BallReviews

Equipment Boards => Visionary => Topic started by: BowlingForDonuts on November 21, 2018, 01:24:46 PM

Title: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on November 21, 2018, 01:24:46 PM
Now that Visionary is no more (semi official I guess) I wanted to make a thread where people can post about their experiences with different Visionary pieces without having to go do a formal review.  Really have fallen in love with their stuff and sad to see them go but their stuff lasts forever and will be viable for many years to come so don't mind turning new people to Visionary or talking with old Visionary die hards.  Been trying to keep my post count down with this account but its been pretty dead on here lately and now I have a bit of a Visionary arsenal don't mind talking about what I see from their balls on modern lanes with modern oil (only corporate synthetics in my area for most part).
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on November 21, 2018, 01:25:13 PM
I finally got to throw a 16lb Classic today and already love it.  I found out the dry house I usually take my urethane was open early today due to holidays so since I polished the crap out of it I figured it might be viable (usually don't take reactives there).  It was a little strong still for the conditions (light shakers were leaving occasional 5 7s) but was very impressed with how predictable it was and how it can handle even dry lanes.  It really is the ultimate benchmark in Visionary's line imo.  Don't know it just reminds me of my Marvel Pearl how it just oozes confidence and reads the lane so well (but doesn't over read either) even polished (slightly less backend though).  May post more notes later as I throw it more if bored but already I think its my favorite 16lb reactive (usually prefer 15lb but when stuff is discontinued have to take what you can get).
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: MI 2 AZ on November 22, 2018, 12:35:45 AM
The Classic was/is a good control ball that I believe was made for a travelling league.  See link:  http://www.tcba1.com/html/home.htm

I don't know what lane conditions they bowled on but The Classic was a good medium ball that took surface changes well.

Balls that I liked as benchmark balls were the old Blue Warlock and the Blue Sparkle Gryphon.  When I first joined the Visionary Test Staff program, I wanted to buy multiple balls of the same type and put different layouts on them so I could figure out what would be best for me.  I bought three of the Blue Warlocks and to save money, two of them were blems. 

What I found out was that the two blems were the ones I liked best.  I think it was because of the phasing that they hooked more than the non-blem one.  I don't remember the layouts now other than one of the blems was a 2 inch Pin to PAP layout that I later re-plugged to something like a 4 inch Pin to PAP layout.

I still use one of the Blue Warlocks on a semi-regular basis whenever I am working on an issue because I know what the reaction of that ball should look like if I release it correctly. 

 
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: dizzyfugu on November 22, 2018, 05:05:52 AM
I had (and partly still have) three Visionary balls.

One of them was/is a Slate Blue Gargoyle, which is a very good ball for really dry conditions - the relatively mild core gets it into a good roll, it has much more hitting power than typical pancake urethane balls. At its time it was a unique offering, and it had proven to be very durable - I still habe the ball at its OOB glossy finish, and it still looks as good as new (even though it has not seen much use, since it is limited to very specific lane conditions).

Then there was a Red/Blue Gryphon as a medium condition ball - but this one never truly convinced me, and it eventually cracked.

The last one, which is also still there and in use, is a Frankie May Gryphon which I took from the matt OOB finish to 2.000 grit for medium conditions, and this one turned out to be a strong and controllable all-round piece. Also very durabale.

Sad that they are gone, there always were interesting pieces among the ball range.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on November 22, 2018, 09:11:46 AM
+1 on the Blue Warlock.  Have one as well but stupid seller said #15 and I stored it for awhile before checking weight only to find it was like #13.5.  At least I have a good ball when I get older or if I get hurt and need to drop down in weight.  Still a bummer.  Oh well have my Warlock XV at least.

Also +1 on FMG.  Only thrown it a few times but was probably going to throw it next week and maybe do a short blurb on it.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: Juggernaut on November 22, 2018, 09:13:30 AM
 At one point, Visionary was the only thing in the bag for me. Used to love the old Faballs, and once I found out the Wonders family running Visionary were the ones behind Faball, I jumped on board with both feet.

