Author Topic: Is Bowling In Its' Final Frames? (Read 8537 times)

MI 2 AZ · « **on:** May 10, 2015, 02:40:43 AM »

http://www.freep.com/story/money/business/michigan/2015/05/09/bowling-michigan-rebound-decline/26924689/

A couple of people I knew from my bowling/work in Detroit area are quoted in this article.

Jorge300 · « **Reply #16 on:** May 11, 2015, 04:08:13 PM »

Txbowler,
I didn't ask for details, but it sounded like it was by Brand names carried in the booth. So for shorts if it is Brunswick, you are ok. But extra costs for DV8 or Radical. I saw nothing Dv8 or Radical in the Brunswick booth this year, just Brunswick. They were selling the other brands at another local pro shop. Now Ebonite has for the past few years had a larger space to house Ebonite, Track and Columbia300, so they have been paying extra for a while now, I'm guessing. So this probably didn't effect them and hence they continued this year to have all 3 brands in one booth, while Hammer still has it's separate booth from when it was a separate company.

BMFOBR · « **Reply #17 on:** May 11, 2015, 04:44:30 PM »

Article made my skin crawl. Hate those places like Lucky Strike. Had the misfortune of "bowling" there during a company party. Some guys brought their stuff, including me to have some friendly matches for bragging rights. Shouldn't have bothered. We all wound up grabbing house balls since even the weakest urethane would almost do a U-turn even after having to loft it 15 feet. Maybe this is how bowling will shake out. The stalwart holdouts who own houses that cater to serious bowlers will see profits go up as serious bowlers will avoid these places like the plague. The people who embrace this new concept have no business walking thru the doors of a real center. They don't understand it, don't respect it, and will never join it.

bradl · « **Reply #18 on:** May 11, 2015, 04:45:24 PM »

I think there is one thing that is missing here, as it is definitely missing in the link in the OP, and that is how bowling is seen worldwide.

Judging from the talent seen on a lot of the international teams, I would hardly say that bowling is on its way out, just as much as I would say that this article is US-centric and hasn't even thought of this on a global perspective.

Yes, it is struggling here in the US, where the tours used to be a place where you could bowl professionally to earn your income, not supplement your income. Case in point: look at how much the last PBA tournament paid out for first place and the number of entries in that tournament.

By contrast, compare that to the Japan Cup, where last I saw, top prize was nearly $80K.

Additionally, while we see mainly the top two bowlers, look at how many competitive bowlers we have in the QubicaAMF World Cup, and the WTBA. For them to be that good, they not only have to compete at their league level, but at their national level as well, to even be able to bring their game to somewhere like a World Cup, PABCON, or others.

I won't even get into how this is going in Asia, as it is all over the place there.

The article is only looking at the strife we have under the USBC, the PBA, and the state of bowling in the US. There's a lot that they are missing.

BL.

Bigmike · « **Reply #19 on:** May 11, 2015, 07:02:49 PM »

When you evaluate the article with what Detroit used to represent in the bowling world, it is mind boggling. Detroit had and may still have the largest number of sanctioned members in the USBC. I think Detroit may have had the largest number of sanctioned lane beds also but can not confirm that one.

At one time there were rumors that the Detroit USBC entertained thoughts of pulling away from National and forming their own sanctioning body. I can only imagine it was around the time of switch from ABC to USBC, but do not have any insight into why it was considered.

So flashback to Detroit and what it used to represent in America: A host of families that were either working and middle class with good factory jobs in the auto industry and the support companies that feed the auto factories. Most of those jobs have either became automated, downsized, or eliminated.

Now you have the basis for why Detroit is a representative of one of the largest factors for the downturn in the bowling world. Bowling has always been working class and those hot bed cities like Milwaukee, Cleveland, St. Louis, Kansas City, Pittsburgh, etc. have all taken a beating in the job market and middle/working class incomes. The Great Recession didn't gut the folks who bowl from the game, it just made several of them cutback on spending towards what to most is a hobby or recreation.

