BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: brunswickcomplete on October 25, 2022, 09:01:40 PM
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Bowling tonight (USBC Detroit), i point out a balance hole in the other team ball, during practice, my captain is too much of a puss to call it out, so is the league secretary, which i pointed out to him 2nd game, so much for preserving rules that are in the usbc guidelines, I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
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I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
No, not really.
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Bowling tonight, i point out a balance hole in the other team ball,my captain is too much of a puss to call it out, so is the league secretary, so a 160 average shoots 650 tonight, so much for preserving rules that are in the usbc guidelines, I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
Just the fact you reported it to the Secretary is enough to have them forfeit all games he/she bowled games in. If the Secretary doesn't do his/her job then report them to the USBC and your regional senate also! USBC made the damn rule.....we have to follow it!
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Plus some of us may have spent a couple hundred dollars plugging up favorite bowling balls. :)
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Get your local association involved. We had to do that in one of our leagues when the Spectre was banned because we had a guy that kept trying to use it in league. He showed up the first night after the ban with it, and I told him I couldn't allow him to use it without protesting, because I had just lost mine to the rule change, too. He had other equipment with him; his position was "I paid too much money for it to just let it sit." We had to raise a fairly big stink with his team captain, and then go get the owner of the pro shop to explain the situation and make him keep it out.
Unbelievably, about 2-3 weeks later, I look on the lanes adjacent to me, and there's the same guy with the same Spectre. The opposing team captain knew about the ban and here we all went again. He didn't use it.
I figured that was the end of it, but his team ended up qualifying for the Final Four round of our league playoffs. He inexplicably shows up with the ball. This time the team he's bowling doesn't know about it. Me and the team captain from the team we were bowling on the adjacent pair skipped all the pleasantries and went down to the association secretary, who happened to be in the building. He comes down to talk to the guy, and the guy's not hearing it. He keeps saying the team they're bowling that night doesn't care, so why should everyone else (answer: it's a Final Four playoff, meaning they're technically bowling three other teams, not just one -- I don't think he understood the format). Our association secretary more or less told him that if he started the game with the ball he was going to order the scores vacated. It got testy for a few minutes but the guy eventually relented. He bowled like crap with an older ball and I haven't seen him since.
The rule that really has caused an issue is plugging the thumbhole for no-thumb two-handers. That one has nearly started a couple of fights but so far no one has done anything more than just vent a little before taking the ball out of play.
The key here is you have to have good league/association officers. If you don't, some people are going to bully their way through the process. Rules either matter or they don't. I ended up plugging 30+ balls during the time I switched temporarily to no-thumb, at a not-insignificant expense. It's kind of what you have to do.
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The thing that frustrates me is the seemingly never-ending changes that go on every year knowing the financial ramifications against its bowlers. USBC has to know that whatever changes they make; especially regarding no thumbers, experts are going to find a work-around. EX: Cant have an extra hole? Storm came out with the layout adapter where you can achieve a certain ball motion you are used to without the need for the balance hole.
The fact that USBC puts the league officials in these positions is kind of dumb. There are already plenty of rules out there to govern the leagues that adding more that they know is going to create an atmosphere where things could get testy if not violent to me doesnt make any sense. Bowling balls have become so advanced to the point weight holes vs no weight holes; who cares? At the end of the day you as a bowler still have to execute. A weight hole is not going to magically give you and extra 8-10 boards to play with.
Regarding the ball issue......if 72 is the legal hardness limit of a bowling ball and a ball tests at 71.8 or 71.9; how much of an advantage is that ball really going to have? If the limit is 72 and a ball tests at 70; then it makes more sense to raise a concern. But chances are, if a ball tests at 70; then I cant see where the same ball would initially test legal and be listed on the USBC approved ball list. Same thing with the situation regarding the Jackal. Differential limit is .060. If the ball came back .0602; is it really worth raising a huge issue about it? If it came back .065; then by all means pull the ball off the shelves but what advantage does .0602 have over .0600? Just my opinion but the USBC should not be putting its league officials nor its bowlers in this position as we all know fights can occur. It just takes one person having a bad day to get called out. I can recall seeing at least 5 fights during league in my time not including the other instances where guys had to be separated before it got to that point.
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You can always make up a (nonsanctioned,) league with your own rules (weight holes! soakers! exploding barbed wire in the gutters!) if you don't like usbc rules. I guess Bowlero/PBA is.
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You can always make up a (nonsanctioned,) league with your own rules (weight holes! soakers! exploding barbed wire in the gutters!) if you don't like usbc rules. I guess Bowlero/PBA is.
While true, I am not sure of too many competitive money leagues that are unsanctioned. I would be curious to know how many do exist though.
