BallReviews
Equipment Boards => Storm => Topic started by: htotheizzo3561 on May 02, 2014, 02:42:36 PM
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http://www.buddiesproshop.com/p-4976-storm-optimus-bowling-ball-wwrd-7114.aspx
just got email from buddies
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Optimus: Master line R2X pearl, Tri-Sphereâ„¢ Core
https://www.stormbowling.com/products/balls/optimus
Hy Road Solid: Thunder line R2S solid, Inverted Fe² core
https://www.stormbowling.com/products/balls/hyroadsolid
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Looks like I better start working some OT... ::)
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Crazy looking core in the Optimus... Can't wait for these two to be released.
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HyRoad solid will dominate on the tour
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The Optimus is too 'Merica looking...I wish it was just red and blue...but that's just me being a little girl about things. IT'S gonna look like a "cool noize" blah...
Who am I kidding...
I'm going it get it anyways cuz I wanna try the core!
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I beleive Optimus Prime (Transformers) was red, white, and blue. I wonder if that motivated them to make the "Optimus" red, white, and blue...
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Yeah colors are getting harder with all the rocks out there.
Optimus is very intriguing and the HS well should be like butter..
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Optimus specs are nearly identical to the (I assume outgoing)Marvel Pearl and even has the same coverstock. I will be very interested to see how the new tri-sphere core differentiates from the Centripetal's ball motion.
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Optimus specs are nearly identical to the (I assume outgoing)Marvel Pearl and even has the same coverstock. I will be very interested to see how the new tri-sphere core differentiates from the Centripetal's ball motion.
+1
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It rolls like the Byte. Storm needs to do something other than just change core shapes (which is really just marketing in the first place).
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It rolls like the Byte. Storm needs to do something other than just change core shapes (which is really just marketing in the first place).
How do you know?
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The new movie is coming out, so it makes sense.
I beleive Optimus Prime (Transformers) was red, white, and blue. I wonder if that motivated them to make the "Optimus" red, white, and blue...
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Whether you like it or not, they are in the business of selling balls, which they obviously do quite well.
There stuff clearly rolls well across multiple styles and surfaces, so if you don't like what they are doing, just don't buy/sell their stuff. You will still be in the minority.
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Lol I'm not saying it doesn't work, Storm is arguably the best company out there right now. I'm just saying that the R2- coverstock has been around for a long time. The Hyroad name is pretty played out. A lot of their releases are getting really repetitive. Now it's new stuff that acts like the old stuff, and the old stuff is really good, so that's why people aren't complaining much, but I've had several people comment recently that they keep releasing the same type of stuff. Yeah it's getting that way across the board in bowling, I don't think ball technology really has anywhere else to go, but when you keep a ball like the Hyroad in production for as long as they have, that sends a couple messages. Number one it says that if a 5 year old ball is better than anything else they've been putting out, where is technology really going? It's a simple ball with a simple core, why pay more money for anything else? The Hyroad will also work on the majority of conditions the majority of bowlers see.
Storm definitely has the corner on the market, I just worry that they're milking the same cow too long . .
Whether you like it or not, they are in the business of selling balls, which they obviously do quite well.
There stuff clearly rolls well across multiple styles and surfaces, so if you don't like what they are doing, just don't buy/sell their stuff. You will still be in the minority.
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Cores matter, I didn't mean to sound like it doesn't matter what size or shape core they put in the ball. I meant that core names and their aesthetics are marketing. Does DV8 really get any performance benefit out of the face on their Nightmare core? No. Marketing. Does this new core have to be shaped exactly like that to get the reaction they're after? No, but it looks cooler. Does a ball smelling like something increase performance? No, but it's cool. Do they really need to keep making wildly different cores? No. The lightbulb core still works just fine. Does making it look like a gear change anything? No.
In other words, they could have gotten exactly the same reaction out of the core with a more boring look or name. But is that interesting? No. Just gets hype about something that doesn't matter that much.
It rolls like the Byte. Storm needs to do something other than just change core shapes (which is really just marketing in the first place).
How do you know?
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That's a fair point about cores, Gizmo. I have a feeling that Storm wanted to keep the same foundational elements of the Marvel Pearl (R2X pearl cover, lower RG core), but were looking for a touch later break. I think they did that by moving some of the really inner weight to those three little sphere thingies in this new core.