Sorry for the book, but the article hits home for many of us who wish for the great bowling towns to make a comeback but understand why they might be gone forever.

newguy · « **Reply #20 on:** May 13, 2015, 01:24:54 PM »

Quote from: Jorge300 on May 11, 2015, 04:08:13 PM

Txbowler,
I didn't ask for details, but it sounded like it was by Brand names carried in the booth. So for shorts if it is Brunswick, you are ok. But extra costs for DV8 or Radical. I saw nothing Dv8 or Radical in the Brunswick booth this year, just Brunswick. They were selling the other brands at another local pro shop. Now Ebonite has for the past few years had a larger space to house Ebonite, Track and Columbia300, so they have been paying extra for a while now, I'm guessing. So this probably didn't effect them and hence they continued this year to have all 3 brands in one booth, while Hammer still has it's separate booth from when it was a separate company.

It was per brand. So it would have cost us 3 times the fee for all three brands and it was a 3 year commitment. our decision to not have all three brands in the Brunswick booth was simply a financial decision based on attendance and economics. El Paso was projected to have under 7000 teams signed up, down from the 8500 in Reno the year before. So if you look at attendance is about 35000 bowlers this year, my assumption is next year in Reno will be down as well so lets sat 8000 teams, 40000 bowlers then Las Vegas is the wild card, could be up significantly but by then I'm in for well over 100k. We are at the pro shop in Fiesta lane about 6 miles from the center and have had sales similar to what we sold the year before in Reno. I believe there is not enough value given for what they expect me to pay. Declining attendance and raise my cost, hmmm, guess they missed Economics 101. its gotta stop someplace.

kidlost2000 · « **Reply #21 on:** May 13, 2015, 01:40:48 PM »

Phil is being PBA registered worth the cost for most companies at this point?

newguy · « **Reply #22 on:** May 13, 2015, 01:56:52 PM »

Product Registration was never an added value for the manufacturers, it was a way to support the PBA and Bowling. The ROI is not measurable in the case of the PBA, The USBC however is very measurable.

kidlost2000 · « **Reply #23 on:** May 13, 2015, 02:00:35 PM »

Thanks for answering

Jorge300 · « **Reply #24 on:** May 14, 2015, 11:45:54 AM »

Phil,
Thanks for your insight. Your decision is very logical and sound. Once I heard that the USBC was charging per brand, I agreed with the decision to house Dv8 and Radical somewhere else.

I am surprised at the fact that your sales are relatively static though. I would think the "impulse" buys from people seeing the product at the Stadium would have accounted for more sales then the numbers are showing. Also thought the "I just struggled at the Bowler's Journal and need a new ball to fix it" mentality would also make sales higher at the Stadium. Maybe with the economy still not back 100% people are not making those kind of rash buying decisions anymore? But it is more likely that Radical makes such great products that people are willing to make the short drive to get the quality that is Radical Bowling Technologies [/end shameless plug

].

JessN16 · « **Reply #25 on:** May 20, 2015, 12:52:45 AM »

Quote from: Bigmike on May 11, 2015, 07:02:49 PM

So flashback to Detroit and what it used to represent in America: A host of families that were either working and middle class with good factory jobs in the auto industry and the support companies that feed the auto factories. Most of those jobs have either became automated, downsized, or eliminated.

And here you have the most salient point about the decline of bowling, and it's the one I've been trying to make for the past 20-odd years that keeps getting covered up by the "bowling is in decline because of scoring pace" argument. Kind of funny that I'm having this discussion now on two different bowling forums, but anyway, here goes ...

The decline of the U.S. manufacturing shift-worker has been what hurt bowling the most. When you have manufacturing, you have: (1) predictable work schedules, (2) disposable income and (3) the salt-of-the-earth everyman. Perfect for bowling.

Over the last 15 years especially, I've noticed the makeup of leagues I was in starting shifting from the manufacturing guy, to the retiree or professional -- someone in control of their own schedule and/or who needed something to do with free time. The blue-collar quotient was in retreat.

