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Author Topic: No Mercy woes...  (Read 5791 times)

FrontTwelv

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No Mercy woes...
« on: December 02, 2008, 12:38:27 PM »
my specs...
5 1/8 over, 1/8 up axis; medium to high rev rate, ~16mph ball speed.

drilled this piece with the #3 drilling (medium arc).  the pin is right over ring finger and the hart is just right of thumb hole.  the ball so so straight, straighter than my Big Hit.  the weird thing is, the flairing of the ball doesn't migrate left with each ring, it bowties around the thumbhole and migrates over the finger holes.  what gives?
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Drew Jordan
Columbus, OH
Ebonite | Brunswick
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six pack

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2008, 06:13:19 PM »
nope no wt.hole needed but yes the pin should have been placed higher by about an inch but thats how that one got laid out.
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The harder I try the harder they fall
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The harder I try the harder they fall

J_w73

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2008, 06:34:59 PM »
quote:
nope no wt.hole needed but yes the pin should have been placed higher by about an inch but thats how that one got laid out.
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The harder I try the harder they fall


I have heard pin up high.. hart in third or 4th ring gives you a super sick hook and backend..

you have the no mercy and beat'n ??

Edited on 12/3/2008 7:37 PM
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375 RPM, 17-18 MPH, 45+ DEG AXIS ROTATION, 17 DEG TILT

six pack

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2008, 06:45:43 PM »
no more hammers at the moment,go for the pin high and hart in the 3-4 ring area and the ball will be a back end monster for sure.
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The harder I try the harder they fall
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The harder I try the harder they fall

BubbaRay

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #19 on: December 04, 2008, 04:33:07 AM »
quote:
quote:
nope no wt.hole needed but yes the pin should have been placed higher by about an inch but thats how that one got laid out.
--------------------
The harder I try the harder they fall


I have heard pin up high.. hart in third or 4th ring gives you a super sick hook and backend..

you have the no mercy and beat'n ??

Edited on 12/3/2008 7:37 PM


This is true. My NM is drilled, 5 1/2" pin to PAP, Pin 1" from my Val and the hart placed in the 3rd flare of my track, this ball is a monster on the back end.  Pin way above ring finger, Cg left of center grip and hart 3rd flare line. And yes I am right handed.
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Nothing Hit's Like A Hammer
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Disclaimer !!  The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer .

J_w73

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #20 on: December 04, 2008, 09:58:37 AM »
quote:
quote:
quote:
nope no wt.hole needed but yes the pin should have been placed higher by about an inch but thats how that one got laid out.
--------------------
The harder I try the harder they fall


I have heard pin up high.. hart in third or 4th ring gives you a super sick hook and backend..

you have the no mercy and beat'n ??

Edited on 12/3/2008 7:37 PM


This is true. My NM is drilled, 5 1/2" pin to PAP, Pin 1" from my Val and the hart placed in the 3rd flare of my track, this ball is a monster on the back end.  Pin way above ring finger, Cg left of center grip and hart 3rd flare line. And yes I am right handed.
--------------------
Nothing Hit's Like A Hammer
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www.hammerbowling.com
www.hammerstuff.com


yeah.. your the guy I heard it from... HAAH!!
from the Hammer Board

What's up?

I think I asked you this before but forgot..
Do you have to have super revs to get this layout to work..
I'm 350 to 475.. somewhere in there.
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375 RPM, 17-18 MPH, 45+ DEG AXIS ROTATION, 17 DEG TILT

BubbaRay

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #21 on: December 04, 2008, 11:19:33 AM »
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
nope no wt.hole needed but yes the pin should have been placed higher by about an inch but thats how that one got laid out.
--------------------
The harder I try the harder they fall


I have heard pin up high.. hart in third or 4th ring gives you a super sick hook and backend..

you have the no mercy and beat'n ??

Edited on 12/3/2008 7:37 PM




Your rev rate will work just fine becausae mine is around the same

This is true. My NM is drilled, 5 1/2" pin to PAP, Pin 1" from my Val and the hart placed in the 3rd flare of my track, this ball is a monster on the back end.  Pin way above ring finger, Cg left of center grip and hart 3rd flare line. And yes I am right handed.
--------------------
Nothing Hit's Like A Hammer
Hammer Team Member
   Hammer Message Board Moderator
www.hammerbowling.com
www.hammerstuff.com


yeah.. your the guy I heard it from... HAAH!!
from the Hammer Board

What's up?

