Author Topic: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball??? (Read 1917 times)

wdavidson · « **on:** June 12, 2009, 01:01:30 AM »

First post, be gentle.

I am a 3/4 roller with a down and in shot and about a 19-20 mph ball speed. Currently bowling in a PBA experience league with a Virtual Gravity and a NVS. So far on the 38ft and 42ft patterns I cannot get the VG to hook at all. I had it sanded down to 250 abralon and still nothing, just skids straight. Pulled out the NVS which is at about 1500 abralon and it hooks about 3-4 boards by the end of the night (a lot for me in this heavy of oil).

I have tried my best to slow down my approach and have maybe gotten my ball speed down to 17mph but still get no hook out of the VG. I am having to point the NVS at the pocket with mixed results.

From everything I have read on the VG and how it is supposedly drilled (as aggressive as it can be, ball drilling is not my forte) this ball should be giving me at least 5 or more boards of hook (preferably more). Is this just the wrong ball for me or am I grossly overlooking something???

Please help. Someone.....anyone.....??

Oskuposer · « **Reply #1 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:09:02 AM »

ball speed is nothing without revs. Is that your speed at release or at the pins. Also alot more oil will make it look faster going down the lane because of less friction to slow it down and for it too hook.
--------------------
Kiall Hill
Visionary test staff

Krakken · « **Reply #2 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:10:40 AM »

Ok First off, welcome.

2nd, 250 abralon is waaaaayayyyyyyy too much surface for any pattern. I would go to the out of box surface for the Virtual. That is why the ball isn't hooking. It is burning up all it's energy before it reaches the arrows.

38 foot is the Viper pattern (lighter volume really), the NVS could be a good fit for it down and in, but you need to get out near the gutter. 19-20 mph is high for ball speed, if your revs don't match up to it, that is why the ball won't read the lane till it is too late and react that way. slowing the ball speed down was a good start, but your revs need to stay the same to see the increased reaction.

42 foot is Scorpion, that is a little bit heavier oil. Try the Virtual up the 5 board and keep your speed down (Again, 250 abralon is way too much surface)
--------------------
ROTO GRIP, There is NO Substitute
Slow Feet, Soft hand = Lots of strikes

wdavidson · « **Reply #3 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:19:21 AM »

Thanks for the replies.

I do try to keep my release the same even with the slower approach so I can keep the revs the same. Any idea how to get a good measurement of my rev number?

Also, what would you recommend I use to get the ball back to it's out of the box surface?

Krakken · « **Reply #4 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:24:31 AM »

quote:
Thanks for the replies.

I do try to keep my release the same even with the slower approach so I can keep the revs the same. Any idea how to get a good measurement of my rev number?

Also, what would you recommend I use to get the ball back to it's out of the box surface?

Take the ball to a pro shop and have them take it back to out of box surface. That is the best way to do it.

The only good way to measure your rev rate is on a CATS system which aren't in most centers. A good teaching pro can put a piece of tape on your ball and give you a rough estimate by watching it roll down the lane.
--------------------
ROTO GRIP, There is NO Substitute
Slow Feet, Soft hand = Lots of strikes

Oskuposer · « **Reply #5 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:24:32 AM »

go to your nearest proshop or professional coach with a camera and he should help you calculate your rev rate. With box im not sure exactly what it is for the Virtual Gravity check in the storm category it should be there
--------------------
Kiall Hill
Visionary test staff

michelle · « **Reply #6 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:47:13 AM »

What line have you been attempting to play? People tend to forget that nothing HOOKS on oil. You are having to play the friction further down the lane which means that speed and a tighter line are often the two things to focus on.

thinkyoung · « **Reply #7 on:** June 12, 2009, 09:49:32 AM »

This site has information on how to find speed, rev's, tilt, pap,
and rotation etc.

http://bowlspot.com/page/release

wdavidson · « **Reply #8 on:** June 12, 2009, 10:59:38 AM »

@ thinkyoung

Thank you very much for the site. That will come in handy.

Dan Belcher · « **Reply #9 on:** June 12, 2009, 01:05:22 PM »

Ball speed is a huge part of this. However, another aspect is that using too much surface will cause the ball to roll too early and expend all its energy in the front part of th elane. This is especially true on a PBA Experience league where the patterns can be long, but are generally not that heavy. The heads tend to get dry on the PBA shots, which means the ball rolls too early and won't hook on the backend. I saw this last night on the Scorpion when throwing my Cell, and it just stopped turning the corner at all. I went from playing 11 to 8 to playing straight up 8 and hitting light in about 6 frames. Finally I switched to my Gravity Shift and moved inside into some fresh oil, and played about 13 out to 9, and magically the ball started to hook again. You have to get the ball to conserve some energy for the back part of the lane. The pearl surface and fresh oil inside of where I was playing let me actually hook the ball more than I was throwing a stronger ball in the friction.

Edited on 6/12/2009 1:05 PM

Smash49 · « **Reply #10 on:** June 12, 2009, 01:23:22 PM »

Hi

How you sand a ball can determine what it will do. It is possible to kill the backend if you do not sand the ball correctly. Do you have the PBAX videos that are available? If not get them. Remember that in the videos you are seeing Wes Malott, Tommy Jones and Jason Couch play the lanes. If you have their game LUCKY YOU. Most people do not. Take the videos and analyze and adapt the information to your game. If you do not have the knowledge to do that, this is what PBAX is about learning.

Have fun and welcome!

Smash49
--------------------
Smash49

Slick, tacky, wood or synthetic it does not matter your slide is correct with SLSM Designs Bowlers Slide Sock. The Finest Slide Sock on the Planet!!!
www.bowlersslidesock.com
Striking Cat Bowling Pro Shop, Duncan Oklahoma! IBPSIA Certified Technician
www.strikingcatbowling.com

jls · « **Reply #11 on:** June 12, 2009, 01:34:26 PM »

250 abralon pad?

Didn't know there was such a thing...

But if by chance there is, it is way to much...

The box finish was 4000, I would try that or go to a 2000 finish. Then if needed go to a 1000 finish...

If that still doesn't work, move right and point...

250???
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jls

J_w73 · « **Reply #12 on:** June 12, 2009, 06:10:31 PM »

quote:
What line have you been attempting to play? People tend to forget that nothing HOOKS on oil. You are having to play the friction further down the lane which means that speed and a tighter line are often the two things to focus on.

that is my problem.. I overestimate what I think the ball should do.. thinking I'll just slow it down and put more hand and I can still swing it some.. WRONG!!

it doesn't take much oil for a ball to not move at all..
--------------------
16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180

icewall · « **Reply #13 on:** June 12, 2009, 07:22:08 PM »

I didnt see you mention something very important.

and that is whether or not you are STAYING behind the ball. when I used to turn my hand early i could rev it up all I wanted and on heavy oil I would be near the gutter just searching for friction desperately.

keep your thumb locked (preferably facing up and dont let it turn!) and keep it there all the way thru the release... turning your fingers just slightly. if you are spinning the ball (even with a high track!) it will skid on just about anything except dry.

if anything my suggestion is to:

1.) get coached IF it is a release problem

2.) take the surface up on the VG to at least 1000 abralon

Author Topic: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball??? (Read 1917 times)

wdavidson

Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

Oskuposer

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

Krakken

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

wdavidson

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

Krakken

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

Oskuposer

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

michelle

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

thinkyoung

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

wdavidson

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

Dan Belcher

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

Smash49

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

jls

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

J_w73

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???

icewall

Re: Heavy Oil. Wrong ball???