That ball might be dizzying to watch roll down the lane, though.
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I see the point gizmo is making. However I feel that the other manufacturers change drastically because their product doesn't sell and they need to attract new customers.
No branding, no recognition..
I'd rather buy something so good that they refine it, and not trash it for the next 1 season release...
Some companies gotta change to improve, like motiv. When they first came out, they were cool looking balls that suck, now they are cooler looking balls that second to none.
C300 is trying to keep that resurgence core alive...
Hammer with the widow.
If it ain't broke don't fix it. I'll drill the next NRG cover with any core and know what I'm getting. I'll do the same with a cell core, fe2 hy-road core, etc.
How many pros are freaking out cut there are not any more VR solids?
How many relieved that the hy-road solid is coming?
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I definitely agree . . but the manufacturers have been banking on consumer ignorance for so long that I think it's going to catch up with them. Everything used to be new and better, now it's just old and recycled. Again, Storm is putting out great stuff, and balls do wear out over time, but the manufacturers have been convincing people that the new stuff is revolutionary and an advance in technology . .
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Here is the reason the manufacturers keep bringing out the same stuff. There has been no real break through in core or surface technology for years. They all kept pushing the envelope on aggressive shells and ever stronger asymmetrics ( neither represent any real technological change ) to the point that much of the high price end stuff is less useable than the mid price equipment with less exotic cores, especially on tournament patterns.
Marvel Pearl was by far the best of the Marvel series because it was a great core shell matchup. It was one of those shiny pearls that you could still get a great reaction staying behind the ball and putting it into a roll.
The original resin enhanced shell was a huge breakthrough because it brought a total different type of friction to the shell. With prior shells it was only possible to increase friction in the dry by making the shell more abrasive ( scuffing ). The problem with this approach was that it also increased friction in the oil, which made it more difficult to get the ball to the dry, and caused energy to burn off too early unless the bowler had mega revs. Resin increased the friction coefficient in the dry without increasing it significantly in the oil. Thus you could get a great reaction off the dry without such an abrasive shell that caused energy to burn off early. Nothing really new under the sun since resin.
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Found a teaser video of the Storm Optimus.
http://www.bowlingvids.com/mobile/watch.php?vid=a2fa1fd72
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I definitely agree . . but the manufacturers have been banking on consumer ignorance for so long that I think it's going to catch up with them. Everything used to be new and better, now it's just old and recycled. Again, Storm is putting out great stuff, and balls do wear out over time, but the manufacturers have been convincing people that the new stuff is revolutionary and an advance in technology . .
I feel Storm sales are so good because unless the ball is a complete dud, they keep it in the line at least a full season. Too much stuff on the closeout list that was released after the beginning of the season, 900 Global/AMF included. Discontinued both the Network and Darkness, and have basically cleared out their entire product line. AMF wasn't keeping a lot in their current line up as is, but 2 months for a ball? If I was a shop owner, I'd be a little salty.
But then again, now I can get a Darkness for another great price. :)
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Doom, maybe everything is getting cleaned out because new stuff in conjunction with utah is on the way?
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I'm not one to say anything until someone official says something.
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I think everybody pretty well knows something is going to happen . . but details haven't been put out there yet.
I'm not one to say anything until someone official says something.
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You guys are over thinking the whole Darkness thing. How many distributors and pro shops do you think supported this ball when it was introduced directly to consumers for $99 at it's introduction. They made a batch of balls, blew them out and are moving on.
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Yes. As far as being a shop owner, the only companies we carry stock for is Brunswick, Storm, Hammer, Motiv, and DV8. Other stuff just doesn't sell. I'm sure it's different in other parts of the country, but I just don't think smaller brand stuff sells off shelves anymore. We'll have occasional orders for other stuff, but as far as stocking it? Don't know how many times we've gotten something in like a Hyper Cell or an Eruption Pro and had it just sit on the wall for an eternity before we have to discount it and either take a loss or break even.
You guys are over thinking the whole Darkness thing. How many distributors and pro shops do you think supported this ball when it was introduced directly to consumers for $99 at it's introduction. They made a batch of balls, blew them out and are moving on.
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I don't think ball technology really has anywhere else to go, but when you keep a ball like the Hyroad in production for as long as they have, that sends a couple messages.
