the outside line worked best. Turns out there was a problem with the oil machine where it was putting down extra volume than it should have. Either way, it forced everyone to adjust.
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Terminator Juggernaut by Lane Masters, ball is not usable for me in any house in my hometown due to the amount of oil required to keep this ball on the Lane.
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thanks for all the reply's guys, i appreciate you all giving me a few seconds of your time for some feedback
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Do you know what type of pattern and oil they are putting down? I know some centers locally are putting down flatter patterns on certain leagues. Not a sport shot, but something not as forgiving as the THS.
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If it's the Badger I could sort of understand why. I've seen people throwing Hyper Cells on that thing and the balls go straight as an arrow. But instead of a new ball maybe just make some adjustments on the lane if you haven't already?
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There was a similar situation last season at the start in my league where the people who would normally play in ran into a ton of problems whereas the outside line worked best. Turns out there was a problem with the oil machine where it was putting down extra volume than it should have. Either way, it forced everyone to adjust.
+1. We had a problem last year in our league with the lane machine where it was laying oil all the way to the end of the deck. It took the manager a week or two to notice and fix the problem but it was basically forcing everyone to throw darts at the pocket and not even let the ball hook for the first game or two until some people were able to open up a dry spot. I would talk with the owner if you can and find out what pattern they are laying down and that may help determine if it's really a heavy oil pattern or an accident/machine issue that's causing the headaches.
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It is probably the length of the oil, more than the volume. In my experience trying to go with stronger surface to over come heavy long oil is a losing propostion. Look at the tour guys on Badger. They are not throwing hook monster shells.
You don't need hook to carry. You need strong roll. Guys who bowl best on long oil know how to square up and take what the lanes give them, often using strong rolling pearls.
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So based on your experience, in what situations should a strong shelled ball be used?
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I would use stronger shells when there is more volume. It blends it out. Just as an example, I tried using my Darkness @4000 on Mexico City, and it was OK, but my Network, at the same surface prep, was easily 4-5 boards stronger with more on the back. Strong assym pearl vs stronger symmetrical solid.
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The question that needs to be resolved first is the volume that is out there and whether anything has changed in cleaning the backends...I have seen MANY centers through the years that had a moderate amount of conditioner up front but where the backends were not getting a hard strip. As such, carry-down was an issue even at the beginning of a set.
This can hold true on wood OR synthetics...
Of course the other thing that was always fun to watch was the people that expected to ALWAYS be able to cover a gazillion boards instead of taking what the lanes will give.
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Michelle
+1, very well written and some thought put into it.
If your not getting the reaction you think you should, the above could be the reason.
Bob
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Not that i expected he lanes to "hook the world"....all im saying is im using a whole range of balls and seeing absolutly nothing reactuon wise...
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Are you bowling on a pba experience league or just a house shot league? I have only experienced this a couple times and this was due to incompetant lane guys putting oil in buffer tank and buffer in oil tank and if that what you got going on it wont matter what you drill. Otherwise i agree with above posters. Mastermind, hyper cell, rukus fued, 900 global moxie.
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Regular house shot...like i said its not just me...theres a guy on storm staff who was 226 last year and so far is only at 195
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A ball does not hook and roll on oil. A bowlling ball needs friction for the transition. If the lanes are that heavy with oil, no ball is going to work. It seems that you will have to play straight and probably slow your ball speed down. You have to work with what the lanes will give you.
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Regular house shot...like i said its not just me...theres a guy on storm staff who was 226 last year and so far is only at 195
and you still haven't addressed the questions about volume or stripping practices...
The ball surface isn't the entire thing to look at- as others aptly note, changing the roll to get the ball into a roll earlier is a release issue as much as anything else. The other thing is to not spend so much time getting hung up on numbers- if everyone else is also down average-wise then do the smart thing and don't overthink the lanes. Take what they will give you and work on spares.