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You can always make up a (nonsanctioned,) league with your own rules (weight holes! soakers! exploding barbed wire in the gutters!) if you don't like usbc rules. I guess Bowlero/PBA is.
While true, I am not sure of too many competitive money leagues that are unsanctioned. I would be curious to know how many do exist though.
Probably not many because USBC has that bonding for prize monies. I thought I heard that some centers are offering bonding?
Is bonding included in the Bowlero/PBA leagues?
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Regarding the ball issue......if 72 is the legal hardness limit of a bowling ball and a ball tests at 71.8 or 71.9; how much of an advantage is that ball really going to have? If the limit is 72 and a ball tests at 70; then it makes more sense to raise a concern. But chances are, if a ball tests at 70; then I cant see where the same ball would initially test legal and be listed on the USBC approved ball list. Same thing with the situation regarding the Jackal. Differential limit is .060. If the ball came back .0602; is it really worth raising a huge issue about it? If it came back .065; then by all means pull the ball off the shelves but what advantage does .0602 have over .0600? Just my opinion but the USBC should not be putting its league officials nor its bowlers in this position as we all know fights can occur. It just takes one person having a bad day to get called out. I can recall seeing at least 5 fights during league in my time not including the other instances where guys had to be separated before it got to that point.
I kind of agree but someone pointed out to me, that if you give an inch some people will take a mile.
On hardness, let's say they (USBC) decides to let a couple slide at 71.8 - the next bowler will come up with a 71.7 and argue that there is no difference between 71.8 and 71.7 . So they allow that to be used, next bowler has one at 71.6 and they allow that. Soon, it will be down to what? Every bowler could argue that theirs is so close to the present allowed exception. That's why they have to have set limits with no exceptions.
Good discussion.
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You can always make up a (nonsanctioned,) league with your own rules (weight holes! soakers! exploding barbed wire in the gutters!) if you don't like usbc rules. I guess Bowlero/PBA is.
While true, I am not sure of too many competitive money leagues that are unsanctioned. I would be curious to know how many do exist though.
Probably not many because USBC has that bonding for prize monies. I thought I heard that some centers are offering bonding?
Is bonding included in the Bowlero/PBA leagues?
Bonding is included in Bowlero/PBA leagues.
Balance holes are also banned in Bowlero/PBA leagues, so unsanctioned leagues in Bowlero centers default to the Bowlero/PBA rules which also ban balance holes.
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Bowling tonight (USBC Detroit), i point out a balance hole in the other team ball, during practice, my captain is too much of a puss to call it out, so is the league secretary, which i pointed out to him 2nd game, so much for preserving rules that are in the usbc guidelines, I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
Just noticed your edit - USBC Detroit. I used to know quite a few of the board members there but that was a long, long time ago, like over 30 years. They were real sticklers for the rules.
Contact Mark Martin or Doug Williams (not sure if this is same person I used to know - common name)
https://www.mdusbc.com/sites/default/files/2021-22%20Board%20Members%20Roster.pdf
Contact Us
Phone: (248) 443-2695
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I did this last night. Took my Burgundy Particle Gryphon to leagues last night as the lanes have been greasy last couple weeks. Had good look in practice so I used it all night. Didn’t shoot light out, 630’s, but only one who even noticed the hole was guy on my team. Had someone on other team made a stink about a tiny hole on a 16 year old ball by a defunct company, I would have put it back in the bag without question. Btw, I too have spent $ plugging all my other balls and this was the last holdout. I did drop it off in the pro shop for my driller to plug the hole before next week. If I can throw my VBP Immortal with it’s .078 differential, seems silly I can’t throw a ball just as old with a wt hole?
Spike
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This is what happens when you pass a rule whose only purpose is to mess with 2 handers. We lived with the old static weight rules for 80 years and allowed balance holes. The impact was negligible on scoring
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Bowling tonight (USBC Detroit), i point out a balance hole in the other team ball, during practice, my captain is too much of a puss to call it out, so is the league secretary, which i pointed out to him 2nd game, so much for preserving rules that are in the usbc guidelines, I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
End result of last nights fiasco, i was removed from the team by the captain for making a stink of it, he said this is a beer drinking league, not the pro tour, my response, rules are rules and should be followed, the league secretary, who doesn’t bowl in the league, but works behind the counter, couldn’t care less
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Bowling tonight (USBC Detroit), i point out a balance hole in the other team ball, during practice, my captain is too much of a puss to call it out, so is the league secretary, which i pointed out to him 2nd game, so much for preserving rules that are in the usbc guidelines, I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
End result of last nights fiasco, i was removed from the team by the captain for making a stink of it, he said this is a beer drinking league, not the pro tour, my response, rules are rules and should be followed, the league secretary, who doesn’t bowl in the league, but works behind the counter, couldn’t care less
I'm not sure of the rules or procedures, but can't you file a protest with the local Detroit Assn?
