Post by: Greg T on October 06, 2007, 03:40:06 PM
opinions on the longevity of the MoRich coverstock. I'm looking at the LevRG and wanted to know about reaction loss, coverstock death etc.
Thanx
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Post by: Joe Jr on October 06, 2007, 11:51:42 PM
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My Vid (http://"http://media.putfile.com/Mystic-25")
Formerly Brunswick Lefty & Richard Cranium
Quote from Conspirator300:
And yeah, I do know it all.. I don't spend 30+ hours a week learning more about bowling for my heatlh... I do it so I know more than all of you.. which I do. (besides the random few that are staffers/work in the bowling business.. which that population is decreasing little by little)
Post by: jjweb on October 07, 2007, 12:04:47 AM
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Ah yes. I have my temporary driver's license - and - my astronaut application form... I didn't pass that though, I failed everything but the date of birth. -Steve Martin (The Jerk)
Post by: Greg T on October 07, 2007, 07:50:48 AM
As many of you have probably read, I have had nothing but trouble with Ebo. Although I must say, they make the best balls ever to mach my game. I absolutey love the hit carry and raction when I first get the ball. After 20 to 25 games they become spare balls. I cant keep buying 5 new balls every year. My limit has been reached.
I know MoRich used Big B covers, and the problem I have with that is I could never find a Bi B ball that I could use, and I've tried many. I am hoping it was a core mismatch for me and that MoRich will solve both of my problems. Nobody cleans their equipment any better than I do, and I dont mind buying a new ball every year, given that it will last the year.
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Post by: pnj1967 on October 07, 2007, 08:36:12 AM
quote:
opinions on the longevity of the MoRich coverstock. I'm looking at the LevRG and wanted to know about reaction loss, coverstock death etc.
Thanx
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If yer arm don't hurt ya ain't shiftin it right!
www.krusinklassics.net
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Enjoy the people on the ballreview.com forum. Like to help when I can.
Users I wont deal with, read my profile.
Post by: golfnutFL on October 07, 2007, 10:34:11 AM
quote:
opinions on the longevity of the MoRich coverstock. I'm looking at the LevRG and wanted to know about reaction loss, coverstock death etc.
Thanx
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If yer arm don't hurt ya ain't shiftin it right!
www.krusinklassics.net
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Don't argue with an idiot; people watching may not be able to tell the difference.
Post by: MC on October 07, 2007, 11:01:22 AM
MC
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"Don't Give Up... Don't Ever Give Up."
-Jim Valvano
"Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."
-Vince Lombardi
VISIONARY TEST STAFF 07/08
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Post by: scotts33 on October 07, 2007, 11:07:31 AM
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Scott
Post by: cmoore3wins on October 07, 2007, 11:31:23 AM
Maybe Lanemasters lasts longer than MoRich, maybe not. I would never sacrifice performance for durability! When it comes to bowling ball performance, MoRich is KING!!!
GO WITH MORICH!!
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MoRich World Order
mWo for life - It's a "HOLE" new game....
I flip out ten pins, you flip them off....
Mos cores = Mo scores....
Edited on 10/7/2007 11:39 AM
Post by: MC on October 07, 2007, 11:53:53 AM
But if you ask around it is unanimous that VBP's last. I just sold a Charcoal Ex to Spike2112 (who just did a review on it) and it is like new condition. And that is after I used it as my first ball for about 3 years and that was 2 years ago. I don't keep track of total number of games but I have friends that use VBP exclusively and he is still throwing a new release of the Green Gargoyle (before USBC stamp on ball).
I threw it out as an option for a member who is reluctant due to past history of ball "death", and I have not only never seen it with VBP, but never heard of it. Good luck with which ever you choose.
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"Don't Give Up... Don't Ever Give Up."
-Jim Valvano
"Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."
-Vince Lombardi
VISIONARY TEST STAFF 07/08
Tag Team Coaching success story Post by: J_Mac on October 07, 2007, 12:07:25 PM
quote:
Without care, how many Games will your beloved *INSERT BALL COMPANY HERE* last?
Fixed
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"A word to the wise ain't necessary -- it's the stupid ones that need the advice." Bill Cosby
"Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."
Post by: charlest on October 07, 2007, 12:17:43 PM
Bottom line, MoRich covers are/were made by Brunswick and Columbia; they are no better or worse than Ebonite covers. Some Ebo may absorb at a higher rate than other manufacturers.
