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Author Topic: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol  (Read 9695 times)

lefty50

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Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« on: May 16, 2018, 11:21:57 AM »
Ok, I admit... I'm still debating which handles more oil... Phaze II or Idol?

 

2handedrook12

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2018, 11:44:12 AM »
Idol and it's not close in my opinion. Idol has the strongest cover in Storm/Roto and the Phaze II is a step down in cover strength.
League: Pitch Purple, Destiny Magenta
Testing: MVP
Interests: Black Widow, Proof Solid, Idol Pearl

lefty50

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2018, 11:56:39 AM »
Interesting. More opinions also please, but if true, where would you put the Sure Lock?

SVstar34

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2018, 12:15:16 PM »
I agree on the Idol handling more oil. I wouldn't say it's a huge difference but I think the gap widens because the Phase 2 cover seems to require even more maintenance than the nano cover

LookingForALeftyWall

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2018, 12:45:08 PM »
I've have had all 3 and I would put them from strongest to weakest as follows:

1. Sure Lock
2. Idol
3. Phaze II

Luke Rosdahl

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2018, 09:44:42 PM »
I would agree with this.  To expand though, there are also several balls between the Idol and Phaze 2 in my mind, the Trick, Show Off, and Exist would fit in there too. 

I've have had all 3 and I would put them from strongest to weakest as follows:

1. Sure Lock
2. Idol
3. Phaze II
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lefty50

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2018, 10:33:22 AM »
This is where I believe I keep having trouble with ball selection... For us strokers, higher Rg and/or lower diff balls like the Trick don't compute as stronger than a Phaze II, even if a stronger cover, because diff makes the ball go 'round.

avabob

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2018, 12:17:48 PM »
Phase ll is kind of a unique ball for me.  I dont really think in terms of handling oil, but more in terms of how a ball transitions coming off the oil.  Phase is very heavy rolling, with great continuation, but it is more useable on short to medium length patterns.  On long patterns it stands up too quick to let me square up, but of course wont let me open up the pattern.  Hyroad Nano or Marvel Pearl are better options for me on long patterns. 

LookingForALeftyWall

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #8 on: May 18, 2018, 01:49:36 PM »
This is where I believe I keep having trouble with ball selection... For us strokers, higher Rg and/or lower diff balls like the Trick don't compute as stronger than a Phaze II, even if a stronger cover, because diff makes the ball go 'round.


Let's talk about the Trick and my new found love of such a boring ball motion...

I've been struggling a bit lately.  My home center either has developed bad topography out by the gutter on the lanes we use for league or the machine has decided to throw a heavier coating out there.  So when you throw it out to the gutter the ball hangs a little bit.  Hit the spot a little bit inside of that and the ball hits friction early takes off for the beak.  Miss further inside and the ball can skid for days.  Enter the Trick. 

The Trick does not overreact in the dry and it also chews through the oil inside of the dry.  By moving in 3-5 boards with the Trick and staying away from the gutter hang I've come out with games of 257-258-247-279 all within the last 2 weeks.  The Trick is a super smooth ball that won't give you much in back but it will get you to the hole.  It ain't sexy but it's got teeth. 

lefty50

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2018, 01:53:43 PM »
Good to know, and intriguing, but humor me.... What's your rev rate?

LookingForALeftyWall

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2018, 03:03:16 PM »
Rev rate is around 300 and I throw the ball pretty hard.  I would classify myself as being speed dominant and most comfortable playing straighter lines but will open up my angles, change speed, and swing when needed. 