The reason the Hyroad has been in the line for as long as it has, is because it keeps selling so well. Same with the Marvel pearl. If it didn't sell, it would get discontinued.
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I think everybody pretty well knows something is going to happen . . but details haven't been put out there yet.
I'm not one to say anything until someone official says something.
Again, I've heard things, but I am not one to spread rumours. I have my own ideas about the whole thing as well.
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And why does it sell so well? Because it's a good ball. But it's over 5 years old now, and is still outperforming "new and improved" equipment. I'm surprised more people don't see that. A 5+ year old ball is better than most of what they're releasing now, but they never stop and think about exactly what that means.
I don't think ball technology really has anywhere else to go, but when you keep a ball like the Hyroad in production for as long as they have, that sends a couple messages.
The reason the Hyroad has been in the line for as long as it has, is because it keeps selling so well. Same with the Marvel pearl. If it didn't sell, it would get discontinued.
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I think I needed a little clarification on what angle you are trying to spin here. Because here, you are saying that a 5 year old ball out performs the new stuff, and I get the impression that you think that is a bad thing, because the industry isn't being innovative enough:
And why does it sell so well? Because it's a good ball. But it's over 5 years old now, and is still outperforming "new and improved" equipment. I'm surprised more people don't see that. A 5+ year old ball is better than most of what they're releasing now, but they never stop and think about exactly what that means.
But here you are saying that changing things just to change is a bad thing, and a light bulb core is just as good as the "gear core" that Motiv uses, so why change for change sake? I'm surmising that you are saying that it is just a marketing ploy:
Cores matter, I didn't mean to sound like it doesn't matter what size or shape core they put in the ball. I meant that core names and their aesthetics are marketing. Does DV8 really get any performance benefit out of the face on their Nightmare core? No. Marketing. Does this new core have to be shaped exactly like that to get the reaction they're after? No, but it looks cooler. Does a ball smelling like something increase performance? No, but it's cool. Do they really need to keep making wildly different cores? No. The lightbulb core still works just fine. Does making it look like a gear change anything? No.
In other words, they could have gotten exactly the same reaction out of the core with a more boring look or name. But is that interesting? No. Just gets hype about something that doesn't matter that much.
Are you saying that they should be more innovative with their creations so that the consumer feels like they are getting their money's worth (as pertaining to the first post);
or are you saying they should stop making new equipment because they aren't being innovative enough as pertaining to the second post)?
The bottom line is, the industry tries to give the consumer what they ask for. Look at how many threads start on here by people wanting to know what is "next", sometimes only days after a ball has just been released. It is a consumer driven market. The same reason that Storm has now released three different versions of the Natural, and now the Pitch Black, all with variations of urethane covers on them. Industry sees a need for it. Plus, you can't over look ALL the many variables that exist with lane conditions and lane surfaces, and oils.
Just look at cover stocks. You put the R2S pearl on the Victory Road, and it is very popular. As soon as you put the R2X pearl on it (the Fire Road), it doesn't do so well. Same core, different cover. You combine that with the evolution of lane oils (I happen to think that the Fire Road rolls like the Victory Road when used on Ice oil, compared to the Victory Road being used on something less slick like Navigate or Fire). But, throw Fire oil on HPL and watch the Fire Road slow down too early and not corner strong enough, hence a bad ball motion to most.
But to be fair, the R2S Hybrid has done well on almost every ball that it was used on. That cover just is really good for most patterns in the medium range. You put a little surface on it for speed dominate players, and it doesn't slow down too much, and polish it for rev dominate, and it doesn't over squirt. For me personally, I preferred the Crossroad over the Hyroad.
I really think the consumer base, and I don't necessarily mean the majority, I just mean the most vocal which is who buys the most product, seems to want change, and keep looking for the new cover, or new core that is the next best thing, and that is why so many releases. That is just today's society. Look at cell phones. Is the Galaxy S5 that much better than the S4? The consumer doesn't care, they just want the next thing, so Samsung makes it, and places it in the market.
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Exactly to everything. They're selling things because of customer demand, but I'm not sure the customer knows why they want the new stuff, or the manufacturers have them wanting new stuff because of smoke and mirrors. Everybody getting so excited about this "new" core in the Optimus. I'm not, because I don't think it's going to be much different than anything else. 5 year old Storm stuff is better than most of what everyone else has been putting out, but it's also better than a lot of the new stuff THEY'RE putting out.