In today's environment, all balls MUST be cleaned IMMEDIATELY after use and before putting them back into the bag. That is the only way they will last. All will need some kind of treatment in the 50 - 250 game range, depending on many factors: dullness of surface, amount of oil bowled upon, rev rate, roughness of the lane surface, etc.
I'd venture a guess that most balls can last 500 - 1500 games, if properly cared for.
I agree with several others here that Visionary and Lanemasters are the standouts, the longest lasting and most durable with the least care necessary, but they still need to be cared for.
Cmoore,
I am sorry you had a problem with your Haus machine. I can change the surface on any Lanemasters/Legends balls with my home spinner with sandpaper, Abralon or if necessary, Trizact pads. The hardest to do so far was the Masterpiece, a resin pearl; I needed to use Trizact on it to get a ball reaction change. Most times, I have found that polish or sandpaper make significant changes to the ball's reaction.
Sorry also that you were not able to use Lanemasters balls to keep your avg. at 234; I guess you needed the backend help from the MoRich cores to do that. I wish I could average 230. Congratulations. That's impressive anywhere.
MoRich may be King for you, just not for everyone.
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"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Worrying is like rocking in a rocking chair: it gives you something to do, but doesn't get you anywhere!"
Post by: 86camaroman on October 07, 2007, 12:38:03 PM
Post by: Greg T on October 07, 2007, 01:38:58 PM
I appreciate the replies, but PLEASE, save your breath about maintenence. I have been over this a million times and will repeat that NOONE takes any better care of equipment than I. Period. So, that part is out of the equation. I find it verty hard to believe that ALL bowling balls die after 25 games, so this too is out of the equation.
I have not tried Lanemasters. In fact, the only balls I have thrown in 10 years is Ebo, with one Strike Zone thrown in that was an absolute piece of crap for my game. Useless. All I'm looking for is the reaction, long and strong snap, of the Ebo with the capability of lasting at least a season.
I have just put holes in a NM Beat'N and will throw it on Wednesady. I will be looking for one more ball this year to compliment the reaction I get from that. I won't know what reaction this is until I throw it.
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Post by: Xfest on October 07, 2007, 03:06:01 PM
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Formerly known as KennySkidmore.
http://www.kennyskidmorebowling.com
It's up, but we are still updating!
Post by: cmoore3wins on October 07, 2007, 05:28:53 PM
quote:
Cmoore,
I am sorry you had a problem with your Haus machine.
I guess you needed the backend help from the MoRich cores to do that. Congratulations. That's impressive anywhere.
Charlest,
There was "NO" problem whatsoever with Haus machine or diamond wheels. We even tried 60 grit sandpaper. Nothing we tried would cut into the cover... These were free test balls from Lanemasters, so maybe they were from a test run or something, but the covers were super tough!!
I am slightly rev dominant, so do not need back end help. I like MoRich for pin carry, not backend help. I carry far more ten pins with MoRich than with any balls used previously. Which is good, cuz I miss most of the ones I leave - LOL
Thanks on the congrats for the average. I am there because of John Jameson's help, MoRich balls, some talent and THS...
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MoRich World Order
mWo for life - It's a "HOLE" new game....
I flip out ten pins, you flip them off....
Mos cores = Mo scores....
Post by: charlest on October 07, 2007, 06:16:53 PM
I said that I'm sorry about the Haus machine because my spinner and my abrasives were able to change my and friend's Lanemasters and Legends ball reaction. I can only assume I was successful in modifying the diamonds' and the "supercarbon"'s surfaces because the ball reaction changed drastically. That makes me believe there might have been some undetected anomalies with either the Haus's diamond pads or the machine itself. I cannot tell and I probably couldn't if it stood up and yelled at me.
I remain sad that you were not able to modify lanemasters balls to your satisfaction. While they may never exceed MoRich balls in your opinion, I am certain you would at least have been more satisfied with them than you are now.
I also find Lanemasters balls, as well as several other good balls from other brands, to kick out 10 pins very fiercely, as you say MoRich does for you.
There are brands for me also which I could not not get to work as well as I would have liked. Even now I found it hard to even get myself to try some of them, even when many ballreviews members boast much success with them.
"Chacon a son gout." Each to his own pleasure.
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"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Worrying is like rocking in a rocking chair: it gives you something to do, but doesn't get you anywhere!"
Post by: mainzer on October 08, 2007, 08:48:20 AM
Mo's stuff hold up forever, I had the old Hercules with over 500 games on it when I finally sold it to anither guy and he is still using it now it just does not quit I have never had and issue with any of their stuff dying on me even their particle stuff hold up forever. Overall Mo is a great product I can't say enough good stuff.