 I’ve had:

1. Green Gargoyle— 3 of them. Great skid/flip pearls.
2. Granite Gargoyle—2 of them. Not hyper aggressive, but great oilers with great control.
3. Blue Gryphon— Benchmark, all the way.
4. Burgundy Gryphon— Smooth, and deceptively strong on oil.
5. Blue/Green Centaur— My favorite. Had 3 of these, and still have one! :)
6. Immortal Pearl— WAY too much ball for me. Flared all the way around the ball!
7. Charcoal Executioner— 2 of these. Polish it up and voila, medium/heavy house shot killer.
8. “Pumpkin” Ogre Solid— A lot more ball than people thought. Good house shot oiler.
9. DC Warlock Tour—Could’ve been really good, but drilled it wrong and sold it. :(
10. New Breed PP.—This one got me headed away from Visionary. With no forewarning, this got drilled wrong, and just never worked.
11. Red Sorceror—Urethane baby! Didn’t hit like one though, had a very “Faballish” feeling to it. Wonder why?

 Always wanted to try a pearl Gryphon, pearl Ogre, Scorcher NPT, and Ogre urethane, but just never got around to it.

 Sad to see them go. They seemed to be real good people, and made some real good products.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on November 22, 2018, 09:16:34 AM
Ogre urethane is my favorite ball as that is my spare ball when it counts.  Beautiful as well imo with that hard urethane.  Some one is selling a #13 NIB on ebay right now and can't recommend that ball enough at least for spares, as long as its not polished almost never chops spares even with my straighter style - https://www.ebay.com/itm/13-lb-Visionary-Ogre-Urethane-bowling-ball-VBP-NOS-NIB-Rare-ball/223235951192?hash=item33f9e64a58:g:VaUAAOSwsupb8M0I:rk:1:pf:0

(edit:  by the way +1 to Juggs for an awesome synopsis.  Can't beat experience)
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: hd12b on November 23, 2018, 08:37:53 AM
Saddest day of my life. I have thrown Visionary since 1997  Orange Warlock and too many others to mention. Very sorry to see the Brand die. The Wonders are the greatest people to work with, and provided some of the best equipment.

Visionary forever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on November 26, 2018, 01:22:22 PM
Busted out the Frankie May today.  Been working on reducing my axis tilt by keeping my hand cupped under the ball as long as possible so that factors in but man the FMG is a strong ball.  Made me stand further left than used to.  For an old solid has a nice pop at the backend too.  Since mostly a THS warrior (only do fund raiser tournaments which are usually no tap) think I may polish it to make it more useful on conditions I see.  With some surface though this ball is a great first out of bag on the fresh for all but a flood.  Like I said these older pieces will be usable on modern conditions for years to come.  Must have been crazy strong when it came out.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: don coyote on November 26, 2018, 02:43:20 PM
Now I have some difficult decisions to make.

Do I drill my Granite,Violet and Green Gargoyles? What about my Ogre SS?

Suggestions for my NIB Blue/Green Centaur?

Hmmm......
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on November 26, 2018, 06:35:00 PM
Now I have some difficult decisions to make.

Do I drill my Granite,Violet and Green Gargoyles? What about my Ogre SS?

Suggestions for my NIB Blue/Green Centaur?

Hmmm......

Go strong as hell unless you are strongly rev dominant or want to save it for bowling on a desert.   That core is very mild.  I wouldn't drill the Granite unless you are bowling on flooded sports shots.  Ogre SS or Green for sure for house shot.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: scotts33 on November 26, 2018, 06:44:38 PM
Now I have some difficult decisions to make.

Do I drill my Granite,Violet and Green Gargoyles? What about my Ogre SS?

Suggestions for my NIB Blue/Green Centaur?

Hmmm......

