Author Topic: Time to STOP! (Read 10216 times)

JOE FALCO · « **on:** December 17, 2010, 08:51:58 AM »

I read all the postings on EBONITE and how they were going to do something to fix the price on there bowling balls. I thought at the time I can see the argument! But these prices are crazy. Ebonite and Hammer balls going for $155 undrilled is OUT OF BOUNDS! I see where the online shops were cutting the throats of the B/M shops but .. now the companies are SHOVING ridiculous prices down the throat of bowlers.

I think it's about time for BOWLER'S to take a stand and start investigating some of the newer companies. If we accept these prices and don't revolt we might as well give up the game. EBONITE and company has lost me as a customer .. don't care how good there advertised balls appear!

sunsetlefty · « **Reply #76 on:** December 21, 2010, 07:06:49 AM »

golfnutFl,

1.If you think that most pro shops are drilling $500+ balls a year to get to the break even point, think again....

2. Doug makes a very valid point that most pro shops treat their loyal customers (those who made their bowling ball purchase at the pro shop, and not off the internet) receive preferential pricing down the road. They end up spending less, not more....

--------------------
Owner of X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
www.xactreaction.com
Ebonite International Gold Pro Shop
Rotogrip Star Pro Shop
Storm VIP Pro Shop
PBA Member

JOE FALCO · « **Reply #77 on:** December 21, 2010, 07:40:51 AM »

quote:
Just one question and a YES or NO answer will do:

Did the latest action by Ebonite screw the bowler?

If readers can sift through all the added "GREAT INFO" I think they will conclude .. Any bowler that was buying Ebonite balls on-line before the Ebonite change is now CUT OFF from those bargains and is now SCREWED.

It is trying to be justified with B/M SERVICE .. but I don't buy that .. SERVICE is expected when a customer walks in the shop. If I go to the same B/M shop before or after the Ebonite change .. what makes the service any better? As JLS has said many times .. WE'RE SCREWED!

It seems that we have all the B/M shop owners or prior owners speaking out .. that again is a problem .. are all the bowlers that were against higher prices from Lane 1 BENDING OVER for this exercise by Ebonite? Can't you foresee that all the other manufacturers will get in line if Ebonite is successful? We thought Bowling was dying before .. this will sure put a KNIFE to bowling!!!!

sunsetlefty · « **Reply #78 on:** December 21, 2010, 07:56:59 AM »

quote:
quote:
Just one question and a YES or NO answer will do:

Did the latest action by Ebonite screw the bowler?

If readers can sift through all the added "GREAT INFO" I think they will conclude .. Any bowler that was buying Ebonite balls on-line before the Ebonite change is now CUT OFF from those bargains and is now SCREWED.

It is trying to be justified with B/M SERVICE .. but I don''t buy that .. SERVICE is expected when a customer walks in the shop. If I go to the same B/M shop before or after the Ebonite change .. what makes the service any better? As JLS has said many times .. WE''RE SCREWED!

It seems that we have all the B/M shop owners or prior owners speaking out .. that again is a problem .. are all the bowlers that were against higher prices from Lane 1 BENDING OVER for this exercise by Ebonite? Can''t you foresee that all the other manufacturers will get in line if Ebonite is successful? We thought Bowling was dying before .. this will sure put a KNIFE to bowling!!!!

It isn''t ''service'' that Doug was referring to. It is the fact that he gives his repeat customers, those who make ball purchases directly from his pro shop, a break on the normal price......he also stated that he sells the new Mission 2.0 for the same price as the original Mission. He has not passed on a price increase to the customer because he gets the ball for the same price as before. The difference now is that the internet price is the same as his....

For those of you who think that the pro shops should not speak up and defend their businesses, then you are lucky. This is a free country, and you can choose to find another way to drill your internet purchases. I''m not trying to make a funny or arrogant comment about this, so please think about it.

If the local pro shops go out of business because they cannot make a living, what will the average bowler do when he needs the services of a pro shop? This is where the KNIFE will actually fall....
--------------------
Owner of X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
www.xactreaction.com
Ebonite International Gold Pro Shop
Rotogrip Star Pro Shop
Storm VIP Pro Shop
PBA Member

Edited on 12/21/2010 9:57 AM

Steven · « **Reply #79 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:09:44 AM »

quote:
It is trying to be justified with B/M SERVICE .. but I don't buy that .. SERVICE is expected when a customer walks in the shop. If I go to the same B/M shop before or after the Ebonite change .. what makes the service any better?

