Author Topic: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it? (Read 7254 times)

Metal_rules · « **on:** April 27, 2011, 03:31:44 AM »

now that the pba season is over, whats your take on the past seasons shows? what do you think they could do to make it better? i personally don't like how the w.s.o.b. was done on tv. it was lame, no crowd, and all taped shows. i would like to see more tour stops that are all live shows. i also favor the 5 man stepladder finals. announcer wise they need to change it up, someone who has been in bowling for a while. maybe bring back Bo, but we need some better anouncers. anyways whats your take?

Edited by Ten Back on 5/1/2011 at 7:50 PM

qstick777 · « **Reply #16 on:** April 28, 2011, 06:12:25 AM »

Not picking on you, but you did such a nice job laying it out and making it easy to respond to, and you have some good ideas:

1. Maybe? Honestly I haven't watched any of the WSOB, and probably only caught a few shows the past 2 years. I DVR'd the entire season last year and deleted it because I needed the room. The idea behind it was to save money for the PBA and the bowlers. It costs a lot of money to travel and produce a live show every week. I guess the other option is for the tour to fold?

2. You really can't compare golf and bowling - in either the experience or the setting. Golf is outdoors, bowling is indoors. People can walk from hole to hole to follow a golfer, not just sit in the bleachers. Golf has a constantly changing course, with the ability to recover from a bad shot; bowling is 10 frames - if you pull a shot and your opponent continues to strike there really isn't much you can do.

3. Don't think that will ever happen in the given time constraints. It takes 10 league bowlers anywhere from 2 1/2 to 3 1/2 hours to bowl 3 games. Yes golf shows you more people, but they also have 3+ hours. The tour has tried the "4 people bowling at once thing" and it doesn't work. The cameramen can't keep up with the bowling pace, and if they slow it down it takes too long. Then you run into the logistics of lane play and rotation. If I'm watching 4 people bowl it out, I want them to all bowl on the same conditions - so if you cram 4 guys onto 1 pair of lanes you are crippled by the time to reset pins. If you spread them out, you have to deal with getting balls to the proper lanes, constant shuffling, etc.

4 (although you didn't number it

). I really don't think it's a matter of "dumping" ESPN - the contract runs through 2013. None of us know the details of that contract. The PBA could still be paying for that time with some sort of agreement for a revenue and production cost split?

Here is a pretty good article - from 2000 (when the PBA was purchased by "the Microsoft guys")....and it's very long! http://www.clevescene.com/cleveland/fear-and-bowling/Content?oid=1474831

JessN16 wrote on 4/27/2011 1:15 PM:1. Drop the WSOB idea and vow never to use it again. It was bad the first year and worse this year. Tape-delayed finals are horrible anyway, but the WSOB was particularly disastrous.

2. The idea of focusing a little more in the house is a good one. I'm not sure how much you can sell a bowling alley as a destination point, but that's a large part of televised golf's charm -- presenting the course in a way that makes other people wish they were there.

3. More people on the telecast. Having three or four bowlers on per week hurts us. Golf shows you 10-15 guys down the stretch, at minimum. So maybe you have the 1 and 2 seeds getting a bye in the first round, then you have a group of 6-8 bowlers competing simultaneously in the first game. Top two finishers get seeded against the 1 and 2 seeds for the second and third games, then the winners of those face each other for the championship in game four. That gets 10 different guys on the telecast each week with only four games bowled, same as a stepladder show. Gives the fans more opportunities to find "their guy" to follow and cheer for.

I'm also leaning toward dumping ESPN and putting it out for bid, maybe ending up on FSN or Versus. But that's not as important as the three points I just listed above.

Jess

jbruno6 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 28, 2011, 06:59:36 AM »

They should allow fighting.

A half ten is not a great shot. No, you shouldn't have carried it.

se7en · « **Reply #18 on:** April 28, 2011, 08:52:51 AM »

I would just change the PBA into a team sport where each state has their own teams that recruit top bowlers and setup a season with divisions, etc.

I often find myself not rooting for any particular bowler unless it's one that I'm very fond of, and that list is pretty small. People here in the Tampa area couldn't care less about someone like Manny Ramirez or Johnny Damon, but once they were playing for the Rays, they were beloved because they were on the local team.

The argument can't really be made to keep bowling as conservative to its roots as possible since the PBA has already butchered that with their constant changing of formats.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There is nothing so easy to learn as experience and nothing so hard to apply

Sunshine n Lollipops · « **Reply #19 on:** April 28, 2011, 11:57:41 AM »

Huh? It's obvious from the postings that everybody wants it to be just like the 70's. Don't know many sports that haven't changed the rules and the way it's televised. Good luck with that.

To the last poster, look up "arena" bowling. There was an actual professional league representing cities either in the fifties or early sixties. Thunderbowl in Allen Park MI is one of the old arena houses. Cool idea but I don't know how it would fly in this day and age.