2handedrook12

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2018, 10:16:13 PM »
Phase ll is kind of a unique ball for me.  I dont really think in terms of handling oil, but more in terms of how a ball transitions coming off the oil.  Phase is very heavy rolling, with great continuation, but it is more useable on short to medium length patterns.  On long patterns it stands up too quick to let me square up, but of course wont let me open up the pattern.  Hyroad Nano or Marvel Pearl are better options for me on long patterns.
This is the more knowledgableable apprach to the question. Definitely agree in terms of how the Phaze II reacts. On the other hand, I think the Idol is naturally better on longer patterns than the Phaze II from what I've seen as it likes to dig and shape rather than dig and roll.
League: Pitch Purple, Destiny Magenta
Testing: MVP
Interests: Black Widow, Proof Solid, Idol Pearl

2handedrook12

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2018, 01:32:31 AM »
When I say dig, I'm referring to the midlane read. I did not use hook in my definition. I mention dig and roll referring to when a ball reads the midlane and rolls up (like it sets rather than continues). The Idol keeps going.

I

What does he mean by “hook and dig”

I don’t have any those balls, just the ones in between Idol and Phase II. (Trick)
All the Idol owners tell me its a must have, along with the Motiv Villian. But no one in my area has ever suggested the Phase Ii.

But I do need to get another solid to keep the fire down in the back for scratch league. Last night when my HCF ran out of gas I used my IQ Nano and it was really stable and carried.


I wonder how the Idol handles fast backends,  and the AOSO being 2 parts solid.

I would not suggest the AOSO for fast backends (if you're looking for control like most would). Not that the ball is a jacknife, but it doesn't blend the wet dry very well. The Idol is capable of performing on fast backends for sure. It comes into play when the Trick is too slow downlane and/or when you need a bit more traction than the Trick.
League: Pitch Purple, Destiny Magenta
Testing: MVP
Interests: Black Widow, Proof Solid, Idol Pearl

LuckyLefty

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Re: Oil handling capabilities - Phaze II vs Idol
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2018, 04:10:47 PM »
What a great analysis above by many.

I do not own or see the DD trick around here but have watched video!  I have seen the Daredevil original pearl and have seen a heavy midlane version of the Fast!    Not really a great fit around here as we are still looking for midlane oil on the left, with the lane supplying at 15 feet all the friction one doesn't want to see!  Give me 40 feet of push and 20 feet of hook all day.

So, given the above.  I have seen the Show off....lots of continuation and just a little less grab in the cover than the Idol.  I agree the Idol is one strong cover and looks perfectly suited for the bowler who loves to control his loft from 2 to 10 feet!  Lots of cover and lots of continuation and lots of split potential!  The Show off is just slightly less and a little wait to the breakpoint due to the higher RG than the IDOL.

The Phaze II which looks great around here for our firm speed direct lefties seems to really have a very very readable move at the breakpoint.  Very strong and very rounded close in Reaction to particle like say my great Reaction Roll particle but can move high quickly if pulled as documented above!  Higher diff and stronger non particle coverstocks seem to do that today. 

But in general the Phaze II will develop less angle to the pocket than the Idol(most), No Rules Exist, Showoff which are about tied.  The Phaze II really looks like a quite qreat wet Dry ball where you really have wet in the middle and extreme harsh on the oil borders.  That's why I purchased it.  It's core makes a very smooth rounded move initially.  The angle in general is less than the above mentioned balls except when pulled.

I see this ball on TV just as all others do reminding one of an almost what one thought a  Marvel Solid would have looked in his hands back when he was winning it seemed every week with the Marvel.   Yet I never did see him use the Marvel S!

In general get a Phaze II if you want less attack angle in the balls discussed, The Showoff if you want a lot of smoothness and attack angle on a little shorter wet dry shot than you would intend for the Phaze II.  DD Trick I don't know wish I did.  The Idol, if you need lots of attack angle and must play inside.  If you can control your loft to delay rollout of this ball, you will rule.

I don't see most lefties using the Idol well, but I do see them being quite satistfied with the Phaze II, Showoff, and maybe the DD trick(wish I knew more about this one!)

The No Rules Exist has seemed to be a hit for lots of people around here, I'm not sure of its durability, cause it seems to come look great and then disappear out of the bag for many!  I am not sure why.

Regards,

Luckylefty

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

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