What's better are the chances for the B/M shop to remain minimally profitable and stay in business for the long run. Without a good network of viable proshops, bowling will eventually revert to glow-bowling with balls drilled by amateur weekend warriors out of their garages, or by K-Mart like box stores employing low wage store clerks.

Joe, maybe you'd be happy in that kind of bowling world, but for those of us who still have respect for bowling as a competitive sport, no thanks.

Contrary to your thoughts on pricing, many of us don't give a hoot about $20-$30 dollars more for a ball. That's the cost of admission for league brackets and side pots on a weekly basis, so who, except for ball collectors, care about a few extra bucks for a ball??

Joe, you're barking up the wrong tree on this one.

slowmo44 · « **Reply #80 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:18:25 AM »

Speaking as a consumer, my prices (so far) have remained the same. I buy online mainly when it is something my Pro Shop doesn't normally stock (Visionary, Seismic, or something overseas/limited release). Because I still have to take them to the Pro Shop to get drilled, he still gets his money. I buy several balls per year, and because of this, I get good prices (preferential) prices. I think he charges 65-75 for drilling with inserts to most people that are not regulars (from what I have heard), where I might pay half that with a ball I bring in. But again, I may only bring in 1 or 2 per year that I bought elsewhere. I guess if the price went up, and I wanted WHATEVER ball it was, I would probably pay it if I wanted or needed it. There is no substitute for a good pro shop (in my humble opinion).

Atochabsh · « **Reply #81 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:26:05 AM »

I still don't see how the bowler is "SCREWED" by a $10 increase on a $145 product. That's about 7% increase. And its only an increase if you happen to buy from one of three locations.

Gas just went up here $.15/gal to $3.19, some places are well over $3.25
A gallon of milk just went up from $3.49 to $3.99
Don't even think about a dozen eggs. You never know how much they are going to be from week to week.
Iams cat food, I used to buy a 20lb bag for $24.00 now its a 14lb bag. When did they shrink the bag? No one knows.

The above items went up in price and they (unlike Ebonite products) will probably go up again in a couple months.

laufaye · « **Reply #82 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:32:20 AM »

People, LET IT GO !!!! Joe doesn't want to pay extra $10 period, how hard for you guys to understand?!?!?! We have so many Joes everyday, they exist, really no point to convince them anymore, especially on the internet forum.

All those JOES out there believes prices can only go down, it can never go up !!!
--------------------
Neil Lau
Brunswick Pro Shop Staff
VISE Staff Member
USBC Bronze Coach
IBPSIA Certified Technician
Owner of Super Bowl Pro Shop and Bowlers Junction, CA

jls · « **Reply #83 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:46:47 AM »

quote:
quote:
It is trying to be justified with B/M SERVICE .. but I don't buy that .. SERVICE is expected when a customer walks in the shop. If I go to the same B/M shop before or after the Ebonite change .. what makes the service any better?

What's better are the chances for the B/M shop to remain minimally profitable and stay in business for the long run. Without a good network of viable proshops, bowling will eventually revert to glow-bowling with balls drilled by amateur weekend warriors out of their garages, or by K-Mart like box stores employing low wage store clerks.

Joe, maybe you'd be happy in that kind of bowling world, but for those of us who still have respect for bowling as a competitive sport, no thanks.

Contrary to your thoughts on pricing, many of us don't give a hoot about $20-$30 dollars more for a ball. That's the cost of admission for league brackets and side pots on a weekly basis, so who, except for ball collectors, care about a few extra bucks for a ball??

Joe, you're barking up the wrong tree on this one.

Triple Amen to this post...AAA+++

Yesterday a "money bowler" was in and told me that in the last two weeks he has won over $1700 with his Mission 2.0 and Reign...

And the $10 that a Ebonite brand might cost him means nothing to him, nothing at "tall"...

Golfnut, you said something like drilling 40-50 balls a year??? IMO, anyone that claims to drill 40-50 balls a year can afford $10...