Why are people convinced new is better? What makes them excited about a Vibe XR? I just think it's people's ignorance being taken advantage of, but I'm sure they're perfectly happy being ignorant, just like Cypher in the Matrix, they really don't want to have a clue what's going on. The manufacturers are making money, so they're not going to argue.
What I'm saying is that I don't think they can be more innovative, bowling ball technology really has nowhere else to go. But in order to keep the smoke and mirrors up, they need to change things up. People want newer and better, or they at least want to think it's newer and better. Putting some R2- cover on almost everything for the better part of the last decade is wearing thin.
I'm a fan of not retiring a ball if it works, if it's not broke, don't fix it. But the manufacturers have people deceived into thinking that they're still creating "new" equipment to some extent. I'm personally a big fan of being honest and up front, but I guess if people know the truth, I don't know how many people keep getting so excited about the next new thing. Maybe they don't care, but personally it insults my intelligence to be told something is "new" just to have it react like everything else that's been coming out for the last several years. Just admit that nothing is new and that you're playing Mr. Potato Head and keep putting out good equipment. But at the same time, that isn't very good marketing . .
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"New" balls are introduced because in a ball's life cycle sales are basically cut in half every month it is on the market. There are a few exceptions, Hyroad, Virtual Gravity, V2, Gold Messenger off the top of my head, but for the most part it's in half every month. Most people buy a ball a year at most, so they need to see new balls when they go into the pro shop.
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Balls wear out. There are physical reasons why we are reaching limits in what can be accomplished with shells and cores. Therefore new balls with different colors but existing best technology are the option.
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Exactly, and I think plenty of people see that, or they should. I just don't like the marketing spin of the "all new" features of the ball that are supposed to have some huge impact on performance and then really don't because it's all theoretical. I have to shoot down this kind of thinking every day, and I really don't like doing it. There was some kid getting super excited and jealous about another kid here in town who has a Beast Mode. Super rare, only 400 made, it's "special," blah blah. You take your Beast Mode, and I'll still beat you with any ball I have, including 10 year old balls on my rack in the basement . . Everybody is in business to make money, but when you start working angles and telling half truths to do it, I don't like that. Let's cram a bunch of vitamins into some Fruity Pebbles and try to convince people it's healthy too. I could stick a bunch in a dog turd too and tell you it's healthy. People get hyped about something, then they want to go buy it whether they need it or not, and then they get pissed when it doesn't work out. But I guess hype works better than education.
Balls wear out. There are physical reasons why we are reaching limits in what can be accomplished with shells and cores. Therefore new balls with different colors but existing best technology are the option.
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Exactly, and I think plenty of people see that, or they should. I just don't like the marketing spin of the "all new" features of the ball that are supposed to have some huge impact on performance and then really don't because it's all theoretical. I have to shoot down this kind of thinking every day, and I really don't like doing it. There was some kid getting super excited and jealous about another kid here in town who has a Beast Mode. Super rare, only 400 made, it's "special," blah blah. You take your Beast Mode, and I'll still beat you with any ball I have, including 10 year old balls on my rack in the basement . . Everybody is in business to make money, but when you start working angles and telling half truths to do it, I don't like that. Let's cram a bunch of vitamins into some Fruity Pebbles and try to convince people it's healthy too. I could stick a bunch in a dog turd too and tell you it's healthy. People get hyped about something, then they want to go buy it whether they need it or not, and then they get pissed when it doesn't work out. But I guess hype works better than education.
Balls wear out. There are physical reasons why we are reaching limits in what can be accomplished with shells and cores. Therefore new balls with different colors but existing best technology are the option.
Calm down, America was built on Capitalism and will continue to be. This line of thinking that you detest keeps you and me employed.
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I guess I just think it can be done both ways. I continue to drill new balls realizing full well the whole story, but honestly stuff wears out, and it's fun to drill new stuff. I'm not drilling new equipment because I think I need it to give me an edge or because it's the "latest and greatest."