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Mainzerpower
Post by: Greg T on October 08, 2007, 07:34:42 PM
quote:
mainzer, it was no big deal to me either but I was trying to tell this guy that there really is no difference between 1 maker and another if the ball is properly maintained, based on his response, I thought he was kind of an Idiot for asking about Longevity from a Brunswick made MoRich product if he was that educated on this game. People that normally ask that type of question have very little experience in this game and that's what he sounded like.
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My Seahawks are on their way to a 5th straight NFC West Crown, I'm hoping for a Dallas Cowboy rematch in the play-off's!
Had you paid attention to my posts you would have seen that i have been throwing Ebo equipment for 10+ years. How is that supposed to give me experience with different mfgs? I bow to your prowess, old great one and apologize for my ignorance. For what the hell was I thinking, asking a moRich question in the MoRich forum?? DUH!!! I guess if I have a question about Track, Columbia or Hammer I should ask it in the Ebo forum?? Douchebag.
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Edited on 10/8/2007 7:35 PM
Post by: qstick777 on October 08, 2007, 10:07:38 PM
quote:quote:
mainzer, it was no big deal to me either but I was trying to tell this guy that there really is no difference between 1 maker and another if the ball is properly maintained, based on his response, I thought he was kind of an Idiot for asking about Longevity from a Brunswick made MoRich product if he was that educated on this game. People that normally ask that type of question have very little experience in this game and that's what he sounded like.
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My Seahawks are on their way to a 5th straight NFC West Crown, I'm hoping for a Dallas Cowboy rematch in the play-off's!
Had you paid attention to my posts you would have seen that i have been throwing Ebo equipment for 10+ years. How is that supposed to give me experience with different mfgs? I bow to your prowess, old great one and apologize for my ignorance. For what the hell was I thinking, asking a moRich question in the MoRich forum?? DUH!!! I guess if I have a question about Track, Columbia or Hammer I should ask it in the Ebo forum?? Douchebag.
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If yer arm don't hurt ya ain't shiftin it right!
www.krusinklassics.net
Edited on 10/8/2007 7:35 PM
You'll have to ignore some people Greg.
Some people like to use words like "idiot" on people, yet these are the same people that ask the same question they asked 1 year ago. Answer hasn't changed, so they pitch a fit and cry that a picture from 10 years ago looks different today - how dare a company update their pictures!
Me thinks some people have no business calling other people an "idiot."
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Post by: Slopsurprise on October 10, 2007, 06:05:31 AM
BTW, I personally like L/L balls. You might want to try one.
Post by: Greg T on October 10, 2007, 09:54:51 AM
quote:
Greg T, I will start out by saying that you will have no problems with Morich covers at all. I have had the same Big E experience with covers as you also. I see you did not like the strike zone and you like a long and strong reaction. I seriously doubt you will like Morich at all based on that. If you have good hand in the ball, Morich balls are rolly and all about control for the most part. I dont give a "F" how you drill it people, that is just the personality of the ball if you can put anything into a ball off the hand. I have owned lots of Morich stuff with various drillings and that is what they are. They are great for low/medium rev/speed dominant/spinners that need help from the ball. These balls will trun over great for that type of player. If you thought the Strike zone was rolly for you at all, dont go with Morich becasue it will be even more that way.
BTW, I personally like L/L balls. You might want to try one.
I cant say for certain what the problem was with the Strike Zone. It just skidded and didnt wrinkle at all. Yet, when I purchased the original One I had a hard time finding the right side of the headpin. I am a higher speed tweener with a medium/high track and I love long and strong. As I said, I find that Ebo is a perfect match for my game but I refuse to throw away 4 or 5 balls every season. I'll quit bowling before I continue to do that.
I need something with an exaggerated backend motion because our lanes don't aide the ball's break. We have very weak backends and somewhat decent head oil. I just dont want something that starts up too early.
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Post by: WSUstroker on October 10, 2007, 09:58:59 AM
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Dan Chambers
www.absolutebowling.com
Post by: Greg T on October 10, 2007, 10:07:22 AM
quote:
Greg, are you looking at going with 1 company or mixing it up a bit?
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Dan Chambers
www.absolutebowling.com
I am not brand loyal. I will buy reaction, not logo. I am throwing a Beat'N for the first time tonight and will get a reation from that, then, I will look for something to compliment that reaction. This may be something stronger, or longer, or weaker. I wont know until I throw tonight.
What I DO know is that I want some durability. And, as I said, with out conditions I need length with a very strong backend.
