BallReviews
Equipment Boards => Storm => Topic started by: BeerLeague on November 30, 2015, 08:03:51 AM
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I've been reading thru the posts on this forum on how to recreate the surface .....
I have 2 simple solutions ....
1.) fresh 1500 siaair pad and Storm reacta-shine over top
or
2.) use a wet, worn 4000 pad on spinner for about 1 minute a side.
They both give me what looks like the factory surface ..... any thoughts?
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Sounds reasonable to me. It ain't rocket science.
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One thing though,
The 1500 in "1500 Polished" is a US grit scale.
The typical steps for a "1500 Polished" are 500,1000,2000,4000 + Polish. Which theoretically would give you a US 1500 grit with polish on it.
(In US ANSI/CAMI the steps would be approx. 360, 600, 1200, 1500 + Polish)
A 1500 Siaair pad is a P-scale grit which is around 800 US grit. So just using a 1500 Siaair and putting polish on that would give you a US 800 grit with polish on it.
As for using a worn 4000 pad, A new 4000 abralon is a US 1500 grit to begin with.
A worn one would be even finer than that and putting polish on that would give you a even smoother surface. Not a 1500 polish.
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I've played around with finding the right combination to bring back the 1500+polish surface, especially on my favorites like the Virtual Energy and Anarchy. I've tried everything under the sun and have finally come to what I feel gets me as close to factory as I can get, reaction wise. Depending on wear, but I generally start with 1000 on 6 sides, 3000 on 6 sides, then Storm Step 2 on top.
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One thing though,
The 1500 in "1500 Polished" is a US grit scale.
The typical steps for a "1500 Polished" are 500,1000,2000,4000 + Polish. Which theoretically would give you a US 1500 grit with polish on it.
(In US ANSI/CAMI the steps would be approx. 360, 600, 1200, 1500 + Polish)
A 1500 Siaair pad is a P-scale grit which is around 800 US grit. So just using a 1500 Siaair and putting polish on that would give you a US 800 grit with polish on it.
As for using a worn 4000 pad, A new 4000 abralon is a US 1500 grit to begin with.
A worn one would be even finer than that and putting polish on that would give you a even smoother surface. Not a 1500 polish.
BJI uses the Innovative grit measuring device on every ball they test for a long time now. Almost every ball whose stock surface is "1500 grit polished" measures in the 5000 - 5500 grit range. I'd say that sanding with a 1500/2000 grit pad and then polishing with any good bowling ball polish will get you that result.
I never heard that the "1500" grit is a CAMI measurement. May I ask where you got that information from and how long ago?
I find it hard to believe that any bowling ball manufacturer is currently using the CAMI scale, and not the FEPA scale in this day and age.
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BJI uses the Innovative grit measuring device on every ball they test for a long time now. Almost every ball whose stock surface is "1500 grit polished" measures in the 5000 - 5500 grit range. I'd say that sanding with a 1500/2000 grit pad and then polishing with any good bowling ball polish will get you that result.
That my very well work, I don't have a scanner to try it. So I'm not saying that sanding with a P-1500/2000 grit pad and polishing won't give you a 5000 - 5500 grit range.
I never heard that the "1500" grit is a CAMI measurement. May I ask where you got that information from and how long ago?
I find it hard to believe that any bowling ball manufacturer is currently using the CAMI scale, and not the FEPA scale in this day and age.
Where did I originally get the info? I didn't remember it's been years, it could have been on this forum for all I know.
I just know that when the companies started going to abralon, a lot of the ball surface grits were still being listed using the CAMI scale, even though they were being sanded with Abralon, Because Abralon wasn't widely used yet.
Like the liquid grits that showed a grit number, used CAMI scale until fairly recently.
Now over time they have replaced the CAMI references and are now listing the surfaces as Abralon grits, But the "1500 Polished" is still a holdover from back then.
As for as I know it's just never been changed. The 1500 in "1500 Polished" is a CAMI Number. Even though they use abralon to do it (P4000 = 1500cami)
Over the years I've tried to double check this stuff, If you have something that says that's wrong post it. I want to try and keep my info updated.
UPDATE
I just wrote storm and surprisingly they replied immediately.
I asked:
Question: Is the 1500 in "1500-grit Polished Factory Finish" a old reference to the US ANSI/CAMI grit scale? I assume it is because the final grit before the polish is a 4000 Abralon, which is the equivalent of 1500 grit ANSI/CAMI.
Storms reply:
You are correct.
Thanks for your question.
Chad McLean
Bowl Up A Storm!
