Author Topic: Pin Question (Read 5949 times)

bigdawgwill44 · « **on:** February 28, 2008, 02:49:21 PM »

I'm ordering two balls online tomorrow and want to know what pin size i should go with. I'm ordering a BW Bite and a BW Pearl. I want these balls to flare so im thinking either a 2-3 inch pin? That sound reasonable?

bluerrpilot · « **Reply #16 on:** February 29, 2008, 05:55:57 PM »

quote:
so a longer pin will be more angular?

Here is 2 different Dooms both have the same pin to pap distance and the same pin to cg distance.(3") The cross marks the grip center. You can see how far the pin is from those centers. The farther from that center, the more angular off the spot.

http://members.cox.net/bluerrpilot/doom.JPG
http://members.cox.net/bluerrpilot/doom2.JPG
--------------------
Team HammerHead
2008 USBC Nationals
ABQ, NM

"USBC is concerned that technology has overtaken player skill in determining success in the sport of bowling"

Edited on 2/29/2008 6:56 PM

bigdawgwill44 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 29, 2008, 05:57:26 PM »

i know what a pin is... i know where it is located.. i own many bowling balls. I have one pin under, one pin to the right, etc... i only want to know why people put them under and why people put them over.. you are oversimplifying my lack of understanding. please tell me what a pin over will do reaction wise, and what a pin under will do reaction wise.....

chitown · « **Reply #18 on:** February 29, 2008, 06:13:16 PM »

quote:
i know what a pin is... i know where it is located.. i own many bowling balls. I have one pin under, one pin to the right, etc... i only want to know why people put them under and why people put them over.. you are oversimplifying my lack of understanding. please tell me what a pin over will do reaction wise, and what a pin under will do reaction wise.....

Pin above the fingers creates more length and is more angular off the spot.

Pin below the fingers creates an earlier roll and is smoother off the spot.

If you look at the pics bluerrpilot showed of his DOOMS, the pin above the ring finger should get a tad bit more length and have a more angular back end.

bigdawgwill44 · « **Reply #19 on:** February 29, 2008, 06:33:21 PM »

what would you suggest for the bite and the pearl? Pin above? My Raw Anger is Pin Below right now.

chitown · « **Reply #20 on:** February 29, 2008, 07:00:57 PM »

quote:
what would you suggest for the bite and the pearl? Pin above? My Raw Anger is Pin Below right now.

How do you like the Anger's reaction?

There's many different ways to build an arsenal. Every bowler has there own way of doing things based on their ball roll and ball track. So it's tough to give you advice on how to layout your new bowling balls.

A safe philosophy is to use the same pin location on all your equipment and just let the different cover and cores separate the reactions. Or you could use the other philosophy of drilling each ball different. It's really up to you.

I only use pin up layouts on every ball in my arsenal. I used to keep the same pin location on every single ball in my arsenal. I would only change the CG location and add or not add a balance hole. I basically just let the cover and cores separate the reactions between the different balls. However, my philosophy has changed a small amount. I still only use pin up layouts but have a PIN location window of 4" to 5.5" from my pap. I just keep the PIN above the finger to pap line and keep within that window. I also have learned to keep the MB close to my thumb on asymmetrical equipment.

Hope this helps.

jodyk24 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 29, 2008, 07:42:38 PM »

bigwagdwill44..

What chitown is telling you is correct. I am glad he spoke up because I did not want to get into a hornet's nest with anybody. I had a Black Widow Pearl drilled for my wife several months ago with the pin between and above the fingers. With slower ball speed this gives good length and good pop on the backend for her. With higher ball speed I would still keep the pin above the fingers. Her ball had a 2-3 inch pin before drill. I like a 3" pin to make sure I am above the fingers if needed and easy for the driller also. The Bite is going to hook with the pin above the fingers on a THS beleive me.

jodyk24

[http://members.aol.com/jkw1041/blackwidow.jpg]

bigdawgwill44 · « **Reply #22 on:** February 29, 2008, 09:40:32 PM »

here is a pic of my Anger. Should i drill both the Bite and the Pearl like this?

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h95/bigdawgwill44/0229082028-1.jpg

VIXIV · « **Reply #23 on:** February 29, 2008, 10:07:29 PM »

There's a thread in the Drilling and Layouts board w/ this handy link to the Lane Masters drilling instructions. Here's the quoted link to the instructions.

quote:
Have a look at this:

http://marketing.lanemasters.com/LM_Ball%20Drilling%20Instructions.pdf

If their site didn't have all that flash going on, I'd have searched their site directly. Anyway, it gives a pretty understandable explanation about what type of reactions you'd expect given where the pin is placed on the ball. Hope that helps.

Juggernaut · « **Reply #24 on:** February 29, 2008, 10:14:46 PM »

Stop it, your making my head hurt.

bigdawgwill44,

You asked a question that, in all fairness, SOUNDED simple enough, but somewhere the train of simplicity seems to have jumped the tracks.