Turn that frown upside down!

kidlost2000 · « **Reply #20 on:** April 28, 2011, 12:43:44 PM »

70s, 80s, and most of the 90s when it was about watching professional bowlers bowling not the lame side show it is today. Bowlers want to see professionals bowling ESPN/PBA want to get non-bowlers to watch.

That is your two demographics. Bowlers and non-bowlers.

All this push to draw non-bowlers is costing you the bowling audience you use to have while still not attracting non-bowlers. So if you continue that trend who will watch?

Be good, or be good at it.

PJM300 · « **Reply #21 on:** April 28, 2011, 02:01:11 PM »

They should watch the USBC queens show from last night and copy that.

Sunshine n Lollipops · « **Reply #22 on:** April 28, 2011, 02:46:13 PM »

You have got to be kidding. That show had no pizzazz, no sizzle, looked dull, sounded dull, play by play man was horrible. Lifeless.

PJM300 wrote on 4/28/2011 2:01 PM:They should watch the USBC queens show from last night and copy that.

Turn that frown upside down!

Sunshine n Lollipops · « **Reply #23 on:** April 28, 2011, 02:59:25 PM »

Sorry, once again you are missing the boat. The genie is out of the bottle and will never be put back again. Back then, the whole telecast was set up as a shrine to the almighty pro bowler. From the reverent tones of Schenkel, the hushed crowds, the church like demeanor of the crowd, and Bo Burton telling us how, we as mere mortals, could never hope to split half-boards like the god-like pro bowlers. It was a religious service every Saturday at 3 pm.

Nowadays, we know better. The modern equipment, the style of bowling, the knowledge of most viewers that it's not so much splitting boards anymore (if it ever was

), it's more who can adjust the fastest and the best to the changing oil patterns as today's soaker balls cause moves and lines that were only dreamed about in your beloved "Golden Age". We don't think of these guys as gods anymore, just very accomplished and practiced everyday bowlers. You can argue whether or not the pros are thought of that way, maybe they are and maybe they aren't. Point is, they aren't seen as something that special anymore. ABC and the PBA made sure it was a turkey shoot on Saturday with big scores the norm. Nowadays that isn't the case the majority of the time. Times have changed, dinosaurs. Time to accept it. It's NEVER going to go back to what it was.

kidlost2000 wrote on 4/28/2011 12:43 PM:
70s, 80s, and most of the 90s when it was about watching professional bowlers bowling not the lame side show it is today. Bowlers want to see professionals bowling ESPN/PBA want to get non-bowlers to watch.

That is your two demographics. Bowlers and non-bowlers.

All this push to draw non-bowlers is costing you the bowling audience you use to have while still not attracting non-bowlers. So if you continue that trend who will watch?

Be good, or be good at it.

Turn that frown upside down!

Edited by Sunshine n Lollipops on 4/28/2011 at 3:05 PM

PJM300 · « **Reply #24 on:** April 28, 2011, 03:35:05 PM »

You sir have I disagree with totally and from all of your posts you appear to be a pot stirrer, probably a 150 stand left throw it right. For the sport to get respect again it must be treated that way. The Dick Weber open, even Dick himself would have walked out with those horns. The people dont know how to promote it, they are not bowlers, they are computer people. Yes the ESPN play by play guy was bad, but the show was presented with respect, player interviews etc.

Walking E · « **Reply #25 on:** April 28, 2011, 04:07:32 PM »

I don't like the fans sitting on the adjoining lanes down towards the pins. It makes for frequent distractions as it is, and I'd rather see the entire bowling alley on the side shots (or, at worst, curtain it off and hang banners or something, but just don't put fans seated down the lanes).

I love the enthusiasm that Rob Stone brings to the telecasts. That being said, the guy doing the Queens play-by-play wasn't bad. I always enjoy hearing Chris Barnes in the booth because he's brilliant with regards to the technical aspects of the game (something that I don't think Randy is, or at least he doesn't come across that way to me). I also really enjoy when Norm Duke joins the broadcast, though I realize that having either Duke or Barnes on the telecast isn't very practical.

I thought I would hate the live bowler discussions, but I actually enjoy hearing what they have to say mid-match. I would prefer, however, that they don't interrupt a bowler prior to a shot. I think it would better to check in with the two bowlers either right before or right after the mid-game commercial break. Of course, they wouldn't have that break on the uninterrupted championship match so they'd have to come up with something different, or just stick a commercial break into the title match.

I'd also like to see the bowling tips segment return. Rather than just being Randy every time, it'd be nice to see different pros (men and women) give tips aimed at various skill levels.

Official Member of the BrunsTrackColumStormHammEboRotoBuzzAMF Nation!

Also a member of ROB STONE NATION

ericfox4 · « **Reply #26 on:** April 28, 2011, 04:46:02 PM »

get rid of randy peterson

Sunshine n Lollipops · « **Reply #27 on:** April 28, 2011, 07:11:09 PM »

Your opinion, sport. Free country. Continue to express yourself but don't call me names doing it. Fair enough? I hope so because in a war of words and logic, you won't be able to match up with me.

