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Author Topic: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot  (Read 3501 times)

ITZPS

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8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« on: March 16, 2015, 08:25:37 AM »
Title explains it, bowled this yesterday.  45 entries, I finished -11, missing 5 single pin spares on the day, which was the low to cash number, but I was only 30 pins out of 5th.  This was also a handicap tournament, so 5 people of the 11 who cashed had a significant amount of handicap.  High qualifier and eventual winner was Brian Valenta, who went +80.  Needless to say, it was tough.  I used my Tour Nano all day and just chased the shot inside.  Trying to play straight was a mistake, the track burned quickly, and the backends carried down.  The pattern held up surprisingly well, the last sweeper I bowled at this house was on Tokyo and we were forced several boards deeper by the end of the day on that pattern than we were on this one.  A nice fade through the middle worked the best, trying to create angle was unnecessary and actually a bit difficult.  There's a fine line between getting it down the lane and getting it to finish, move left far enough to keep it off the nose and it ends up going too long.  Moves were very simple, no one should ever be confused or have any trouble reading their ball reaction, it's just tight everywhere.  Miss right, doesn't hook, miss left, hooks a lot. 

Valenta is a pretty fun easy going guy.  He was just there to bowl like everybody else, if you didn't know who he was, you couldn't tell he was a pro, just went about his business and wasn't pretentious or arrogant in the least.  Overall it was a fun tournament, and the thing I took away from it was that even though it was a grind, there is NOTHING better than throwing a great shot on a tough pattern and getting to watch it all the way down the lane when you know it's going to strike.  Can't believe anyone would ever rather bowl on a house shot. 
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 08:27:19 AM by ITZPS »
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Pinbuster

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2015, 09:00:37 AM »
How many bowlers per pair?

ITZPS

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2015, 09:30:36 AM »
4.  Obviously wasn't overloaded, but it was also over 8 games, all of which no one cared about what kind of shape they left the pair in since you move every game.  So while the argument could be made that the lanes wouldn't transition as badly as they would with 10 people on a pair for 3 games, I argue the opposite.  Sweepers are different animals, some people intentionally tear the pairs up that they're on so that those coming behind them will be moving into trouble.  A couple times we moved onto a pair and instantly had to jump 4 or 5 left just because of where the guys in front of us had been, that won't happen in El Paso.  I almost think people may end up being a bit too conservative, the shot actually got pretty scorable games 4-8.  Cannizzaro made an interesting point on the stream last night, the highest opening game for team so far has only been 999.  After that teams have been getting better.  This pattern plays pretty nice once it opens up and you can get deep and wheel on it.  I think people are too worried about beating up the pair too quickly, and I'm not so sure that's going to happen.  The wet/dry line outside is too severe to mess with, once we gave up on that and got deep-ish, we had a nice fade through the middle because you knew it was going to hook on the back.  I had a nice little line from 18-10 for a couple games, and never quite got to 5th arrow. 

How many bowlers per pair?
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itsallaboutme

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2015, 10:06:58 AM »
1 team has shot 3000, 5 doubles teams have shot 1200 and 26 people have shot 1800 in almost a week. 

Eric Forkel, I'm pretty sure everyone would agree he's a good bowler, shot 1766.

It took 80 over by a national tour guy to win a handicap sweeper. 

The lanes are hard.

ITZPS

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2015, 10:19:25 AM »
Yes.  There is some strategy to be had, but the bottom line is just making shots.  Me saying the pattern opens up pretty nicely is relative to how hard it is to begin with . . 220 and 230 games were winning high game pots.  Opening up pretty nicely meant some 2-teen and 220ish games.  Very difficult but very fun shot. 

1 team has shot 3000, 5 doubles teams have shot 1200 and 26 people have shot 1800 in almost a week. 

Eric Forkel, I'm pretty sure everyone would agree he's a good bowler, shot 1766.

It took 80 over by a national tour guy to win a handicap sweeper. 

The lanes are hard.
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ITZPS

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2015, 12:04:19 PM »
Also have to let you know you were right, no one will be throwing urethane, no one intending to cash anyway.  I keep underestimating how super high friction our house is.  The backends yesterday were softer than they appear to be in El Paso, but I felt like the volume up front was truer.  Important piece of information might be that the sweeper wasn't at my center, it was elsewhere . .

1 team has shot 3000, 5 doubles teams have shot 1200 and 26 people have shot 1800 in almost a week. 

Eric Forkel, I'm pretty sure everyone would agree he's a good bowler, shot 1766.

It took 80 over by a national tour guy to win a handicap sweeper. 

The lanes are hard.
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itsallaboutme

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2015, 12:31:15 PM »
Time will tell, but I'm going to say now they may have gone a little too far.  I understand that no one wants it to take 3700 to win, but what they created is tougher than anything most of the people that will go to El Paso have ever bowled on.  And when I say most I would venture to guess more than 95% of the field. 



ITZPS

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2015, 12:58:27 PM »
I'd also agree with that.  I'm a little sadistic so I enjoy it, but 1800 is the goal this year, normally the goal is 1950+.  I have absolutely no excuse for not doing well this year, but doing well has a lot different criteria than it normally does. 

Time will tell, but I'm going to say now they may have gone a little too far.  I understand that no one wants it to take 3700 to win, but what they created is tougher than anything most of the people that will go to El Paso have ever bowled on.  And when I say most I would venture to guess more than 95% of the field.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 01:01:41 PM by ITZPS »
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chrisleftwich

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2015, 07:39:46 AM »
I was also at this sweeper and shot -38.  My best shot was a tight like inside, I was trying to laydown on 20 and get out to 13-14 and had my best look.  Doing this I ended the last three with 650.  I fell into the trap at first also of trying to play straight which lasted at most 8 frames, so really thinking of starting deeper in team at nationals.  Yes the pattern is hard, but if you throw it to your spot and at the correct speed you will get it back to the pocket, so its not unscorable. 
All Navy bowling team 2011, 2013, 2014, 2015

soonerdallas

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2015, 03:39:59 PM »
I was there as well and I went the other way. I was +67 after 5 then ended up plus 16. The biggest thing I noticed was how speed sensitive it was on the fresh. If you juice it just a little it had no chance of making it back. And that was with a pin down hyroad solid that was brand new. All in all good practice though
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Jorge300

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2015, 04:24:23 PM »
Gentlemen,
    Great information. I do have a few questions though:
 
What part, if any, did the residual house shot play into what you saw?
 
In taking a brief look at the streams so far, it seems that there is a line to play on the far outside, at least to start. What part, if any, did this house's topography play into the struggles going straight? I.E. is this house known to have tough to play outsides due to the way the boards/inlays were put down, etc.?
 
Beside Valenta, what balls seemed to be working for those that cashed (not brand/model, but symmetric/asymmetric, dull/shiny, aggressive/mid, etc., just general descriptions)?
 
Thanks again for putting this information forth for others to use.
Jorge300

soonerdallas

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Re: 8 game sweeper on 2015 Team shot
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2015, 04:44:06 PM »
I bowl league here to nights a week and know this place like the back of my hand. Usually any kegel pattern there is always house memory left over. And they play easier. However this was not the case this time. If anything I think with it being a little older surface it made the balls a little calmer than what we will we in El Paso. But I was actually amazed there was no bump outside like all the other patterns ran there
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