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Author Topic: streched span vs relaxed span  (Read 18625 times)

hotshot187

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streched span vs relaxed span
« on: July 16, 2006, 12:25:22 PM »
Can somebody explain the differences and why would chose one over the other?


Thanks,

Doug
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LuckyLefty

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #31 on: September 19, 2006, 10:29:33 AM »
??

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Pinbuster

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #32 on: September 19, 2006, 11:29:15 AM »
LuckyLefty -  I don’t know what you are looking for.

The odds of anyone in the world measuring all of these people would be phenomenal. So no one is going to be able to tell you how extended their spans are.

I have personally seen measured about 6 different guys who either on tour or have toured.
Rick Steelsmith, Justin Hromek, Chris Barnes, Lonnie Waliczek, and Pat Healey among them.

All of them used relaxed finger tip grips. In fact the only person I know of that toured much and had any success with a stretched span was David Ozio. Almost all the touring players will go to relaxed finger tip spans just for comfort after they have been out there for a while.

This may not be as prevalent today since they don’t bowl as many games as they used to.  But unless you have an exceptional flexible hand stretched spans will physicall hurt you eventually if you bowl a lot.

There are only a couple of users on this board that may have the knowledge, Magic Carpet who has coached several of the touring pros and Jeff Carter who is touring.  
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charlest

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #33 on: September 19, 2006, 01:48:14 PM »
Pin buster,

If walter's span is only 4 3/4 at his height of 6'2" or more, then that must be a very relaxed grip. Mine at only 6' is 4 3/4" with 0 thumb pitch and 1/4" back pitch for the fingers, and I'd consider mine relaxed.

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Pinbuster

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #34 on: September 19, 2006, 01:51:53 PM »
You just never know.

I'm 6 foot but my span is only 4 3/8  4 3/8 for a relaxed finger tip grip.

Everybody's different.
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LuckyLefty

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #35 on: September 19, 2006, 01:54:24 PM »
I have viewed on TV the mentioned players expecially the sort of midwest contingent mentioned and I perceive all of them mentioned as having very relaxed spans...less than the standard full fingertip.

Full fingertip meaning last joint when stretched is to middle of hole or very slightly over.  Relaxed meaning when stretched the joint is near the back of the hole!  Stretched defined above.

I perceive the 3 mentioned players...Walter Ray, PDW and Tommy Jones as being full fingertip from my perception of their hand in the ball...I think they are pretty good bowlers too!.  If I remember right Pete Weber from stats on this website is 4 3/4...not a big guy!

Anyone know?...we have about 5 to 6 that are known as above...this is just 3.

I know I can find out Tommy Jones...but PDW = full?  Walter - full?

Someone knows...I can only guess...and I guess FULL!

REgards,

Luckylefty
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Ragnar

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #36 on: September 19, 2006, 01:55:00 PM »
FWIW, my span is 4 13/16 x 4 3/4.  I'm 6' 3+".  It's relaxed (ie, knuckle extends over hole).  I once was at about 5", but that was WAY too long.
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Draxond300

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #37 on: September 19, 2006, 02:04:48 PM »
Relaxed here.  Everyone I bowl with has a moderate relaxed.  I prefer the relaxed as a stroker, as it allows me to get out of the ball smooth.  My Yellow Dot is stretched (drilled by a guy who is from the old school), and I can almost never get a clean release out of it.  I always find myself lofting it out to the arrows.  With the relaxed, I get out of the ball very very clean (as long as user error doesn't change that).  Also, as a stroker, I'm not worried so much about getting higher revs.  I'm more worried about being smooth.
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CoachJim

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #38 on: September 19, 2006, 02:53:48 PM »
quote:
I perceive the 3 mentioned players...Walter Ray, PDW and Tommy Jones as being full fingertip from my perception of their hand in the ball...I think they are pretty good bowlers too!. If I remember right Pete Weber from stats on this website is 4 3/4...not a big guy!

Anyone know?...we have about 5 to 6 that are known as above...this is just 3.

I know I can find out Tommy Jones...but PDW = full? Walter - full?

