Author Topic: Foward Pitch (Read 1650 times)

Moe · « **on:** September 15, 2005, 04:25:48 AM »

When you switched to foward pitch did you also change your span? Currently im using the same span, with 1/4 foward, im not sticking or anything. But it feels a bit stretched, more so when the ball was at 1/4 reverse. I could keep going foward till i stick, and then back off an 1/16, and shorten the span. *thats the general rule of thumb, right?*

Now, would i want to make the thumbhole tighter also?

Its very comfortable, and i notice a HUGE difference from the 1/4 reverse that i had been using.
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AIM = y2moe99

Magic Carpet · « **Reply #1 on:** September 15, 2005, 02:10:02 PM »

Your span should be correct regardless of the thumb pitch. You should not have to make your span incorrect to accommodate a thumb pitch change.

I would keep going forward 1/4 inch at the time until you hang then back up 1/8 inch. I don't think that 1/16 is enough to make any difference.

If your goal is to not squeeze the ball as I teach, then your thumbhole would be LESS tight as you move more forward in your thumb pitch.

To see if you need to go more forward with the thumb pitch relax your hand and throw the ball. If the ball wants to fall off of your thumb TOO soon then add a piece of tape or Ron C's Magic Carpet. (shameless plug goes here)

Throw the ball again and if the ball still falls off of the thumb too soon then add another piece of tape. Keep adding tape until the ball falls off of the thumb right at the bottom of the swing. If you find that the thumb hole is getting so tight that you are having to force your thumb into the hole then you need more forward pitch.

Bowl great!
Ron Clifton

Strider · « **Reply #2 on:** September 15, 2005, 04:26:02 PM »

I subscribe to Ron's theory. Of course, he's the one who redid my pitches and span.

I went from 5/16 reverse to 9/16 forward. My span got a bit shorter (don't have those measurements handy), but it was a little long before, and relaxed now. If it would have been relaxed before, I doubt the span would have changed much.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #3 on:** September 15, 2005, 04:40:11 PM »

Ron is a guru for me and just recently helped me with my bowling!

Regarding shortening spans and forward pitch ...I think Mo has hit the nail on the head in a way.

If I take a span that is very relaxed and not a full fingertip! Say a span where my last crease touches the BACK of the hole in both fingers.

If I or most people on this site use the Bill Taylor span pitch tables we are going to be sadly lacking in holding power(most or at least those with average flexibility .. but not all).

So we will go forward with the thumb pitch. A funny thing happens on the way to holding power....now all of a sudden as we move forward....I find that my fingers last crease starts to move back into the finger hole and end up just slightly over the middle of the finger hole when I find the mythical sweet spot referred to above.

Interesting!!!!

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS this test can be most easily performed with a Jayhawk fitting ball!

Moe · « **Reply #4 on:** September 16, 2005, 12:42:04 AM »

quote:
If your goal is to not squeeze the ball as I teach, then your thumbhole would be LESS tight as you move more forward in your thumb pitch.

Yea, thats is what i have noticed, i find the ball falling off of my hand, and still kinda squeezing the ball. So i may try a smaller thumbhole.

quote:
To see if you need to go more forward with the thumb pitch relax your hand and throw the ball. If the ball wants to fall off of your thumb TOO soon then add a piece of tape or Ron C's Magic Carpet. (shameless plug goes here)

Throw the ball again and if the ball still falls off of the thumb too soon then add another piece of tape. Keep adding tape until the ball falls off of the thumb right at the bottom of the swing. If you find that the thumb hole is getting so tight that you are having to force your thumb into the hole then you need more forward pitch.

I find that kind of confusing, couldnt i just make the hole smaller?

Im also finding that i have a small calous on the side of my thumb, looking at it, its the right side, its small in size, and i notice that there is a slight drag along the side of the ball. Would say 1/16th of lateral pitch fix that?
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AIM = y2moe99

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #5 on:** September 16, 2005, 08:04:35 AM »

MOe,

I'm not convinced you are getting what Magic Carpet is saying.

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS forward pitch allows a looser thumbhole.

