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Author Topic: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question  (Read 1293 times)

ClutchClay

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WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« on: February 19, 2004, 10:36:38 PM »
Thursday night I bowl in a fairly serious league.  Last night we were bowling the first place team and in the third frame of game 2 their anchor bowler (219 avg. - used to bowl the national and now bowls regionals and local national tour stops - has an arrogant prick personality) gets a couple belt marks on his brand new Lane 1 Uranium.  Then, as I am coming back from getting a drink, I see him cleaning his ball with stuff from a can labeled "Denatured Alcohol".  I did not think that it was legal for use during competition but I was not sure and did not have the list in my bag (note: I do now).  I mentioned it to my teammates and they did not know either so we said nothing.

Today, I checked the list and denatured alcohol is not legal for use at anytime.  As additional information I will say that my team had guys over and under their averages (series wise) which netted out even and their team had two guys on average and three guys 90, 60 and 50 over their averages.  Needless to say we lost all four points.

So, my question is, what would you do?  Protest and try to get the rule enforced, let it go or something else entirely.
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Regards, ClutchClay

 

cgilyeat

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2004, 01:41:34 PM »
Are you sure it was denatured alcohol and not rubbing Alcohol?  He could simple clain that it was rubbing alcohol and without testing it, there is really no way to tell what it was.  Since he was just removing the belt marks, I'd probably let it go.  An other option is to casually mention it to his tesam captain, and let him talk to the bowler.

ClutchClay

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2004, 01:47:56 PM »
He was putting the stuff onto a towel out of a big (probably 6 X 4 X 2 about 16-24 ounces) can (similar to a paint thinner can - you know - the type with a flip top cap and a small hole) on which was printed "DENATURED ALCOHOL".  He put the can back in his bag where there was another can that I could not see the label on.  I am sure that both are always in his bag.
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Regards, ClutchClay

Gravy

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2004, 02:01:13 PM »
I would ask my self a few questions before I would proceed.

1) Why did he use alcohol on his ball?
2) Did it help his score?
3) What are your chances of changing that nights results?
4) What could I gain on from this issue at this time?
5) Will I have more fun in this league, if I make an issue out incidence?

I know its hard to see things clearly when you really dislike someone.

Just my opinion.


jkiser01

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2004, 02:14:30 PM »
I think its to late to do anything at this point.. If you where going to say anything about this, it should have been done right at the moment you saw it happening..

Like you mentioned, they had 3 guys over average so thats what beat you..

I personally don't think what the guy did was that big of a deal..

Let it go and move on. Its not worth the ridicule you will recieve from other league members..

Just me 2 cents..
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If they only made a ball that would carry that d*mn 10 pin..

jkiser01
Radical Bowling Technologies ...Its more than just an Attitude!

ClutchClay

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2004, 02:37:45 PM »
Apparently so.  Looked just like the big size paint thinner cans at home stores.  I can't imagine needing THAT much (illegal) cleaner during bowling.  But I guess he can.
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Regards, ClutchClay

ClutchClay

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2004, 02:53:44 PM »
jkiser:
I don't necessarily think it's that big of a deal either because I think the rule is stupid.  But, it is the rule and everyone should abide by it.
If we did try to get the rule enforced AND we were successful, then we would win game two, three and total.

As for saying something when it was happening, I did not because I was unsure of my belief that it was not legal for use during competition and had no way to back it up at the time.  That is why I went to bowl.com this morning and printed out the list as well as the general playing rules and abc league rules for immediate placement in my bag.

Gravy:
All my team members thought he got a little more reaction out of the ball after cleaning it than before.  So, did it help his score?  I cannot say for sure but I think it definitely helped his ball move a little more.

I don't necessarily dislike him because I do not really know him that well.  But, he is that guy who thinks that every shot of his that is anywhere close to the pocket should be carrying and is VERY vocal about it both at the foul line and in the settee area.  He also likes to talk about how crappy everyone but him throws the ball.  I can definitely say that I do not like his attitude on the lanes during competition.

What could I gain?  Three more points by forfeit per rule 18: "If it is shown the bowler had prior knowledge their actions were in violation of Rule 18, the game(s) in which the violation occurred is subject to forfeiture".  Of course, "showing" he knew in advance is about as easy as proving that someone is 'bagging.
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Regards, ClutchClay

Edited on 2/20/2004 3:50 PM

ClutchClay

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2004, 03:52:10 PM »
I have decided to give the information to my team captain and let him decide.  But, I will definitely be carrying the rules and list of cleaners with me at all times from now on.

Thanks to everyone who gave their input.
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Regards, ClutchClay

serice

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2004, 05:29:15 PM »
quote:
All my team members thought he got a little more reaction out of the ball after cleaning it than before. So, did it help his score? I cannot say for sure but I think it definitely helped his ball move a little more.
 


Well, even a legal cleaner has the potential to give you a better reaction.  So "better" would not be my criteria.  However, since this guy has it with him, chances are he'll use it again.  I'd prbably talk to the league President and have him watched, but I wouldn't go back.  Especially since he was trying to get belt marks off the ball versus cleaning to "get" a better reaction.

Tex

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Re: WWYD (What Would You Do) - Rule Question
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2004, 09:59:05 PM »
I am as big a stickler for the rules as anyone. However, I would agree at this point last weeks violation is kinda old news at this point. I would however make an attempt to have the violation brought to his attention. The use of denatured alchohol is illegal at anytime. So, technically the ball is was used on could be illegal to use in any competition. Not sure how well this is enforced, but could be a point. You mention he bowls regionals. ABC rules apply in the PBA as well. There are some variations, but I don't think using a chemical to soften the shell is one of them. In this case, if he was only wiping the spots then he was trying just to clean the belt marks, if he was spinning the ball in the rag maybe the marks were an excuse. In either case, he should have the benifit of the doubt this time and then the ball pulled from competition if it happens again.