Why is Storm so popular? What makes them so special? I see so many bowlers in my area throwing Storm but I also hear so many people talk about how they wont throw Storm ever again, its weird... I have a 50% success rate with Storm. Half the balls have been duds. I just don't get it

Wow long (but good) post when could simply say maybe a little bit of talking down a rival.  Motiv tends to be just as splashy which draws some fire marketing wise naturally.  Have good balls from virtually everyone at this point.  Individual balls over brands always.

true, but I was bored at work. still am 

all out of love with Luke. I remember when I was on Storm staff and he had his old username, we would do battle with Storm and their Marketing tactics. Just a slow day at work and felt compelled to give him something to think about

Quote from: HackJandy on January 03, 2018, 01:32:30 PM

Wow long (but good) post when could simply say maybe a little bit of talking down a rival.  Motiv tends to be just as splashy which draws some fire marketing wise naturally.  Have good balls from virtually everyone at this point.  Individual balls over brands always.

true, but I was bored at work. still am 

Bored at work too of course but too lazy to put a post like that together unless it involves Mr. Murphy's leadership. 

My only point is having balls in a certain place and them being good are two different things lol. . the last few releases are better, and anything that says Jackal on it is going to be good, but when you watch Motiv staffers and they're all either throwing Venom Shocks or getting pissy with everything else that goes 60 feet unless it's at 500 grit (obvious exaggeration here played for impactful effect) . . 4 years ago though?  Different story.  Sigma Tour, Covert Revolt, and silver Tribal are still 3 of my favorites ever, Motiv was legit making the best stuff on the market 4 years ago, and with that 1 ball at a time release schedule, if it's not very good, that hurts a lot more than releasing 3 at a time and having 1 suck.  Venom Shock is IQ Tour/Hyroad level stuff though, they should keep that in production indefinitely.  Maybe what I really meant was that Motiv and DV8 are in the worst places right now or their down period is the most recent. 

Quote from: Luke Rosdahl on January 02, 2018, 08:52:39 AM

I'd have to agree, it's a pretty competitive market right now and I'd say if anything, out of the major brands, DV8 and Motiv are making the worst stuff right now.  But, everyone is making retro stuff, and who are the two youngest companies?  I'd argue they've both got some good stuff in their past, but it's just too soon to go back to the well because stuff like the Brutal Nightmare and Sigma Tour are still too fresh on people's minds. 

Black Widow and gas mask core are names.  The One series is memorable, if not all the balls were that great, plus the Gamebreaker series.  IQ and Hyroad, nuff said, Inferno and Quantum, also nuff said.  Radical is a one trick pony, but that one trick is pretty good.  Roto Grip just got on board by bringing the Nucleus core from the Cell back, and with the new Hyper Cell.  Of course, I'd also argue that all the other companies are making better new stuff than DV8 and Motiv, but that just makes it worse . .

I find Luke's comments intriguing. Quoting to comeback later and discuss.


Slow day at work, so I'll bite as a fan boy of Motiv.

I do not think Motiv is in the bottom 2 in regards to equipment. It is actually more comparable to Storm, and better in some regards. Where to start? I will compare balls I guess.

Strong Dull Asym
Storm has the Sure Lock and Motiv has the Jackal Ghost (Rising technically hasn't released, but is sooner and stronger than Ghost). BTM gives the Sure Lock a little more hook overall (Rising competes better with the Sure Lock) and the Ghost a little more length and backend. 2 pretty comparable balls. Motiv also has the Trident that is slightly weaker and longer than both of the other 2 balls mentioned.

Strong Shiny Asym
Storm has the Intense and Code Red. Motiv has the Trident Quest. The Quest shows to be the longest and strongest of the 3, per BTM again. I feel the Intense and Quest are similar where as the Red is more of a niche ball with the weaker cover.