Your question was: I want the balls to flare so I'm thinking either a 2-3 pin? That sound reasonable?

The answer is: Yes, that sounds reasonable. But, you have to decide what you are looking to get from the balls for yourself.

You ask a lot of questions about pin above, pin below. Should I this or should I that? Nobody knows for sure exactly what you are looking for, but, given the nature of the balls you listed, if you drilled them exactly like your anger, I think the bite would be almost as early and nearly as strong as the anger ( if not stronger ) and the pearl would be longer, but stronger on the backends ( as long as they were clean ).

As far as the pin out goes, that is just a personal decision. A short pin makes it easier to drill a pin under without getting a lot of thumb weight because with the shorter pin length allows you to put the pin under and still leave the cg on the midline.

A longer pin length is easier to drill a pin above because it allows you to move the pin up without getting excess finger weight. If you use a short pin length to drill a pin above, the cg will be closer to the finger holes and may cause excessive finger weight, depending on the starting topweight of the ball.

It isn't the initial pin length that determines the flare potential, it is the pin to pap length that the drilling allows for. You can make a ball that has a 1 inch pin out, or a 5 inch pin out, flare a ton, if you put it in the right place.

Like a man told me the other day. Drilling is part art, part science, part luck, and part black magic.

Bon Apetite
--------------------
What did you expect, something PROFOUND?

My Bowl.com member page

bigdawgwill44 · « **Reply #25 on:** February 29, 2008, 10:40:30 PM »

thank you jugger that made tons of sense! I would like the Bite to be stronger than the Anger though, should i think about pin above? In regards to the Pearl, will the backend be enough with pin below to play in like i usually do? Thanks again for understanding my incompetence and lack of knowledge when it comes to ball layouts, i will however say i have learned a ton! thank you

Matt Fortney · « **Reply #26 on:** February 29, 2008, 10:45:54 PM »

Based on how your Anger is drilled; I would put the pin above your fingers with the bite...but put it a little closer to you PAP. That will make it stronger, but also a different shape. If you want the Pearl to be less overall, and more of a skid/snap, I would go pin above the bridge of your fingers. It will still flare quite a lot, that's the nature of the BW series, but it will definitely give you more length and more backend than either of the other two. JMO.

Matt
--------------------
Hammer Pride Staff Member

http://www.hammerbowling.com
http://www.hammerstuff.com

"Nothing Hits Like A Hammer"

bigdawgwill44 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 01, 2008, 01:02:31 PM »

Ok, i am going pin above on both the Bite and the Pearl to go along with my Anger, which is pin down. Now the question is, what size of pin to ask for on bowling.com. I think I'm going to say between 3-4 inch. sound reasonable? Does this give my driller enough room?

azguy · « **Reply #28 on:** March 01, 2008, 01:19:15 PM »

Yes, order the ball, have it drilled and Good Luck.
--------------------
az guy aka: R & L Bowlers Pro
rlbowlerspro@cox.net
www.rlbowlerspro.com

fluff33 · « **Reply #29 on:** March 01, 2008, 01:47:09 PM »

AMEN! AMEN! AMEN! Your pro shop guy probably knows your game and can give you the best advice. That's what he is trained to do.

bigdawgwill44 · « **Reply #30 on:** March 01, 2008, 02:12:31 PM »

well unfortunately fellas, my local driller has the Hammer Bite for $267 and the Pearl for $249.. Now, looking online you can see that bowling.com has the Bite for $128 and the Pearl for $124.. Hmm, now lets see the total i would spend for both the Bite and the Pearl at my local pro shop would be $516 drilled, not including inserts.. Now if i were to buy online, the cost comes to be $252, not drilled but that is a savings of $264. Now, to get the ball drilled, he charges $30 each, so tack on another $60 to the internet ball total, equaling $312 plus another $20 for inserts, that would be $332..... Compared to $516, a savings of $184. Now, one doesn't have to be a rocket scientist here to realize the driller in my area is way overpriced and i can save tons by ordering online ($184). I live my life by common sense, not to support some jerk that is outrageously priced and to call it principle. Maybe he will start lowering prices to be reasonable when people continuously bring in internet balls for him to drill. Just my opinion i guess..

Author Topic: Pin Question (Read 5949 times)

bigdawgwill44

Pin Question

bluerrpilot

Re: Pin Question

bigdawgwill44

Re: Pin Question

chitown

Re: Pin Question

bigdawgwill44

Re: Pin Question

chitown

Re: Pin Question

jodyk24

Re: Pin Question

bigdawgwill44

Re: Pin Question

VIXIV

Re: Pin Question

Juggernaut

Re: Pin Question

bigdawgwill44

Re: Pin Question

Matt Fortney

Re: Pin Question

bigdawgwill44

Re: Pin Question

azguy

Re: Pin Question

fluff33

Re: Pin Question

bigdawgwill44

Re: Pin Question