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Post by: WSUstroker on October 10, 2007, 10:15:32 AM
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Dan Chambers
www.absolutebowling.com
Post by: Greg T on October 10, 2007, 11:47:44 AM
quote:
I know this isn't Morich, but if you like Ebo type stuff and the BeatN lasts longer for you, take a look at the Black Widow. Pretty darn snappy for a solid reactive at its box 4000 grit finish. Also, the Break from 900Global seems quite strong, a tad stronger than the BW even.
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Dan Chambers
www.absolutebowling.com
I will consider these after I see what kind of reaction I'm getting from the Beat'N. I'm going to try two different companies at the same time. I wont buy another Hammer right now, considering who owns the company. This cover may not be any better. It may be exactly what I want. Time will tell. So for now, I will purchase another reation from another company.
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Post by: Slopsurprise on October 10, 2007, 11:40:33 PM
quote:quote:
Greg T, I will start out by saying that you will have no problems with Morich covers at all. I have had the same Big E experience with covers as you also. I see you did not like the strike zone and you like a long and strong reaction. I seriously doubt you will like Morich at all based on that. If you have good hand in the ball, Morich balls are rolly and all about control for the most part. I dont give a "F" how you drill it people, that is just the personality of the ball if you can put anything into a ball off the hand. I have owned lots of Morich stuff with various drillings and that is what they are. They are great for low/medium rev/speed dominant/spinners that need help from the ball. These balls will trun over great for that type of player. If you thought the Strike zone was rolly for you at all, dont go with Morich becasue it will be even more that way.
BTW, I personally like L/L balls. You might want to try one.
I cant say for certain what the problem was with the Strike Zone. It just skidded and didnt wrinkle at all. Yet, when I purchased the original One I had a hard time finding the right side of the headpin. I am a higher speed tweener with a medium/high track and I love long and strong. As I said, I find that Ebo is a perfect match for my game but I refuse to throw away 4 or 5 balls every season. I'll quit bowling before I continue to do that.
I need something with an exaggerated backend motion because our lanes don't aide the ball's break. We have very weak backends and somewhat decent head oil. I just dont want something that starts up too early.
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If yer arm don't hurt ya ain't shiftin it right!
www.krusinklassics.net
You know, I had a Ravage, and Absolute, and another one I dont remember what it was that didnt wrinkle at all either. Seriously, it was straighter than a spare ball. I think once in a while something must have happened with the batch of stuff for the covers???? That is probally what was up with the Strike Zone. I had plenty of luck with many other Big B covers though.
Have you tried any of the new offerings from Storm?
Edited on 10/10/2007 11:45 PM
Post by: Greg T on October 11, 2007, 07:39:52 AM
Nope. The first thing I've thrown other than Ebo is the Beat'N I just threw last night. Awesome ball, but now I am in need of something with a tad more length to compliment that. I'm looking into all options at this point.
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Post by: MrNattyBoh on October 11, 2007, 08:41:34 AM
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Mr. 298
Great Scores with InSite!
Natty Boh Bowling!
Post by: shelley on October 11, 2007, 08:49:42 AM
quote:
Morich makes good products but since they are made by brunswick they lack durability. The covers will die within 20-25 games. They soak up oil so much quicker than any other company.
I can't tell you that your balls didn't die, but you are definitely the exception and not the rule. Powerkoil18 and Activator (which are the two most common Big B covers and what's been on Mo's balls for a while) are two of the most durable, longest lasting covers you can buy.
SH
Post by: Slopsurprise on October 11, 2007, 09:03:42 AM
quote:
Nope. The first thing I've thrown other than Ebo is the Beat'N I just threw last night. Awesome ball, but now I am in need of something with a tad more length to compliment that. I'm looking into all options at this point.
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If yer arm don't hurt ya ain't shiftin it right!
www.krusinklassics.net
Storm has been known for a bit more length than usual and more pop on the backend. Overall, their balls turn left harder than most other companies stuff. That is just their personality. When I look for a ball, to open up the backends, to recover, and to turn left hard, I go to storm. When I look for control and not cover a ton of boards, I like Morich. They are really like polar opposites in reaction. Seriously, try out a Storm. It sounds like it could work for what you want.
Edited on 10/11/2007 9:04 AM
Post by: Greg T on October 11, 2007, 09:24:30 AM
The last Storm I used was when the Eraser was first released. Worked okay for a short time, but we were on a flood at that time and the ball died really quickly. I heated it, but that was at the very biginning of oil extraction and the oven was much too dry and didnt really work well. I have not used Storm since then. I was using Ebo.