Nollster · « **Reply #6 on:** September 16, 2005, 08:36:59 AM »

Moe -
Another of Ron's disciples here. I've moved my pitches from 0" to 1/2" forward after working with Ron. My span didn't change much, but I did have to add some bevel to a ball or two.

As you move the pitch forward, you essentially lock your hand into the ball until gravity pulls it off at the bottom of the swing. It's not necessary to have a TIGHT thumbhole at that point -- I use Magic Carpet and want a snug feel, where I don't have to jam my thumb into the ball. My last move before starting my pushaway is to "let go" with my hand essentially freeing any tension that I may have put there and just letting everything happen naturally. There's no feel of losing the ball at the bottom. If you just make the hole smaller, I would think you'd still have the feel of losing the ball which would then make you squeeze and get stuck in an already tight thumb hole. Another great thing about my forward pitched thumb is that I can tell if I do squeeze just a little. It's something I suffer from because of early timing -- if I'm a little early, I squeeze just a little trying to slow the ball down and then I pull it. No nasty hangs where it feels like I've just pulled my thumb out of joint, just a little pulled shot...Also, try the Carpet if you haven't yet. It's amazing!!
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Nollster

Summer league
Winter League

Nollster · « **Reply #7 on:** September 16, 2005, 08:37:19 AM »

quote:
Ron is a guru for me and just recently helped me with my bowling!

Regarding shortening spans and forward pitch ...I think Mo has hit the nail on the head in a way.

If I take a span that is very relaxed and not a full fingertip! Say a span where my last crease touches the BACK of the hole in both fingers.

If I or most people on this site use the Bill Taylor span pitch tables we are going to be sadly lacking in holding power(most or at least those with average flexibility .. but not all).

So we will go forward with the thumb pitch. A funny thing happens on the way to holding power....now all of a sudden as we move forward....I find that my fingers last crease starts to move back into the finger hole and end up just slightly over the middle of the finger hole when I find the mythical sweet spot referred to above.

Interesting!!!!

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS this test can be most easily performed with a Jayhawk fitting ball!

This seems logical to me LL. As you increase that forward pitch, you're essentially pulling the rest of the hand backward. I assume (as I don't have a Jayhawk handy) that reversing the pitch to 1/2" reverse pushes the rest of the hand forward and you'd be closer to the 2nd crease.....
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Nollster

Summer league
Winter League

Edited on 9/16/2005 8:34 AM

Moe · « **Reply #8 on:** September 16, 2005, 12:18:41 PM »

quote:
MOe,

I'm not convinced you are getting what Magic Carpet is saying.

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS forward pitch allows a looser thumbhole.

Ya think! lol

So what he is saying is what Nollster said.

quote:
As you move the pitch forward, you essentially lock your hand into the ball until gravity pulls it off at the bottom of the swing.

I understand that much already, BUT if the thumb hole is to loose already, doesnt that defeat the purpose? Meaning i would have to grab it, because my thumb is already falling out before gravity lets it, no matter how foward i go.

quote:
PS forward pitch allows a looser thumbhole.

So the thumb should be good fitting, but not tight as i move the pitch foward to find that spot, correct? Or, i could just do as ron said, add tape, or magic carpet until it fits correctly without jaming my thumb in the ball, if i had to jam it in, them move it foward more.

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AIM = y2moe99

Edited on 9/16/2005 12:13 PM

Nollster · « **Reply #9 on:** September 16, 2005, 12:47:19 PM »

Moe -

I get my thumb holes drilled so that in summer, when my thumbs biggest, it's a snug fit with Carpet installed. In winter, I'll add tape until it's the same feel as before. When you go forward, you don't want to be jamming your thumb into the hole.....Not loose, not tight, just right.......
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Nollster

Summer league
Winter League

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #10 on:** September 16, 2005, 01:11:03 PM »

I think now you are getting what he said!

REgards,

Luckylefty

Author Topic: Foward Pitch (Read 1650 times)

Moe

Foward Pitch

Magic Carpet

Re: Foward Pitch

Strider

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LuckyLefty

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Moe

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LuckyLefty

Re: Foward Pitch

Nollster

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Nollster

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Moe

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Nollster

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LuckyLefty

Re: Foward Pitch