Exactly, and I think plenty of people see that, or they should. I just don't like the marketing spin of the "all new" features of the ball that are supposed to have some huge impact on performance and then really don't because it's all theoretical. I have to shoot down this kind of thinking every day, and I really don't like doing it. There was some kid getting super excited and jealous about another kid here in town who has a Beast Mode. Super rare, only 400 made, it's "special," blah blah. You take your Beast Mode, and I'll still beat you with any ball I have, including 10 year old balls on my rack in the basement . . Everybody is in business to make money, but when you start working angles and telling half truths to do it, I don't like that. Let's cram a bunch of vitamins into some Fruity Pebbles and try to convince people it's healthy too. I could stick a bunch in a dog turd too and tell you it's healthy. People get hyped about something, then they want to go buy it whether they need it or not, and then they get pissed when it doesn't work out. But I guess hype works better than education.
Balls wear out. There are physical reasons why we are reaching limits in what can be accomplished with shells and cores. Therefore new balls with different colors but existing best technology are the option.
Calm down, America was built on Capitalism and will continue to be. This line of thinking that you detest keeps you and me employed.
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I've been watching this thread but that's a good point on the Uproar. In my house I've seen probably close to 30 people with one now
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Yeah, if we see one ball all over the Summer-Swing telecasts, we will know what the next hot buy will be!
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Yeah, if we see one ball all over the Summer-Swing telecasts, we will know what the next hot buy will be!
Bingo! ;)
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If it's because people see a reaction they need or want, that's great! Buying a ball because you saw it in action is a much better reason than because a poster showed you a "new" core . .
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People like new. Take Radical for instance. Are those finger scoop cores really that much better than Storm's light bulb? I really can't say, but its new and intriguing. The persona that if its new, it must be better isn't a bad one. That "new" core could very well yield a different roll, that could very well match up better for you than me. But I would never say that it was a bad ball for me. I just never capitalized on the assets the ball possesed. It really does seem to other pksters and myself that you are talking negative about Storm because of the Optimus, yet it is ok for Motiv to rerelease an 3 year old core on the Octane? Tracks Hx05 is the 505a and kinetic pearl. Same ball released 3 times over 7 Years? Nobody cared. Motiv takes the Fusion cover last summer and puts it on the Primal Rage, amd now it is on the Tribal, Sting, Cruel Intent, and whatever else. Nobody is complaining. Why? Because we as an industry give the customer what they want. They like a certain roll and companies capitalize on what they want. So the red ball cover went onto balls from every line up. Same as storm putting the R2_ on every line up. Its a roll that people like. So if they have to redsign a core and put similar numbers on it, then so be it. Its new and will roll just as good as the last piece that sold really well. Win win for operators and clients.
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I think we're both on the same page, just don't realize it. I like that they aren't changing what isn't broken, I like that the Hyroad has been around this long, I just think it's a double edged sword. When marketing has been pushing new new new for years now, but they've been using old old old, eventually you come to a marketing "crossroad" (pun intended). I'm not a fan of sensational marketing, it's misleading, and contributes to misinformation and misunderstanding. It's confusing, and it makes education difficult. A lot of core design is marketing. Now as far as I know, Storm hasn't done anything wild or over the top promoting the Optimus, it seems very appropriate. But people have already been pre-programmed to go over the moon anytime something is "new." I'm interested to see what the new core does differently, but I'm not expecting anything revolutionary. A small difference in the shape of the ball motion can be a big thing, and from the video posted by Bowlers Deals, it reminds me of the Byte, but the shape IS slightly different. I just hate seeing people get over excited and then ultimately disappointed because it isn't the huge difference they were expecting, at the end of the day it's still just a bowling ball. And it would be a shame for people to be disappointed, because it looks like a REALLY good ball.
It's really nothing against Storm, I like what they're doing right now, but people are going nuts over this core. It's cool, I like the concept, but I was just using that as an example of the type of consumer that sensationalist marketing has created. I'm excited myself, but within reason, paying attention to what's going on. I'm a huge Motiv fan, obviously, and Fusion is great, I like seeing it on stuff. If they changed absolutely nothing about what they're doing, that would be awesome, Storm too. I'd still eat up everything that comes out, but I'd have the right perspective on what's going on.
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It looks like there's several posts debating the merits of re-releasing and not much change. Storm still has a very high percentage of market share and when you find a formula that works and there continues to be demand, you just keep supplying. Now that balls like the Hy Road and Turbine cored balls are not in the top lines, it's even easier to keep them around. They sell themselves with no marketing.
Now, the new piece is the Optimus. Looks like Storm has attempted to replace the Marvel Centripetal core with something "new" that has the same shape. Here, I think they succeeded. If you give the people something that feels new but still recognizable and it still works, well seems like an easy way to success.