I think I asked you this before but forgot..
Do you have to have super revs to get this layout to work..
I'm 350 to 475.. somewhere in there.

--------------------
Nothing Hit's Like A Hammer
Hammer Team Member
   Hammer Message Board Moderator
www.hammerbowling.com
www.hammerstuff.com
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Jim Sabatell
DV8 Regional Staff
Disclaimer !!  The opinions expressed are solely those of the writer .

six pack

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2008, 11:22:07 AM »
sorry that this thread got hijacked somewhat but we are talking about drilling up no mercy's so...
I've always wanted to try this 5 1/2" pin to pap layout 1" from val.m.b.3 1/2"-4 1/2"from pap.do I understand correctly that palceing the pin in this matter would delay the flare for the backend and then give you a heavy roll/flip reaction?
--------------------
The harder I try the harder they fall
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J_w73

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2008, 11:27:50 AM »
quote:
sorry that this thread got hijacked somewhat but we are talking about drilling up no mercy's so...
I've always wanted to try this 5 1/2" pin to pap layout 1" from val.m.b.3 1/2"-4 1/2"from pap.do I understand correctly that palceing the pin in this matter would delay the flare for the backend and then give you a heavy roll/flip reaction?
--------------------
The harder I try the harder they fall


I'll let Bubba respond .. but just make sure you are talking about the actual Mass Bias and not the HART
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six pack

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #24 on: December 04, 2008, 11:44:17 AM »
quote:
quote:
sorry that this thread got hijacked somewhat but we are talking about drilling up no mercy's so...
I've always wanted to try this 5 1/2" pin to pap layout 1" from val.m.b.3 1/2"-4 1/2"from pap.do I understand correctly that palceing the pin in this matter would delay the flare for the backend and then give you a heavy roll/flip reaction?
--------------------
The harder I try the harder they fall


I'll let Bubba respond .. but just make sure you are talking about the actual Mass Bias and not the HART


the HART is not the Mass Bias so yes.
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The harder I try the harder they fall
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The harder I try the harder they fall

FrontTwelv

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #25 on: December 06, 2008, 04:31:58 PM »
now from what i can understand, the HART marks the 'negative' MB position correct?
--------------------
Drew Jordan
Columbus, OH
Ebonite | Brunswick
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J_w73

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #26 on: December 07, 2008, 12:02:32 AM »
quote:
now from what i can understand, the HART marks the 'negative' MB position correct?
--------------------
Drew Jordan
Columbus, OH
Ebonite | Brunswick


I am still trying to find out what the mb position means..
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375 RPM, 17-18 MPH, 45+ DEG AXIS ROTATION, 17 DEG TILT

FrontTwelv

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2008, 07:36:32 AM »
the MB basically marks the flip block on the bottom of most balls.  It technically marks the position of the ball with the largest weight difference from the pin.
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Drew Jordan
Columbus, OH
Ebonite | Brunswick
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Gazoo

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2008, 08:45:38 AM »
http://www.morichbowling.com/Determinator/InfoSheet.htm
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"I don't want to be remembered, I want to be forgotten"
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FrontTwelv

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2008, 06:18:56 AM »
thanks gazoo!  this still doesn't really explain why, i guess i'll just scuff it and keep it for a rainy day.
--------------------
Drew Jordan
Columbus, OH
Ebonite | Brunswick
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J_w73

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Re: No Mercy woes...
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2008, 09:37:07 AM »
I've actually been talking to alot of people about it and about what makes a bowling ball do what it does..

the MB mark on the ball is the high rg axis.  When the ball spins about this axis the most weight is to the outside of the ball.  On a determinator that has a constant force applied a ball will spin to this axis...
now the real world...
i have no idea what it does for a bowling ball going down a lane..
cause a balls axis will migrate along a path that is close to or a little bit lower than its initial rg.  A ball without any added force can not move to a higher rg axis.
The ball will not spin to this MB spot.. or PSA prefered spin axis.
check out the bowl.com axis migration study.  They put a mb/psa right in the what would be the path of the axis on a bowling ball.. thinking the ball should spin to this prefered axis since it is going that direction and it is so close.. what happened.. it moved the path of the axis up higher and it went past the PSA and not even through it..
We will agree that the mb/psa placement does do something to the reaction of the ball.. I am just trying to find out what now..
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375 RPM, 17-18 MPH, 45+ DEG AXIS ROTATION, 17 DEG TILT
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