Strong Dull Sym
This is where Motiv has dropped the ball, imo. But it doesn't mean that they are in left field. They offer the Forza SS, which is a very early and smooth ball. The only other option is the Chronic Paranoia. Storm offers the Phaze II and the HyRoad Nano. Per BTM, The Phaze II and Nano have the same hook potential at 56, with the SS at 55 and the Chronic at 57. Once again, 4 balls under an umbrella. I find the Chronic and Phaze II to be similar when bowled on the same conditions with a slight nod to the Phaze II for continuation. The SS is just a strong banana. The Hyroad Nano is very cover strong and I am on the fence with my review of this one.

Strong shiny Sym
Storm offers the Timeless, HyRoad and HyRoad Pearl. Motiv offers the Primal Fear, United Revolt, and Lethal Paranoia. Timeless was... let's just say it left a lot to be desired. HyRoad is daddy in this category. The Primal Fear is a good ball, but nothing to buy twice. It is more comparable to the HyRoad Pearl in my eyes after having both. The United Revolt is comparable to the discontinued Marvel Pearl. Heavy rolling pearl that does not flip off of the pattern on the backend. BTM actually rates all of the Motiv balls as stronger than the Storm ones in this category.

Weaker Dull Sym
And now the best balls for both brands (minus HyRoad). The !Q Tour and the Venom Shock. Both balls are the best on the market for what they are. Dull low RG, low diff balls that are flat great on most patterns for most bowlers.

Weaker Shiny Sym
Both companies have good and bad balls in this category. Tough as to who to give the nod to. Storm has the Match UP series and Tropical Series. Motiv has the Octane Carbon, Venom Cobra, Tag Cannon, Free Style series. The Match Up Hybrid is the best of the bunch in that line, IMO and compares to the Tag Cannon. I see a lot of similarities between the 2. The Octane Carbon and Match Up Pearl remind me of each other as they are allergic to oil. Free Style series is more aggressive than the Tropical series. And in my opinion, the Cobra is the best of the bunch in this series. Predictable pearl that can be used on a wide array of patterns except for the extremes.

So after all of that, I do not see where Motiv is any better or Worse than Storm. They both have great balls, they both have good balls, and they both have balls that leave a lot on the table. Biggest difference that I see it Storm releases more balls per year. Motiv has 6 balls on the market that are over 1 year old. Storm has 3. Motiv releases slower than most of the other companies due to their release schedule. I would put Motiv in the same sentence with Storm, albeit after, but in the same sentence. Motiv has the most complete lineup outside of Storm. EBI has 45 balls to chose from, but one you make the 4 brands act as 4 brands, holes galore in that arsenal. Brunswick has come a good ways in the last few years, but I do not think that they are ready to compete at the top right now.

Slow workday has me really bored 

Yeah, I can see why DV8 would be down towards the bottom. Their recent products just don't seem to have to popularity and/or staying power from other brands. I'm a big fan of the Grudge Hybrid and Diva XOXO, but both of those were from a couple years ago.

I think they might be painting themselves into too narrow of a corner. Many of their cores are pretty much the same... low RG, high differential, and asymmetrical. Not a ton of differentiation in ball motion given most of their coverstocks trend towards being on the strongest end too.

It's kind of nice if that's what you're looking for assuming you don't mind choosing from multiple options for the same result. Otherwise you need too look outside the brand for something else.

Yeah, I can see why DV8 would be down towards the bottom. Their recent products just don't seem to have to popularity and/or staying power from other brands. I'm a big fan of the Grudge Hybrid and Diva XOXO, but both of those were from a couple years ago.

I think they might be painting themselves into too narrow of a corner. Many of their cores are pretty much the same... low RG, high differential, and asymmetrical. Not a ton of differentiation in ball motion given most of their coverstocks trend towards being on the strongest end too.

It's kind of nice if that's what you're looking for assuming you don't mind choosing from multiple options for the same result. Otherwise you need too look outside the brand for something else.

I will say the Creed is an incredible ball from DV8. Got to throw it for the first time on a couple tougher shots and I was really impressed. Practiced 10 games yesterday on a couple European tournament patterns and it was the best look I had on both patterns. I hated the HyRoad Pearl but the Creed has the motion I wanted from the HyRoad Pearl in a stronger overall ball