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...it seems that some of the guys that throw a straight ball are having the best games so far
Ever watched some of the US Open footage? Accuracy is a must and they aren't looking to cover boards...
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I still recommend a Sinister. It hooks as much or more than most of the other heavy oil balls on the market, plus you get a stronger more definitive movement on the backend with continuation and hit. We've all had several discussions about bowling ball technology and where it's going or not going, but the Sinister still stands out to me as perhaps THE best heavy oil ball on the market right now. We'll have to see what Motiv's Jackal and Storm's Crux does, but for now, the Sinister outhooks the Mastermind, Zero Gravity, Hyper Cell, Ruckus Feud, etc., with a better transition on the backend, better energy retention, and better continuation. I have to say I've also NEVER seen a ball that hooks this much that plays this well from extreme angles. I was playing 5th arrow the other night pitching it to the 5 board (house shot, just playing with it), and it was finishing driving through the 8 pin. Been a long time since I was this impressed with a ball.
That aside, I still agree with what several of the recent posters have said.
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I was told tonight its not a very heavy pattern...just a lot longer then last year...38 feet versus 42 this year
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42 ft of oil, even fully flat, would not make the ball go 60ft. It would be better in my opinion to get a coach to watch you bowl on this pattern and make suggestions. You don't really have anything too strong in the bag but with 42ft, you shouldn't be trying to cover boards and you exit point should be 11 at 42 ft. No further out. It sounds to me like you're trying to cover boards on a pattern that isn't meant to do so. What are your stats?
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I agree that 42 ft isn't that long of a pattern.
Maybe I missed it but I haven't seen anywhere in the postings about where on the lane are you trying to play?
Are you trying to swing the lane, playing out by the ditch?
Where?
Are both lefties and righties having the same issues?
Just trying to get some more info to help get some ideas on how to help you out.
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I agree that 42 ft isn't that long of a pattern.
Maybe I missed it but I haven't seen anywhere in the postings about where on the lane are you trying to play?
Are you trying to swing the lane, playing out by the ditch?
Where?
Are both lefties and righties having the same issues?
Just trying to get some more info to help get some ideas on how to help you out.
Great points. That's where I'm trying to go with my post. I've been on the lanes where the machine laid out oil to the pin deck. That's the only way the ball is going "straight as an arrow". I especially didn't pay attention to his post about the surfaces on his equipment. 360 on an entry level ball will make the ball hook at your feet and do nothing else. 500 on your deadly aim will make it dead. So that's where I would I would start.
That's why you need to find out if the shot's going to continuously put out during that league. That way you know it's going to be something you're going to HAVE to deal with. So then you work on you. What are your stats? What do you do when your ball doesn't hook? Do you tighten up? Do you become more inaccurate? T
hen that's where a coach comes in and works with those issues because as I continue to regurgitate "oil is the ultimate test of skill". Then you can work with your equipment. Working with surfaces that work for you on that pattern. Layouts and weight holes that help you on that pattern. It may just be that you need a pearl that bleeds slower rather than a oiler that soaks up what little oil you have left. Just my opinion on how I'd attack it.
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I agree with several other replies, it sounds like the problem is how you (and others) are playing the lanes. I know just balling up or down has become the norm these days, but some conditions just require more skill than that. Instead of changing balls, or buying a ball to beat the condition, learn how to play it. You said a couple of guys that play straighter normally aren't having any issues. I would take a look at what kind of a line/gear they are playing, and try to emulate it. Remember, it's not how many boards your ball hooks, it's where your ball hooks. If the shot is only giving you 3 boards of hook, your goal should be to have that 3 board hook finish into the pocket.
I had a chance to bowl on the Badger pattern this summer, and was able to score very well. Using a stronger ball wasn't the key, in fact I found my Tropical Breeze to work best. What worked was keeping the ball very tight to the pocket, and letting what little backend I was getting finish into the pocket.
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A lot of pretty good bowlers would agree with you Eddie.