Put down your bowling stats. to get better ideas on layouts.  Lane condition, RH or LH, preferred trajectory, ball speed off hand, revs, axis tilt, axis rotation, PAP and anything else that might help.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on December 04, 2018, 01:26:35 PM
Been quiet lately so wanted to post little blurb on BG Centaur since giving it another chance.  That ball is really starting to grow on me.  Super predictable ball and great for playing a slight belly.  Granted only have in 16lb but carries corner pins excellent for how low a diff it has.  Can put a fair amount of surface on it without worrying about burning up.  Great ball.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: don coyote on December 04, 2018, 01:42:37 PM
B/G Centaur is MONEY on wood lanes!!! I do not bowl on wood lanes very often-tournaments only-but it has made me a ton in brackets. Every time I see wood lanes I usually double the amount of bracket money I put in. Just so controllable and carries everything!!!
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on January 02, 2019, 01:58:39 PM
A few more quick random notes.  Raven Invasion is a great ball for house shot.  Doesn't give me as much miss room as some of my other pearls but it is probably the most predictable and changes the shot very little over a session.  Much better imo than the Gryphon Special Edition on THS but to be fair GSE made for sport shot.  Finally took a gold scotch brite to my Granite Gargoyle and local Bowlero was flooded with oil and ball was awesome.  Got a little worried about reaction when ball started collecting oil on coverstock like a urethane and the reaction did tame down some but carry was still outstanding.  Midnight Scorcher is a great ball I am sure but Granite Gargoyle gives the traction I need on conditions I see and still has some backend.  Sweet ball all and all.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on February 23, 2019, 02:59:56 PM
Took me awhile and it wasn't cheap but wow was the Green Gargoyle worth it.  An absolute house shot killer.  It carries like my Hy-Road but gives me even more miss room.  Absolutely amazing how it always seems to trip the ten on pocket hits as well as collapse all the pins when go through the nose.  Best Visionary ball for house shot imo.  Even Jason W. said so.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: JamminJD on February 23, 2019, 03:02:22 PM
Took me awhile and it wasn't cheap but wow was the Green Gargoyle worth it.  An absolute house shot killer.  It carries like my Hy-Road but gives me even more miss room.  Absolutely amazing how it always seems to trip the ten as well as collapse all the pins when go through the nose.  Best Visionary ball for house shot imo.  Even Jason W. said so.

Greenie is a great ball. I had my first one stolen at a tournament. My second one I gave to a JR bowler that needed it more than me. Have not been able to find one in 14..
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on February 23, 2019, 03:31:24 PM
Took me awhile and it wasn't cheap but wow was the Green Gargoyle worth it.  An absolute house shot killer.  It carries like my Hy-Road but gives me even more miss room.  Absolutely amazing how it always seems to trip the ten as well as collapse all the pins when go through the nose.  Best Visionary ball for house shot imo.  Even Jason W. said so.

Greenie is a great ball. I had my first one stolen at a tournament. My second one I gave to a JR bowler that needed it more than me. Have not been able to find one in 14..

Yeah they are not easy to find in any weight (if see a 14# will keep you mind).  People hoard them for sure for good reason.  One of the big boys should buy the secret sauce.  Re-brand it perhaps and sell a bazillion balls.  Pretty funny how it was the value price in Visionary's line ($80 new are you kidding me?, pay more than that for single drill even in 16 now).  Don't think they knew what they had.  Ball is special imo.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: sneaky PETE on February 23, 2019, 10:08:27 PM
i saw they only made gladiator balls for overseas. i also saw on the approved list they had 3 other scorchers which i can't find anywhere.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: MI 2 AZ on February 24, 2019, 01:19:55 AM
i saw they only made gladiator balls for overseas. i also saw on the approved list they had 3 other scorchers which i can't find anywhere.

They sold three Gladiators in the states.
https://www.visionarybowling.com/balls/discontinued

Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: sneaky PETE on February 24, 2019, 07:05:55 AM
They sold three Gladiators in the states.
https://www.visionarybowling.com/balls/discontinued
i saw them i was saying they didn't make any other balls for overseas.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: MI 2 AZ on February 25, 2019, 01:14:41 AM
They sold three Gladiators in the states.
https://www.visionarybowling.com/balls/discontinued
i saw them i was saying they didn't make any other balls for overseas.

Ahh, okay.  I mis-read what you posted.

Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: michael.willis9 on February 25, 2019, 08:29:40 AM
i saw they only made gladiator balls for overseas. i also saw on the approved list they had 3 other scorchers which i can't find anywhere.