Call them, I posted the number earlier.
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At this time it’s probably better for me to be removed from that group, I’ll head over to imperial lanes to see if any one needs an extra bowler
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At this time it’s probably better for me to be removed from that group, I’ll head over to imperial lanes to see if any one needs an extra bowler
I get the mindset to just cut the losses and head over, but this also does bring about the integrity issue. It doesn't matter if it is a beer drinking league or not; if they are going to be USBC sanctioned, they need to be all in for what that entails, or get out and make the league non-sanctioned. I'd go through with getting hold of the association and bring this up to them. Kicking you off the team because they are violating rules basically is making you the whistleblower, and showing negligence on the part of the league secretary, let alone the entire brass of the league.
They may think of this as a burning bridges issue, but you're standing up for principles and integrity while they are having fun and collecting the funds while simultaneously shirking those rules, and those who are supposed to enforce them are looking the other way. Leaving them to do that signals condoning of their actions/being complicit in their actions.
Definitely get the local association involved.
BL.
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Just curious OP, what was the other team’s response when you mentioned the wt hole during practice? If it was the only ball he had and claimed ignorance to the new rules, I could understand cutting him a break. If he’s one of those guys wheeling a 6-ball roller into the house, he’s most likely aware of the wt hole ban and could have bagged it for a “legal†ball. Our leagues are small and everyone knows everyone, so even if someone had an issue with rules, it can usually be resolved at the team captain level. Certainly would be handled with our secretary if it got that far. Sucks that you basically got told to pound sand and got booted from the team to boot!
Spike
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If my league ever went non-sanctioned, I'd contact the "220 Avg" guy and pay him to make me one of those 20+ pound balls that he throws for fun. ::) ;D :o
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We had a similar situation. One of my teammates who hasn't bowled in 5 + years was using his only bowling ball which has a nice weight hole in it. He had no clue it was illegal. He had it plugged and fixed for the following week. It really isn't that big of a deal, but I know exactly how it would have gone down had he continued to use it....
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We had a similar situation. One of my teammates who hasn't bowled in 5 + years was using his only bowling ball which has a nice weight hole in it. He had no clue it was illegal. He had it plugged and fixed for the following week. It really isn't that big of a deal, but I know exactly how it would have gone down had he continued to use it....
Similar situation happened here. The league officers simply asked the bowler to have the balance holes in his stuff plugged prior to the following week. That didn't prevent the bowler from going absolutely nuclear about being "ratted out", but the holes were filled the following week and everything was fine. The bowler complained that the balls rolled and felt different after plugging the balance holes, but that's a whole different issue 😆
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Bowling tonight (USBC Detroit), i point out a balance hole in the other team ball, during practice, my captain is too much of a puss to call it out, so is the league secretary, which i pointed out to him 2nd game, so much for preserving rules that are in the usbc guidelines, I guess my 30$ sanction fee doesn’t mean crap
End result of last nights fiasco, i was removed from the team by the captain for making a stink of it, he said this is a beer drinking league, not the pro tour, my response, rules are rules and should be followed, the league secretary, who doesn’t bowl in the league, but works behind the counter, couldn’t care less
Go walk up the lanes and throw the ball 5 feet from the pins with a beer in your hand. Just having fun with a beer and bowling... rules don't matter.
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We had a similar situation. One of my teammates who hasn't bowled in 5 + years was using his only bowling ball which has a nice weight hole in it. He had no clue it was illegal. He had it plugged and fixed for the following week. It really isn't that big of a deal, but I know exactly how it would have gone down had he continued to use it....
Similar situation happened here. The league officers simply asked the bowler to have the balance holes in his stuff plugged prior to the following week. That didn't prevent the bowler from going absolutely nuclear about being "ratted out", but the holes were filled the following week and everything was fine. The bowler complained that the balls rolled and felt different after plugging the balance holes, but that's a whole different issue 😆
I only had to have one ball filled for a hole i didn't want in the first place. I didn't notice a huge difference on how it rolls since it has been filled. With my particular bowling style. Balance holes never served a purpose for me. In hindsight my guess the only reason that ball had one is because the PSO messed up when he drilled that particular ball for me. He told me the hole needed to be there to make the ball legal. Which was true based on the rules at time I originally bought the ball.
None of the other balls I ever purchased before that ball or after needed one. Hence my theory he made a mistake in drilling that particular ball for me.