We've just posted videos of both balls. Tested on a heavier THS and Scorpion.
http://tamerbowling.com/index.php/new-storm-equipment-optimus-hy-road-solid/
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People like new. Take Radical for instance. Are those finger scoop cores really that much better than Storm's light bulb? I really can't say, but its new and intriguing. The persona that if its new, it must be better isn't a bad one. That "new" core could very well yield a different roll, that could very well match up better for you than me. But I would never say that it was a bad ball for me. I just never capitalized on the assets the ball possesed. It really does seem to other pksters and myself that you are talking negative about Storm because of the Optimus, yet it is ok for Motiv to rerelease an 3 year old core on the Octane? Tracks Hx05 is the 505a and kinetic pearl. Same ball released 3 times over 7 Years? Nobody cared. Motiv takes the Fusion cover last summer and puts it on the Primal Rage, amd now it is on the Tribal, Sting, Cruel Intent, and whatever else. Nobody is complaining. Why? Because we as an industry give the customer what they want. They like a certain roll and companies capitalize on what they want. So the red ball cover went onto balls from every line up. Same as storm putting the R2_ on every line up. Its a roll that people like. So if they have to redsign a core and put similar numbers on it, then so be it. Its new and will roll just as good as the last piece that sold really well. Win win for operators and clients.
Yeah, I don't see the same fervor when talking about Motiv releases.
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I can't say that I've really seen over the top marketing from Motiv either, and Fusion hasn't even been around for a year, R2-something has been around for the better part of the last decade. Again, if it's not broke, don't fix it, I like that Storm is making good equipment, not dumping old stuff that works just because they feel like they have to come up with something new to keep the marketing charade up. I was a HUGE fan of the Monsoon coverstock they had about 10 years ago, but it didn't stick around very long and I was pretty pissed about it. I'm not specifically picking on Storm, and if somebody would have gotten super crazy about a new feature of a Motiv ball, I'd have probably said something there instead.
I AM a little surprised that Storm has stuck with certain things for so long, it flies in the face of conventional marketing and I'm curious to see how that's going to work out.
People like new. Take Radical for instance. Are those finger scoop cores really that much better than Storm's light bulb? I really can't say, but its new and intriguing. The persona that if its new, it must be better isn't a bad one. That "new" core could very well yield a different roll, that could very well match up better for you than me. But I would never say that it was a bad ball for me. I just never capitalized on the assets the ball possesed. It really does seem to other pksters and myself that you are talking negative about Storm because of the Optimus, yet it is ok for Motiv to rerelease an 3 year old core on the Octane? Tracks Hx05 is the 505a and kinetic pearl. Same ball released 3 times over 7 Years? Nobody cared. Motiv takes the Fusion cover last summer and puts it on the Primal Rage, amd now it is on the Tribal, Sting, Cruel Intent, and whatever else. Nobody is complaining. Why? Because we as an industry give the customer what they want. They like a certain roll and companies capitalize on what they want. So the red ball cover went onto balls from every line up. Same as storm putting the R2_ on every line up. Its a roll that people like. So if they have to redsign a core and put similar numbers on it, then so be it. Its new and will roll just as good as the last piece that sold really well. Win win for operators and clients.
Yeah, I don't see the same fervor when talking about Motiv releases.
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But people have already been pre-programmed to go over the moon anytime something is "new." I'm interested to see what the new core does differently, but I'm not expecting anything revolutionary. A small difference in the shape of the ball motion can be a big thing, and from the video posted by Bowlers Deals, it reminds me of the Byte, but the shape IS slightly different. I just hate seeing people get over excited and then ultimately disappointed because it isn't the huge difference they were expecting, at the end of the day it's still just a bowling ball. And it would be a shame for people to be disappointed, because it looks like a REALLY good ball.
It's really nothing against Storm, I like what they're doing right now, but people are going nuts over this core. It's cool, I like the concept, but I was just using that as an example of the type of consumer that sensationalist marketing has created. I'm excited myself, but within reason, paying attention to what's going on. I'm a huge Motiv fan, obviously, and Fusion is great, I like seeing it on stuff. If they changed absolutely nothing about what they're doing, that would be awesome, Storm too. I'd still eat up everything that comes out, but I'd have the right perspective on what's going on.