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Post by: kleptic on October 11, 2007, 09:34:17 AM
Post by: Greg T on October 11, 2007, 09:53:02 AM
quote:
I want to see a video of these dead balls, I have a hard time believing a ball died within 25 games even if you never cleaned it. do you alway try to play way inside and these balls wont make the turn or what's the deal. I've put so many games on every ball I've owned and even before I knew how to care for a ball they lasted a long time.
My comfort zone is about 15 to 5. I can always find a shot somewhere near, being the 17 board or even the 12, there is always something that works well. On occasion I can pull deep inside and play 20 or 25 to 8 or 5 and make a good shot. When I drilled up my One, Big One, TNV, etc. I was always able to play the deep as well as the 12 board. After 20 to 30 games AND METICULOUS CLEANING between shots and after every set, the ball will not recover from anywhere but a common track shot, maybe around the 8 or 10 board. If I attempt to play deep with a 30 game ball I have a 50/50 chance of ditching it or maybe hitting the 3/6 pocket. All the oil extraction and resurfacing in the world will not bring it back. If I get some time during the week and can possible find a fresh lane I will make a vid of two TNVs. One from the beginning of last year and one bought new just for the roll-offs. They're both dead. I can play them up the twig and they will SLOWLY move toward the pocket. Very similar to plastic.
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Post by: Dan Belcher on October 11, 2007, 10:02:49 AM
For what it's worth, I haven't had problems with Storm balls dying on me recently. I thought my Special Agent was losing some hit after TONS of games in my PBA league over the summer on long oil, so I took it down to 500, then worked it back up to 2000, threw a couple games, and hit it with some Clean & Dull on a spinner. It rolled like brand new! I even got to use it for the first time in awhile the other night because the backends were tighter than usual and my pearl/pearl particle equipment wasn't taking out the 10 pin. Until the heads dried up and I couldn't keep it off the headpin without swinging it to the gutter and giving up entry angle, it was smacking pins around like crazy.
Post by: Xfest on October 11, 2007, 10:14:21 AM
quote:
Greg,
Bottom line, MoRich covers are/were made by Brunswick and Columbia; they are no better or worse than Ebonite covers. Some Ebo may absorb at a higher rate than other manufacturers.
In today's environment, all balls MUST be cleaned IMMEDIATELY after use and before putting them back into the bag. That is the only way they will last. All will need some kind of treatment in the 50 - 250 game range, depending on many factors: dullness of surface, amount of oil bowled upon, rev rate, roughness of the lane surface, etc.
I'd venture a guess that most balls can last 500 - 1500 games, if properly cared for.
I agree with several others here that Visionary and Lanemasters are the standouts, the longest lasting and most durable with the least care necessary, but they still need to be cared for.
Cmoore,
I am sorry you had a problem with your Haus machine. I can change the surface on any Lanemasters/Legends balls with my home spinner with sandpaper, Abralon or if necessary, Trizact pads. The hardest to do so far was the Masterpiece, a resin pearl; I needed to use Trizact on it to get a ball reaction change. Most times, I have found that polish or sandpaper make significant changes to the ball's reaction.
Sorry also that you were not able to use Lanemasters balls to keep your avg. at 234; I guess you needed the backend help from the MoRich cores to do that. I wish I could average 230. Congratulations. That's impressive anywhere.
MoRich may be King for you, just not for everyone.
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"None are so blind as those who will not see."
Worrying is like rocking in a rocking chair: it gives you something to do, but doesn't get you anywhere!"
Why do you care so much about L/LM balls to like try and persuade everybody.. All ball companies have good balls you know..
--------------------
Formerly known as KennySkidmore.
http://www.kennyskidmorebowling.com
It's up, but we are still updating!
Post by: shelley on October 11, 2007, 10:49:40 AM
quote:
Why do you care so much about L/LM balls to like try and persuade everybody.. All ball companies have good balls you know..
Because it costs me $200 to throw a Lanemasters ball for several years while it would cost me (or Greg) $1000+ to throw an Ebonite ball for that long, having had to replace it a half-dozen times.
All ball companies have good balls. You're right. They all put out stuff that reacts well and hits hard (on the right conditions, with the right surface,...). Not all ball companies put out long-lasting equipment that is versatile, easy to care for, and durable. If you want to choose two out of "long lasting", "lots of hit", and "good reaction" go ahead. I can choose all three by picking Lanemasters.
SH
Post by: Greg T on October 11, 2007, 11:10:31 AM
I was looing into a Legends Black Pearl, but think I'm going to try a 900 Global Break.
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