They sold three Gladiators in the states.
https://www.visionarybowling.com/balls/discontinued

just looked through that, i miss my old sorcerer urethane.  i'd kill to have that ball back
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: JamminJD on February 25, 2019, 09:05:43 AM
Took me awhile and it wasn't cheap but wow was the Green Gargoyle worth it.  An absolute house shot killer.  It carries like my Hy-Road but gives me even more miss room.  Absolutely amazing how it always seems to trip the ten as well as collapse all the pins when go through the nose.  Best Visionary ball for house shot imo.  Even Jason W. said so.

Greenie is a great ball. I had my first one stolen at a tournament. My second one I gave to a JR bowler that needed it more than me. Have not been able to find one in 14..

Yeah they are not easy to find in any weight (if see a 14# will keep you mind).  People hoard them for sure for good reason.  One of the big boys should buy the secret sauce.  Re-brand it perhaps and sell a bazillion balls.  Pretty funny how it was the value price in Visionary's line ($80 new are you kidding me?, pay more than that for single drill even in 16 now).  Don't think they knew what they had.  Ball is special imo.

Yep very cheap, I won a ton of money with Greenie. Well and the Ogre's as well. They was low diff before it was cool!
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on March 05, 2019, 01:16:31 PM
TL;DR version Gryphon Special Edition kind of sucks on THS imo (ball has a radar for the head pin and only the head pin).  Raven Invasion gives me a much better look even with very similar numbers on conditions I see.  GSE with surface on flatter heavier oil probably really shines.  Ball is meant for better bowler than I guessing.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: MI 2 AZ on March 05, 2019, 02:31:32 PM
TL;DR version Gryphon Special Edition kind of sucks on THS imo (ball has a radar for the head pin and only the head pin).  Raven Invasion gives me a much better look even with very similar numbers on conditions I see.  GSE with surface on flatter heavier oil probably really shines.  Ball is meant for better bowler than I guessing.


I thought that was the intent of the Gryphon Special Edition - sport patterns. 

Just checked at Visionary website and here it is:

https://www.visionarybowling.com/ball/gryphon-special-edition

Note the last sentence:
"Designed for tougher patterns like those found at Nationals, this ball handles sport conditions very well for a pearlized reactive."


When I bowled sport leagues, I found certain balls that worked well for some of those patterns but not for my THS leagues and vice-versa of course.  YMMV.

Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on March 05, 2019, 03:12:06 PM
TL;DR version Gryphon Special Edition kind of sucks on THS imo (ball has a radar for the head pin and only the head pin).  Raven Invasion gives me a much better look even with very similar numbers on conditions I see.  GSE with surface on flatter heavier oil probably really shines.  Ball is meant for better bowler than I guessing.


I thought that was the intent of the Gryphon Special Edition - sport patterns. 

Just checked at Visionary website and here it is:

https://www.visionarybowling.com/ball/gryphon-special-edition

Note the last sentence:
"Designed for tougher patterns like those found at Nationals, this ball handles sport conditions very well for a pearlized reactive."


When I bowled sport leagues, I found certain balls that worked well for some of those patterns but not for my THS leagues and vice-versa of course.  YMMV.

Yeah was just more a caution for anyone thinking about it using it for house shot.  It is not as versatile as say a Marvel Pearl (another big sport shot pearl) or most other Visionary pearls.  I think it probably needs more oil than just about any other Visionary pearl (minus the particles and perhaps Centaur pearl).  It is pretty strong even OOB.  Guess will try it in the higher volume house before I pass judgment.  Hasn't wowed me like almost all the other Visionary pearls have (Visionary's strong point imo) but I guess the solution is git gud and bowl sport patterns but even then would probably prefer the Raven.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: JamminJD on March 05, 2019, 10:57:06 PM
TL;DR version Gryphon Special Edition kind of sucks on THS imo (ball has a radar for the head pin and only the head pin).  Raven Invasion gives me a much better look even with very similar numbers on conditions I see.  GSE with surface on flatter heavier oil probably really shines.  Ball is meant for better bowler than I guessing.


I thought that was the intent of the Gryphon Special Edition - sport patterns. 

Just checked at Visionary website and here it is:

https://www.visionarybowling.com/ball/gryphon-special-edition

Note the last sentence:
"Designed for tougher patterns like those found at Nationals, this ball handles sport conditions very well for a pearlized reactive."


