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Author Topic: Open Championships Average  (Read 6709 times)

Strapper_Squared

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Open Championships Average
« on: May 02, 2018, 02:19:30 PM »
Browsing through my USBC online profile and noticed the Open Championships tab.  It lists your scratch average for the last 27 games at the Open tournament. 

My question is why is this average not used to categorize at the tournament?

I bowl league on a stupid easy house shot where anywhere right of the 3rd arrow finds the pocket.  It may not carry, but it makes it there.  I then travel to the Open Championships and bowl on a condition where I need tohave the right equipment with the right surface, be able to very precisely repeat shots, and shoot spare that quite honestly I rarely see otherwise.  Im just not good enough (or practiced enough) to do this.  My average delta between league and the OC tournament is massive.

Seems like your open average (or even your OC sport adjusted - which appears to be OC average plus about 30 pins), would be a better reflection of a bowlers true potential on the OC conditions in that environment.

Under the current rules, I have zero percent chance of competing.  I fall into the "participant" category.

S^2
« Last Edit: May 02, 2018, 02:22:36 PM by Strapper_Squared »
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Strapper_Squared

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #31 on: May 04, 2018, 09:31:32 PM »
Alright USBC.  You claim to solicit input from the bowling community.  Here's a strong recommendation on how to improve the OC from a representative majority of typical league bowlers...
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Pinbuster

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2018, 06:04:02 AM »
I really wish they would go back to 2 divisions and maybe raise classified to 190.

What is purpose of the tournament?

It was originally to crown a national scratch champion The booster teams were added so the locals low average teams could bowl and in their own division but in doubles and singles they were in with the big boys.

Later as the tournament became more about making money they opened the classified division. I never liked that the awarded eagles to the classified division.

The tournament shouldn't be about bowlers making having a chance to make money. It should be about the title

If you are going to have multiple divisions then once a tournament average is established I don't have a problem using that average. I do think maybe it should be a 27 game minimum with say a 45 game maximum so that having one decent year (say 1825) doesn't put you in the top bracket for the next 3 or 4 tournaments.

That said I have never had a chance at an eagle and 35 years later I know I don't now.

rdw

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2018, 01:34:03 PM »
Thatís a great idea.  Did you see the last couple of postings on the Facebook site?  A couple of standard bowlers shot low 1800ís, which no one is going to say is impossible considering you are 209.

But those guys are gonna be in the regular division for the next three years cause that 1800 inflates their ave.  Having a so many game max ave doesnít penalize them from having one moment of glory.  Now if they have two in five years, sure bump them up.

I agree, having 30,60,10 distribution is more indicative of what a usbc league truly is, but itís never gonna fly for political reasons when the winner of standard, and I wouldnít have a problem if he or she didnít receive and Eagle, gets a check for $5000, but the best bowler and eagle winner only gets $2000 because of different prize funds.

You could do maybe 30, 25,25, 20.  Where the bulk of the house hacks battle it out in their respective divisions.  Then the top 20 percent battle it out for the prestigious eagle.

I have no doubt only the top 10 if not 5 percent of bowlers have any realistic chance of doing well in that division, but usually the 11-20 percent, while very good bowlers, also have egos big enough to think they can do well.  Good for them, with them in the mix it balances out the prize fund enough, you know the usbc will top weight the prizes so that the regular champ gets just as much, if not more than the other division winners.  They already stated that for 2017.

And they already have the data.  Every tournament you can look up your participation history and get your lifetime average.

By the time this place, you could even state minimum 27 game ave from 2013 onwards. ( next year they are using from 2010).  Iím suggesting 2013 cause it was the first year I think they had fresh oil for all squads? 

Wouldnít take much work to run a program that breaks out divisions by those parameters and calculate tournament ave with rolling 45 game ave.

While Riggs et al stated that they and others like them would bowl in a parking lot for free just for a chance to win a an eagle.  The truth is the usbc needs as much participation as possible for a revenue source.

You have to create an atmosphere so everyone thinks they have a chance to get something out of the tournament.  Itís no longer an excuse to consider the tournament a pseudo vacation since the site is the same rotation, with a west coast bias.

avabob

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #34 on: May 09, 2018, 04:36:49 PM »
Nothing really new here.  Bowled my first nationals in 1975.  Bowled my 28th in Vegas last year.  90%of participants have always been donators and they have always known it.  They bowled because it was a chance to participate in something special, and there was always a slim chance they might grab a check.

BeerLeague

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #35 on: May 10, 2018, 07:55:43 AM »
It's a losing battle ....

The OC is tough and it should be .... but the VAST majority of bowlers never see anything other than soft house conditions.  It's a donation fest for the majority of participants and will never change unless the OC conditions get softer or league shots get harder.  PERIOD.

The USBC sanctions leagues (which means they take your money and do nothing except send out tin 300 rings), then holds a national tournament that is supposed to cater to those league bowlers ...... but it doesn't at all.  Maybe the new weight hole rule will fix it all  :o

Good Times Good Times

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #36 on: May 10, 2018, 09:10:14 AM »
It's a donation fest for the majority of participants and will never change unless the OC conditions get softer or league shots get harder.  PERIOD.

Even then, the best will still win.  They just will.

The USBC sanctions leagues (which means they take your money and do nothing except send out tin 300 rings)

Bonding of league funds....
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Olderdude

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #37 on: May 10, 2018, 09:33:42 AM »
Just got back from the OC and I bowled one of my best sets.  Bowled a sport league this year for the first time in like 5 years.  I believe there is a correlation there.  I average 225+ on a THS and have a OC average of 195.  I know I probably will never win (always think I could pop and shoot a decent 700) but I enjoy the competition and will continue to go.

I think these changes for the most part a good thing and while the division cutoffs aren't perfect they're a start.  I like that we are no longer converting a sport average to a THS average and then bowling on a sport condition.  That one made no sense.  I thinks the championship average will also help with sandbagging.  My son has an OC average of 153 so I know what a 155 bowler looks like and a lot of the old classified division bowlers were better than the classified division.

avabob

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #38 on: July 12, 2018, 05:42:23 PM »
Extra division gives a lot more people a chance to cash.  However it also hurts the prize fund significantly.  There have always been as many as 500 guys who werent PBA, Team USA or mega buck champs, that are going to be at the top of the prize lists at nationals. 

mrwizerd

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #39 on: July 12, 2018, 05:47:08 PM »
There have always been as many as 500 guys who werent PBA, Team USA or mega buck champs, that are going to be at the top of the prize lists at nationals. 

Those type of bowlers are called professional amateurs.

avabob

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Re: Open Championships Average
« Reply #40 on: July 12, 2018, 06:11:04 PM »
Probably so, but my point is there are a lot of them.  When I was bowling the masters about 18 years ago they use to get as many as 700 entries.  A lot of donators there, just at a higher level.