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Author Topic: WSOB - Viper show  (Read 5095 times)

charlest

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WSOB - Viper show
« on: December 05, 2010, 09:51:51 AM »
Anyone else notice that Bill O'Neill used a solid (I think the Taboo is a solid) and everyone else used pearls, mostly polished pearls?

If you wish to ignore the solid/pearl concept, think Bill used a medium-sharp breaking oiler and the others used extra-sharp breaking, polished non-oilers.

Was that the main difference or just A difference?

I would have said speed was a factor but Tommy and DeVaney can certainly throw the ball as fast as Bill. Speed, or lack thereof, seemed to be a factor for Monacelli and Gomes.

I'd also guess that the finals' conditions were slightly different from the qualifying conditions.
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BT808

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2010, 06:41:07 PM »
It looked to me like he just had a different ball roll than all the others. Even he said so in the interview after the show.. All the other guys were by far more around the ball than he is causing a little over under IMO.
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Pozz

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2010, 07:06:30 PM »

Give Bill O'Neil some credit.  He was just throwing the ball better than anybody else on the show.  If you watched carefully he hit his area with the same speed  on the ball more than anybody else on the show by far.  Jones was all over the all and so was Devaney. O'Neil was also getting the ball to roll down the lane and it looked like everyone else was more around the side of it.  Make no mistake though, Bill O'Neil was puring the hell out of more shots than anyone else.

charlest

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2010, 08:10:27 PM »
quote:

Give Bill O'Neil some credit.  He was just throwing the ball better than anybody else on the show.  If you watched carefully he hit his area with the same speed  on the ball more than anybody else on the show by far.  Jones was all over the all and so was Devaney. O'Neil was also getting the ball to roll down the lane and it looked like everyone else was more around the side of it.  Make no mistake though, Bill O'Neil was puring the hell out of more shots than anyone else.


Please don't try to put words in my mouth. I was not trying to take any credit away from Bill. Just saying that execution wasn't the only factor involved here.

You can hardly say Gomes executed even one shot badly.
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HAMMERDOWN103

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2010, 08:12:01 PM »
I agree. Give credit where credit is due. He was crazy consistent. Not to mention his leaves where all makeable spares....
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Russell

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2010, 08:26:23 PM »
O'Neill has the ultimate ball roll for those patterns.  His axis tilt has to be pretty high, and his rotation is relatively medium to low.  This lets him play controllable angles through the front, but get the ball to float so clean.  Most guys that play where he does don't have that much tilt, so the ball reads too early and doesn't continue off the spot.  Most with that much axis tilt have difficulty on the fresh.

He's the best bowler on the planet right now hands down.
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Pozz

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2010, 08:39:00 PM »
Charlest

All I am saying is that if you watch closely O'Neil executed shots repeatedly.  Gomez did spray the ball a bit.  Now I don't know if he was just trying to find  something that would carry or  what, but you have to say that overall O'Neil just outbowled the competition by making more consistent shots for all four games he bowled.

Pozz

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2010, 08:48:06 PM »
I do agree that O'Neil matched his capabilities with the right ball for the condition as Charlest implied.  I think overall just Bill being behind the ball and rolling it coupled with great consistency and shotmaking allowed him to control the ball at the breakpoint and read the lane perfectly.  Opposed to the other bowlers who really looked to be getting around the ball.  I thought also that Gomez might have had a better look with the Hyroad had he decided just to throw it harder.

Russell

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2010, 08:58:06 PM »
I won't disagree with that assessment.  I'm going to assume that during the week that the pattern called for deep inside angles with tilt.  Looking at who was on the show that had to be the case.

I will also say that if TJ hadn't thrown the 2.0 it might have been different too.  It looked like the ball was picking up and burning too much when he actually got it to the spot.
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MrPerfect

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2010, 09:53:27 PM »
Yeah, watching this show I realized that the show pair was completely different than what everyone had bowled on all week. However, that is part of the rub of the PBA, and you need to plan accordingly. If you are the top seed I don''t see how you aren''t in the stands the first two matches watching the matches, because you will learn a lot more from that than any practice shots you get leading into the match.

However, in spite of that, O''Neill did the right thing and found the ball and technique that worked best for those matches. He found a line and technique that no only allowed him to score, but minimized the penalty when he did make a mistake.

Further, I understand we all make fun of Chris Barnes when he attempts to mimic a style, which is not his "A" game, but which is working for another bowler instead of using his "A" game. I just don''t see how so many guys couldn''t see that the lanes weren''t playing like they did during the week and made the correct ball and technique change.

Congrats to the Real Deal, that telecast will sell a lot of Taboo''s.



Edited on 12/5/2010 10:54 PM

NeumannKnight

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #10 on: December 05, 2010, 10:05:51 PM »
O'Neill is BY FAR the best player on tour.
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LuckyLefty

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2010, 10:18:39 AM »
When I watch a metamorphisis like this I always wonder what has changed.

The ball was very floaty to the breakpoint and smooth off the spot.  The solid sure DID look better and smoother off the spot which matched this TV show shot.

Bill O'neill over the last year has seemed to stop his dramatic loop out move at the top of his backswing.  Have you noticed?  

Often when I see something like this I believe it is a ton of hard work....OR a tweak in grip, pitches,  and fit?  Anyone?  Any ideas.

REgards,

Luckylefty


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rickywin

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2010, 08:52:06 PM »
You can definitely see the space between his arm and his body is much less than that of a couple years ago. This and his timing can be attributed to Mark Baker. He's also learned to not wrench on it on every shot, and bowl with a softer hand, and I believe thats why he's able to become more versatile and play further right than everyone else. He's probably done a bit more forward in his thumb, so his hand can relax a bit.

Russell

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2010, 08:55:47 PM »
I actually practiced with Jason Sterner today and we were talking about this.  He did work on tightening up his swing and keeping his tilt up.  This is what makes him so good is the forward roll and tilt he's able to get.  His ball seems to float like the tilters (Gomes, Fagan, Devaney, PDW, Mallot), but because his ball isn't dead on its side he can control the backend reaction.  When he misses he leaves 10s and 4s....not 2/8/10s and greek churches.
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sstaz

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Re: WSOB - Viper show
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2010, 09:08:13 PM »
Not sure but i did watch a little preview of this but the Taboo that was being thorw was a pearl not solid unless it was the lights and the oil makeing it look that way