Because IMO, anyone drilling that many balls a year is not a recreational bowler, but a money bowler...

Now once again, Just about all Ebonite HP balls are selling online for about $149...to a high of $154...

And that is about $10-$15 higher than Storm's HP models...

And the Big B's NEW HIGHEND BALL IS NOW AT $133... <<<< and that is way too high..........>>>> IMO....

Before I would buy that ball at $133, I would wait till it hits it's peak...

$91 with polish, 2 bottles of cleaner and a towel...<<< Oh ya, like I'm way out of line here<<<< Jay Leno

MERRY CHRISTMAS
--------------------
jls

Steven · « **Reply #84 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:54:07 AM »

quote:
People, LET IT GO !!!! Joe doesn't want to pay extra $10 period, how hard for you guys to understand?!?!?! We have so many Joes everyday, they exist, really no point to convince them anymore, especially on the internet forum.

All those JOES out there believes prices can only go down, it can never go up !!!

Neil, but the exercise is fun.

Joe finds the excuse to bring up "keeping cheap ball pricing alive" every couple of months. He posts, gets knocked around, goes away for a bit, and then finds a convenient excuse to bring up the subject again.

These threads aren't for Joe's benefit -- they are for bowlers with open minds who still trying to get a better understanding of the retail bowling landscape. For that reason alone, there is value in continuing though these painful threads.

JOE FALCO · « **Reply #85 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:55:47 AM »

When gas prices went up .. BP/Sunoco/Gulf and all the other service stations went up together .. when EBONITE went up in price .. who else did? When car prices increases I don't think it was one manufacturer it was all of them .. now I remember bowlers talking to how much they were saving (money wise) by purchasing on=line .. $10 is not the amount I recall .. it was closer to $30.

Why all this talk about OTHER THEN Ebonite ball prices? I stand by my comments about bowlers local B/M shops .. why is this increase in price by Ebonite going to help me with service if I go to the same shop I was going before the increase?

If Ebonite is attempting to improve service why don't they put emphasis on training BALL DRILLERS (a Term used by others) on improving their skills? How is increasing the price to bowlers improving drilling capabilities?

The B/M shops claim they make no more money through the ebonite change .. distributors seem to be NOT making more money .. online shops are definitely NOT making more money ..the bowler is paying more .. looks like EBONITE is making more per ball ..

The bowler who was buying through on-line shops is SCREWED! The amount varies .. it seems the minimal is $10 .. I really don't care .. I don't buy too many Ebonite ball to begin with .. why didn't Ebonite increase the price when they were pushing the EVOLVE? .. now that they have the Mission and the TABOO all of a sudden ball price go UP .. funny!

JOE FALCO · « **Reply #86 on:** December 21, 2010, 09:02:21 AM »

Steven .. still making things very personal .. Goodbye one more time!

Steven · « **Reply #87 on:** December 21, 2010, 09:17:24 AM »

quote:
Steven .. still making things very personal .. Goodbye one more time!

And Joe, you still have skin the thickness of cheap plastic wrap...

There is nothing personal. You post from the perspective of collecting balls instead of purchasing equipment to bowl to the best of your ability. A simple fact that you don't have the Cojones to discuss.

And Merry Christmas!! May you find many bowling balls under your Christmas tree, dumped on the market under B/M wholesale pricing, to provide you with holiday cheer.

sunsetlefty · « **Reply #88 on:** December 21, 2010, 09:25:58 AM »

quote:
When gas prices went up .. BP/Sunoco/Gulf and all the other service stations went up together .. when EBONITE went up in price .. who else did? When car prices increases I don''t think it was one manufacturer it was all of them .. now I remember bowlers talking to how much they were saving (money wise) by purchasing on=line .. $10 is not the amount I recall .. it was closer to $30.

1.Some internet retailers offered more savings than others. This was a result of several factors, including their inventory costs, and how much margin they were willing to cut in order to get your business.

Why all this talk about OTHER THEN Ebonite ball prices? I stand by my comments about bowlers local B/M shops .. why is this increase in price by Ebonite going to help me with service if I go to the same shop I was going before the increase?