Chad McLean | Storm Technical Staff | Storm Products, Inc. | +1.435.723.0403
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I think my next major bowling purchase has to be the Innovative scanner. Or maybe it's Jayhawk. Either way, I gots to get me one. ;D
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TBH, conversations like this are why I take new balls and put the surface at what I anticipate using it at and adjust from there. I always want to be able to replicate what I find that works, and box finishes can be tough to replicate. It would suck to love a ball at box finish and not be able to replicate it for some reason.
It's just something that works for me.
As to the OP, my version of it is a fresh 1500 siaair + Storm Xtra Shine polish. I'm a big fan of Xtra Shine.
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UPDATE
I just wrote storm and surprisingly they replied immediately.
I asked:
Question: Is the 1500 in "1500-grit Polished Factory Finish" a old reference to the US ANSI/CAMI grit scale? I assume it is because the final grit before the polish is a 4000 Abralon, which is the equivalent of 1500 grit ANSI/CAMI.
Storms reply:
You are correct.
Thanks for your question.
Chad McLean
Bowl Up A Storm!
Chad McLean | Storm Technical Staff | Storm Products, Inc. | +1.435.723.0403
tech@stormbowling.com
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UPDATE
I just wrote storm and surprisingly they replied immediately.
I asked:
Question: Is the 1500 in "1500-grit Polished Factory Finish" a old reference to the US ANSI/CAMI grit scale? I assume it is because the final grit before the polish is a 4000 Abralon, which is the equivalent of 1500 grit ANSI/CAMI.
Storms reply:
You are correct.
Thanks for your question.
Chad McLean
Bowl Up A Storm!
Chad McLean | Storm Technical Staff | Storm Products, Inc. | +1.435.723.0403
tech@stormbowling.com
Interesting and Thank you.
I remain surprised that any manufacturer is using the CAMI scale; it can only confuse many issues.
People can certainly use a 3000/4000 grit FEPA, if that makes them feel like they will get closer to the stock finish. Once applying the abrasives in most polishes, the results should not vary greatly.
Over the years, many people often found the stock polishes (I'm thinking of Storm/RG and the old Columbia balls [Columbia, AMF, Track etc.]) to be far too uncontrollable; many of those, when they had the means, often re-sanded the ball and re-polished it to their liking.
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I found a .PDF file from Storm that says how to recreate the 1500 polish surface. You need the Step 2 compound. I followed the instructions with my spinner as was able to replicate the finish. I have a new iq tour 30 that is straight out of the box. Using that ball as the benchmark I was able to nail it on my Hyroad and Punch Out
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It seems like the more the subject of Storm's 1500 polished surface comes up, the more it seems like Storm's Step 2 is the real key to duplicating it. I really wish they made it in a smaller bottle. Just can't justify buying the big one.
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3M Perfect-It II Fine Cut Rubbing compound in place of Step 2.
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Mental note. Never use Step 2. I hate that finish.
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3M Perfect-It II Fine Cut Rubbing compound in place of Step 2.
My guess is it's the same product. Storm doesn't make their own compounds so it logical to assume 3m does
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I found a .PDF file from Storm that says how to recreate the 1500 polish surface. You need the Step 2 compound. I followed the instructions with my spinner as was able to replicate the finish. I have a new iq tour 30 that is straight out of the box. Using that ball as the benchmark I was able to nail it on my Hyroad and Punch Out
Isn't that what I said quite awhile ago????
*****I've played around with finding the right combination to bring back the 1500+polish surface, especially on my favorites like the Virtual Energy and Anarchy. I've tried everything under the sun and have finally come to what I feel gets me as close to factory as I can get, reaction wise. Depending on wear, but I generally start with 1000 on 6 sides, 3000 on 6 sides, then Storm Step 2 on top.
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Unless you have a ball scanner, You'll never know what surface actually came on a ball from the factory or what surface you actually have on it after sanding & polishing it yourself.
The main thing is don't worry about trying to match the factory surface (unless you have scanner and can keep adjusting it until it match's up).
Try to match the reaction, By using whatever steps (regardless of what they are), that gives you a surface that gives you the reaction you want.
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Unless you have a ball scanner, You'll never know what surface actually came on a ball from the factory or what surface you actually have on it after sanding & polishing it yourself.
The main thing is don't worry about trying to match the factory surface (unless you have scanner and can keep adjusting it until it match's up).
Try to match the reaction, By using whatever steps (regardless of what they are), that gives you a surface that gives you the reaction you want.
+1
Adjust cover to achieve proper reaction.