Add in competition from video games, the internet and -- especially for parents of adolescent/teen children -- outside family commitments (have a kid that plays travel ball? good luck getting to the bowling alley at the same time for 36 straight weeks...), and what you have is a threatened sport.

Around where I live now (I've moved), it's a rural area and I have to drive an hour to the nearest center. It has two very strong leagues and the person in charge is a bowler, but he's an older gentleman. I'm not complaining, though, as the local league golf scene is no more, courses are closing, adult softball leagues are struggling -- anything that involves regular, scheduled human interaction and physical activity. It's just not as important as it was.

But it's those factory jobs (or more specifically, the lack thereof) that have killed us: I watched a factory shut down a shift once, and with it went a 24-team, 96-person league overnight. Poof. About 80 of those bowlers never came back to any league. That's easily 8-10 times the number of bowlers I've known to quit over scoring pace, just in one day in one town.

There are society macro issues in play here, most of which bowling itself cannot fix no matter how hard it tries.

Jess

Steven · « **Reply #26 on:** May 20, 2015, 12:05:37 PM »

Jess, very well said. Nice post.

avabob · « **Reply #27 on:** May 20, 2015, 02:46:42 PM »

I second that on Jess. Bowling as recreation is popular, but anything that requires organized participation on a regular basis no longer fits in our society that has evolved

DrBob806 · « **Reply #28 on:** May 21, 2015, 07:35:21 AM »

Quote from: Bigmike on May 11, 2015, 07:02:49 PM

When you evaluate the article with what Detroit used to represent in the bowling world, it is mind boggling. Detroit had and may still have the largest number of sanctioned members in the USBC. I think Detroit may have had the largest number of sanctioned lane beds also but can not confirm that one.

At one time there were rumors that the Detroit USBC entertained thoughts of pulling away from National and forming their own sanctioning body. I can only imagine it was around the time of switch from ABC to USBC, but do not have any insight into why it was considered.

So flashback to Detroit and what it used to represent in America: A host of families that were either working and middle class with good factory jobs in the auto industry and the support companies that feed the auto factories. Most of those jobs have either became automated, downsized, or eliminated.

Now you have the basis for why Detroit is a representative of one of the largest factors for the downturn in the bowling world. Bowling has always been working class and those hot bed cities like Milwaukee, Cleveland, St. Louis, Kansas City, Pittsburgh, etc. have all taken a beating in the job market and middle/working class incomes. The Great Recession didn't gut the folks who bowl from the game, it just made several of them cutback on spending towards what to most is a hobby or recreation.

Sorry for the book, but the article hits home for many of us who wish for the great bowling towns to make a comeback but understand why they might be gone forever.

Bigmike & Jess, I agree with your takes as well.

I live in Cleveland. Many houses hosted an early and late shift (say 6:30, 9:30) Monday-Thursday around here up into the early 90s. When I was asked to join our local association as a director 7 years ago, there were 35 houses, now there are 23. Some of the houses used to have school buses at the elementary and middle schools, to transport kids to their center for after school intramural leagues, those have disappeared due to insurance costs.

The economy has hurt our region (rust belt in general). Two income families are commonplace, and with so many other options of entertainment available, bowling isn't a high priority for even those who grew up as bowlers. It's sad, but it's the reality.

Video games didn't help. Nobody has to get off their sofa anymore to be entertained. You have 200 tv channels, etc. And we blame fatty foods....ok, off the soapbox lol.

Author Topic: Is Bowling In Its' Final Frames? (Read 8537 times)

MI 2 AZ

Is Bowling In Its' Final Frames?

Jorge300

Re: Is Bowling In Its' Final Frames?

BMFOBR

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bradl

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Bigmike

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newguy

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kidlost2000

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newguy

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kidlost2000

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Jorge300

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JessN16

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Steven

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avabob

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DrBob806

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