 


Having watched Tommy Jones on TV, he puts his thumb in the ball first, then his fingers. This would be impossible to do as easilly as he does it with a full or stretched span.

I do agree that PDW is stretched, and has to wear a glove because of all the wear and tear on his hand. It is hard to tell about WRW from watching tv, but I'm gessing relaxed.
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LuckyLefty

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #39 on: September 20, 2006, 04:08:39 AM »
on Tommy and Walter Ray from views of their hand in ball...I don't think relaxed...I don't think stretched...but I believe a classic full fingertip. Just what my eyes are telling me...but anyone....KNOW?

For Pete...I'm not convinced his hand is that beat up from the span or even beat up ...at all...I believe but don't know...that he came up with that glove idea for no wear!

REgards,

Luckylefty
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jchosea

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #40 on: September 20, 2006, 05:30:07 AM »
Just from what I've seen from Tommy Jones I would say his grip is relaxed. I don't believe you could have a stretched grip by putting your thumb in first and dropping your fingers in the holes.
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SKC

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #41 on: September 20, 2006, 06:05:14 AM »


When i was a youth, i used to insert my fingers the exact same way as Tommy Jones does.. Thumb in first with a slight angle of about 45-60 degrees, then twist the hand over towards the holes and then grip the fingertips.. This gave me a feel of a stretched span, when in fact it wasn't.. That was the time when i started to grow really fast.. I couldn't afford having my grip changed all the time, so i kinda figured out a way to keep that stretched feel..
But then again, TJ would probably have figured out a way to get that relaxed or stretched feel he's looking for by now, with all those reps and whatnot..

Untill last year i had a stretched span, and started to feel pain in my finger joints.. I have now gone more relaxed, and no more pain...
I now have it all pretty much figured out, except for the lateral pitches in my thumb.. I'm currently testing with 1/8 to the right..

I'm 5'10'.. And my span is 4'1/2.. Everybody's different..
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CoachJim

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #42 on: September 20, 2006, 11:15:19 AM »
quote:
For Pete...I'm not convinced his hand is that beat up from the span or even beat up ...at all...I believe but don't know...that he came up with that glove idea for no wear!



They talk about the reason for the glove every time PDW bowls. Before the glove his skin would stretch and crack. I used to have the same problem before I switched to a relaxed grip. I switched when Mo Pinnel wrote for BTM and someone asked what to do about that very problem, Mo described the relaxed grip and I have been using it for about 10 years now.

What are you trying to prove anyway?

The PBA Hall of fame is full of people who used both types of grips, I don't believe anyone is saying you can't be successful using either type of grip, but if you are tired of needless hand pain I would switch to the relaxed grip.
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LuckyLefty

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #43 on: September 20, 2006, 02:20:22 PM »
I don't believe everyone is using relaxed....

Especially of the top guys...stretched...no...full fingertip I think more than we realize.

I believe the super relaxed span is overated and has it's own sets of problems.
I have gone back to full and been pleased with the change back...

REgards,

Luckylefty
PS JJWeb and I have been taking lessons from a guy who believes in FULL...not stretched...and I believe he and I are very pleased with our results....
I put a complete post on it....over in drilling a while back...
I believe advantages are stretching the ball to one's break point easier...just one...
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Open the door...see what's possible...and just walk right on through...that's how easy success feels..
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FBM357

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #44 on: September 20, 2006, 02:39:01 PM »
I've used a slightly stretched span for years and felt really comfortable with it as it felt as though my thumb was "locked" in position thus eliminating the 'thought/feel' of gripping the ball.  Now I'm using a shorter/relaxed grip and to be honest, the feel of knuckling/gripping the ball has become a problem.  Apparently more emphasis is placed upon a much tighter thumb fit.  Only callus (small) I developed was at the base of the palm side of my thumb which a bevel fixed (refering to the slightly stretched span).  Now, I find myself adjusting with tape and other stuff to make a snug fit and having to worry about clearing as well.  I'm going back to my slightly stretched span.  felt better, and the release was more consistent.
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NappyCuts

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Re: streched span vs relaxed span
« Reply #45 on: September 20, 2006, 02:44:22 PM »
I love being relaxed. It's GREAT!
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