When I bowled sport leagues, I found certain balls that worked well for some of those patterns but not for my THS leagues and vice-versa of course.  YMMV.

Yeah was just more a caution for anyone thinking about it using it for house shot.  It is not as versatile as say a Marvel Pearl (another big sport shot pearl) or most other Visionary pearls.  I think it probably needs more oil than just about any other Visionary pearl (minus the particles and perhaps Centaur pearl).  It is pretty strong even OOB.  Guess will try it in the higher volume house before I pass judgment.  Hasn't wowed me like almost all the other Visionary pearls have (Visionary's strong point imo) but I guess the solution is git gud and bowl sport patterns but even then would probably prefer the Raven.

Yes for sure, GSE is not a good house shot ball, shines on tougher patterns. I have used it a lot on 38-42' sport patterns and scored really well..
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on March 06, 2019, 10:49:11 AM
TL;DR version Gryphon Special Edition kind of sucks on THS imo (ball has a radar for the head pin and only the head pin).  Raven Invasion gives me a much better look even with very similar numbers on conditions I see.  GSE with surface on flatter heavier oil probably really shines.  Ball is meant for better bowler than I guessing.


I thought that was the intent of the Gryphon Special Edition - sport patterns. 

Just checked at Visionary website and here it is:

https://www.visionarybowling.com/ball/gryphon-special-edition

Note the last sentence:
"Designed for tougher patterns like those found at Nationals, this ball handles sport conditions very well for a pearlized reactive."


When I bowled sport leagues, I found certain balls that worked well for some of those patterns but not for my THS leagues and vice-versa of course.  YMMV.

Yeah was just more a caution for anyone thinking about it using it for house shot.  It is not as versatile as say a Marvel Pearl (another big sport shot pearl) or most other Visionary pearls.  I think it probably needs more oil than just about any other Visionary pearl (minus the particles and perhaps Centaur pearl).  It is pretty strong even OOB.  Guess will try it in the higher volume house before I pass judgment.  Hasn't wowed me like almost all the other Visionary pearls have (Visionary's strong point imo) but I guess the solution is git gud and bowl sport patterns but even then would probably prefer the Raven.

Yes for sure, GSE is not a good house shot ball, shines on tougher patterns. I have used it a lot on 38-42' sport patterns and scored really well..

Sweet.  Long story short git gud and you will like the ball lol.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: JamminJD on March 07, 2019, 09:01:09 AM
TL;DR version Gryphon Special Edition kind of sucks on THS imo (ball has a radar for the head pin and only the head pin).  Raven Invasion gives me a much better look even with very similar numbers on conditions I see.  GSE with surface on flatter heavier oil probably really shines.  Ball is meant for better bowler than I guessing.


I thought that was the intent of the Gryphon Special Edition - sport patterns. 

Just checked at Visionary website and here it is:

https://www.visionarybowling.com/ball/gryphon-special-edition

Note the last sentence:
"Designed for tougher patterns like those found at Nationals, this ball handles sport conditions very well for a pearlized reactive."


When I bowled sport leagues, I found certain balls that worked well for some of those patterns but not for my THS leagues and vice-versa of course.  YMMV.

Yeah was just more a caution for anyone thinking about it using it for house shot.  It is not as versatile as say a Marvel Pearl (another big sport shot pearl) or most other Visionary pearls.  I think it probably needs more oil than just about any other Visionary pearl (minus the particles and perhaps Centaur pearl).  It is pretty strong even OOB.  Guess will try it in the higher volume house before I pass judgment.  Hasn't wowed me like almost all the other Visionary pearls have (Visionary's strong point imo) but I guess the solution is git gud and bowl sport patterns but even then would probably prefer the Raven.

Yes for sure, GSE is not a good house shot ball, shines on tougher patterns. I have used it a lot on 38-42' sport patterns and scored really well..