A big part of the issue that you are discussing is, that house conditions are designed to hide the subtle differences in say an Optimus compared to the Marvel Pearl(two balls with similar core numbers and the same cover). When you get these balls on tour, and on more competitive patterns, then the variation is greatly enhanced, and each bowler will find the benefit of one or the other over each other. House conditions don't necessarily allow the true ingenuity to shine through. if they did, a guy who only bowls once a week and never practices wouldn't be able to average 220+.
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Oh definitely. Problem is that they're marketing the products to a consumer base 95% comprised of average bowlers on a house shot. I've used this example many times to explain to people why their Cyclone really doesn't outhook their Hyper Cell no matter what it looks like on a house shot . . good point.
But people have already been pre-programmed to go over the moon anytime something is "new." I'm interested to see what the new core does differently, but I'm not expecting anything revolutionary. A small difference in the shape of the ball motion can be a big thing, and from the video posted by Bowlers Deals, it reminds me of the Byte, but the shape IS slightly different. I just hate seeing people get over excited and then ultimately disappointed because it isn't the huge difference they were expecting, at the end of the day it's still just a bowling ball. And it would be a shame for people to be disappointed, because it looks like a REALLY good ball.
It's really nothing against Storm, I like what they're doing right now, but people are going nuts over this core. It's cool, I like the concept, but I was just using that as an example of the type of consumer that sensationalist marketing has created. I'm excited myself, but within reason, paying attention to what's going on. I'm a huge Motiv fan, obviously, and Fusion is great, I like seeing it on stuff. If they changed absolutely nothing about what they're doing, that would be awesome, Storm too. I'd still eat up everything that comes out, but I'd have the right perspective on what's going on.
A big part of the issue that you are discussing is, that house conditions are designed to hide the subtle differences in say an Optimus compared to the Marvel Pearl(two balls with similar core numbers and the same cover). When you get these balls on tour, and on more competitive patterns, then the variation is greatly enhanced, and each bowler will find the benefit of one or the other over each other. House conditions don't necessarily allow the true ingenuity to shine through. if they did, a guy who only bowls once a week and never practices wouldn't be able to average 220+.
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Good point Gizmo. The guys in the Friday night beer league want to hook the ball, and a large proportion of the newest greatest hook monsters give them what they want on a house shot.
The highest tech, asymmetrical solids don't match up at all for tour guys, or even some of us old timers who want to roll the ball and keep it on the lane without throwing 20mph. Good example is that every manufacturer is making mid priced symmetrical balls that get gobbled up by the top tier players on flatter conditions.
Marvel Pearl is as strong a pearl as I want. Way better on tough conditions than a Nano Pearl. IQ tour solid is better than Sync for me on tougher conditions. Tour Fusion is a great ball because the low differential makes it much more controllable. You can go to Brunswick and see the same thing. Versa max was better than Nexxxus Pearl for a lot of guys.
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No matter what storm uses in their cores, I think their covers is what makes them so good... You could put a damn mo rich core inside one of the good r2 covers and it would probably be pretty good too! Storm just seems to have the best formulas in the bowling world. On a positive note, I also feel all their products can outlast many of the other manufacturers by almost double.
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The older storm shells didn't hold up very well either. Actually at one time only Brunswick shells ( particularly PK 18 and Activator ) seemed to have really long lives. Storm has really improved their shells in terms of longevity.
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Agreed ^^. I remember some of the Fire and Bolt series balls dying out... This was back when we're starting to learn about this. For the longest time, PK18 was the standard for longevity. I guess it's a balance between performance (surface, oil absorption, etc.) and longevity. Urethane would seemingly last forever!
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i really cant figure out why other manufacturers dont reverse engineer the coverstocks on storm balls because that is where they are lagging behind.
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Actually the Activator coverstocks were pretty high performance too. The difference with Brunswick back then is that their core shell matchups were much more conducive to end over end roll than to hooking the lane coast to coast. I made thousands of dollars with Brunswick equipment on flatter patterns in major tournaments while averaging 230 in league with my Storm balls.
agree about the bolts. Green Bolt was the best pearl I ever threw out of the box. when it died I tried everything to revive it with no luck. Also, the El Nino shell didn't hold up very long either. X Factor, and another burgundy pearl that escapes me died quickly for me too.