PJM300 wrote on 4/28/2011 3:35 PM:You sir have I disagree with totally and from all of your posts you appear to be a pot stirrer, probably a 150 stand left throw it right. For the sport to get respect again it must be treated that way. The Dick Weber open, even Dick himself would have walked out with those horns. The people dont know how to promote it, they are not bowlers, they are computer people. Yes the ESPN play by play guy was bad, but the show was presented with respect, player interviews etc.

Turn that frown upside down!

Strider · « **Reply #28 on:** April 28, 2011, 07:14:16 PM »

Sunshine n Lollipops wrote on 4/28/2011 2:59 PM:
Sorry, once again you are missing the boat. The genie is out of the bottle and will never be put back again. Back then, the whole telecast was set up as a shrine to the almighty pro bowler. From the reverent tones of Schenkel, the hushed crowds, the church like demeanor of the crowd, and Bo Burton telling us how, we as mere mortals, could never hope to split half-boards like the god-like pro bowlers. It was a religious service every Saturday at 3 pm.

Nowadays, we know better. The modern equipment, the style of bowling, the knowledge of most viewers that it's not so much splitting boards anymore (if it ever was), it's more who can adjust the fastest and the best to the changing oil patterns as today's soaker balls cause moves and lines that were only dreamed about in your beloved "Golden Age". We don't think of these guys as gods anymore, just very accomplished and practiced everyday bowlers. You can argue whether or not the pros are thought of that way, maybe they are and maybe they aren't. Point is, they aren't seen as something that special anymore. ABC and the PBA made sure it was a turkey shoot on Saturday with big scores the norm. Nowadays that isn't the case the majority of the time. Times have changed, dinosaurs. Time to accept it. It's NEVER going to go back to what it was.

Turn that frown upside down!

I hate to say it, but I completely agree with Sunshine.

Look back at the Wide World Of Sports that bowling was a part of. Most if not all of those sports will never again be thought of as prime time, can't miss entertainment.

Trying to "educate" casual bowlers hasn't seemed to work. I don't know what the answer is, but catering to the lowest common denominator isn't it.

Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive

kidlost2000 · « **Reply #29 on:** April 28, 2011, 08:25:13 PM »

I guess you miss the point. Bowling will never be what it was we all know that. We also know that we want to watch a decent product on TV that doesn't require the crap they keep show boating out every week. Since the sizzle you love seems to be losing more viewers then it is gaining I wouldn't expect you to agree.

Let the PBA continue what it is doing by having fewer events, recaps while you were gone to commercials, and different formats weekly, all while limited to a few stops on either coast. I don't watch bowling anymore so I won't be affected. Since so few bowlers are tuning in I'm sure it will eventually go to webcast only before it is like the WPBA and no longer available.

Be good, or be good at it.

Sunshine n Lollipops · « **Reply #30 on:** April 29, 2011, 05:36:39 AM »

And again, you prove the "lost" part of your screen name is very appropriate. The "sizzle" is not what is costing viewership. Viewership is going down and will continue to go down as it is a reflection of the numbers of bowlers participating in leagues continues to go down. The "sizzle" as you call it, is an attempt to market PBA bowling as something that will appeal to the younger demographic that could care less about what bowling on t.v. was like in the 60's-80's. When you realize that you will start to understand the situation.

If you are truly a fan of the sport of bowling, you can filter out all that marketing stuff and enjoy the actual bowling. If you can't do that, perhaps you should question how much a fan of bowling you really are.

You want to watch the boring format, scintillating commentary of Mike Durbin, and oh so carefully followed script of how the bowlers should look, cut their hair, and react? Subscribe to ESPN Classic and cry into your beer about the "good old days". You won't ever have to worry about somebody posting a "spoiler alert".

kidlost2000 wrote on 4/28/2011 8:25 PM:
I guess you miss the point. Bowling will never be what it was we all know that. We also know that we want to watch a decent product on TV that doesn't require the crap they keep show boating out every week. Since the sizzle you love seems to be losing more viewers then it is gaining I wouldn't expect you to agree.

Let the PBA continue what it is doing by having fewer events, recaps while you were gone to commercials, and different formats weekly, all while limited to a few stops on either coast. I don't watch bowling anymore so I won't be affected. Since so few bowlers are tuning in I'm sure it will eventually go to webcast only before it is like the WPBA and no longer available.

Be good, or be good at it.

Turn that frown upside down!

Author Topic: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it? (Read 7254 times)

Metal_rules

PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

qstick777

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

jbruno6

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

se7en

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

Sunshine n Lollipops

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

kidlost2000

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

PJM300

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

Sunshine n Lollipops

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

Sunshine n Lollipops

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

PJM300

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

Walking E

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

ericfox4

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Sunshine n Lollipops

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

Strider

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

kidlost2000

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?

Sunshine n Lollipops

Re: PBA show -- what should they do to improve it?