Sweet.  Long story short git gud and you will like the ball lol.
Exactly! lol
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on March 22, 2019, 06:08:17 PM
Finally got around to punching up the NIB Gladiator SE Pearl I picked up for the dry house I am bowling in.  Decided to go with a nearly 6" pin to pap, pin up drilling.  All I can say is wow is this ball mild for a reactive and perfect for short oil and burn.  I bowled like hammered dog shit today (mental game not there) but ball was trying its darnest to help me.  Unlike my Avalanche Pearl this ball has no surprises on the back end.  Overall its even a little weaker than my Purple Hammer but much later and a bit more off the spot (though not a whole lot to be honest).  I think it might even be weaker than my Scout but I drilled it with maximum side weight (also 16 vs 15) so not apples to apples.  Great ball to use when can't use many other reactives.  A true dry lane control ball reactive.

Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: gsback on June 10, 2019, 06:07:46 AM
The Classic was/is a good control ball that I believe was made for a travelling league.  See link:  http://www.tcba1.com/html/home.htm

I don't know what lane conditions they bowled on but The Classic was a good medium ball that took surface changes well.

Balls that I liked as benchmark balls were the old Blue Warlock and the Blue Sparkle Gryphon.  When I first joined the Visionary Test Staff program, I wanted to buy multiple balls of the same type and put different layouts on them so I could figure out what would be best for me.  I bought three of the Blue Warlocks and to save money, two of them were blems. 

What I found out was that the two blems were the ones I liked best.  I think it was because of the phasing that they hooked more than the non-blem one.  I don't remember the layouts now other than one of the blems was a 2 inch Pin to PAP layout that I later re-plugged to something like a 4 inch Pin to PAP layout.

I still use one of the Blue Warlocks on a semi-regular basis whenever I am working on an issue because I know what the reaction of that ball should look like if I release it correctly. 

 
If I remember correctly, the Classic was made specifically for the TCBA Members.  I don't think it was made for the lane conditions though.  I'd have to ask Jason. 

Conditions for the league were not like a typical house shot, though it did vary from lane to lane.  I bowled in the league probably 10 years or so ago and was where I met Jason as Visionary sponsored the league.

We bowled 2 3 game sets on the lanes.  So the conditions were usually very oil as there was no re-oil between sets.  Some alleys had issues by the 2nd set and some didn't.  Lots of fun though, will say that!
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: BowlingForDonuts on June 10, 2019, 09:45:55 AM
My Classic had some piss poor plug work done in the past and then developed a few small cracks. Have in pro shop now to try and save. Its 16# but being Visionary’s arguably best benchmark decided to keep and save. Neat ball.
Title: Re: Informal Visionary ball reviews and notes
Post by: MI 2 AZ on June 10, 2019, 01:28:59 PM
The Classic was/is a good control ball that I believe was made for a travelling league.  See link:  http://www.tcba1.com/html/home.htm

I don't know what lane conditions they bowled on but The Classic was a good medium ball that took surface changes well.

Balls that I liked as benchmark balls were the old Blue Warlock and the Blue Sparkle Gryphon.  When I first joined the Visionary Test Staff program, I wanted to buy multiple balls of the same type and put different layouts on them so I could figure out what would be best for me.  I bought three of the Blue Warlocks and to save money, two of them were blems. 

What I found out was that the two blems were the ones I liked best.  I think it was because of the phasing that they hooked more than the non-blem one.  I don't remember the layouts now other than one of the blems was a 2 inch Pin to PAP layout that I later re-plugged to something like a 4 inch Pin to PAP layout.

I still use one of the Blue Warlocks on a semi-regular basis whenever I am working on an issue because I know what the reaction of that ball should look like if I release it correctly. 

 
If I remember correctly, the Classic was made specifically for the TCBA Members.  I don't think it was made for the lane conditions though.  I'd have to ask Jason. 

Conditions for the league were not like a typical house shot, though it did vary from lane to lane.  I bowled in the league probably 10 years or so ago and was where I met Jason as Visionary sponsored the league.

We bowled 2 3 game sets on the lanes.  So the conditions were usually very oil as there was no re-oil between sets.  Some alleys had issues by the 2nd set and some didn't.  Lots of fun though, will say that!

I thought The Classic was made for sale to members of that league only at first, then it later became available for others.  If you do talk to Jason, ask him to verify that.

Vary from lane to lane or house to house?  If they were using different oil patterns on each lane, that would be a tough league and I wish I had lived close enough to bowl in one like that.