2.Because the B/M shops and ball prices are directly intertwined. If the B/M shop can''t compete with the online retailer, he will close. Here is a suggestion: go to your local pro shop, where you have been bringing your internet purchases, and tell the owner that you will no longer purchase any bowling equipment from any B/M pro shop including his, and that you will try and persuade your fellow bowlers to do the same. Tell him that you are fed up with the online retailers not receiving a fair shake. Then hand him your internet ball. See what his response is.....but be prepared to duck...

If Ebonite is attempting to improve service why don''t they put emphasis on training BALL DRILLERS (a Term used by others) on improving their skills? How is increasing the price to bowlers improving drilling capabilities?

3.Ebonite and YES, the other ball companies DO try and help to train and educate ''ball drillers''. These companies provide training programs, web seminars, local seminars, demo programs, video training, etc.

The B/M shops claim they make no more money through the ebonite change .. distributors seem to be NOT making more money .. online shops are definitely NOT making more money ..the bowler is paying more .. looks like EBONITE is making more per ball ..

4.The online retailer is simply not making as much profit margin as before. The B/M pro shop did not see much, if any, of an increase in his inventory pricing. And, if the consumer purchases thru his local B/M shop, he will not see an increase either, unless the B/M shop chooses to raise his price!

The bowler who was buying through on-line shops is SCREWED! The amount varies .. it seems the minimal is $10 .. I really don''t care .. I don''t buy too many Ebonite ball to begin with .. why didn''t Ebonite increase the price when they were pushing the EVOLVE? .. now that they have the Mission and the TABOO all of a sudden ball price go UP .. funny!

5.Ebonite announced this online price restructuring months ago, before the release of the Taboo and some of the other H/P balls.

READERS: please support your local pro shops. They are the front line between you and the ball companies. You need them just as much as they need you......

--------------------
Owner of X-act Reaction pro shop at Ideal Lanes
www.xactreaction.com
Ebonite International Gold Pro Shop
Rotogrip Star Pro Shop
Storm VIP Pro Shop
PBA Member

Edited on 12/21/2010 11:31 AM

jls · « **Reply #89 on:** December 21, 2010, 09:26:13 AM »

quote:
When gas prices went up .. BP/Sunoco/Gulf and all the other service stations went up together .. when EBONITE went up in price .. who else did? When car prices increases I don't think it was one manufacturer it was all of them .. now I remember bowlers talking to how much they were saving (money wise) by purchasing on=line .. $10 is not the amount I recall .. it was closer to $30.

Why all this talk about OTHER THEN Ebonite ball prices? I stand by my comments about bowlers local B/M shops .. why is this increase in price by Ebonite going to help me with service if I go to the same shop I was going before the increase?

If Ebonite is attempting to improve service why don't they put emphasis on training BALL DRILLERS (a Term used by others) on improving their skills? How is increasing the price to bowlers improving drilling capabilities?

The B/M shops claim they make no more money through the ebonite change .. distributors seem to be NOT making more money .. online shops are definitely NOT making more money ..the bowler is paying more .. looks like EBONITE is making more per ball ..

The bowler who was buying through on-line shops is SCREWED! The amount varies .. it seems the minimal is $10 .. I really don't care .. I don't buy too many Ebonite ball to begin with .. why didn't Ebonite increase the price when they were pushing the EVOLVE? .. now that they have the Mission and the TABOO all of a sudden ball price go UP .. funny!

JOE, sir, one more time....EBONITE DID NOT RAISE THEIR PRICES TO YOU OR ANYONE.....the prices you are now seeing are based on what the balls have cost the pro shops...

These 3 online dealers all were selling these balls as LOST LEADERS...SELLING THEM FOR BELOW COST....

THEY WERE ABLE TO DO THAT BECAUSE THEY WERE AND ARE GETTING BRUNSWICK CO-OP MONEY... AND THEY USE IT TO OFFSET THEIR COST ON EBONITE BALLS...

EBONITE TOOK STEPS TO STOP THEM FROM DOING THIS...CALLED PROTECTING THEIR BRANDS....

ASK ANY PRO SHOP. OUR PRICES ON EBONITE BALLS HAS NOT GONE UP ONE PENNY...

YES YOU THE CONSUMER MAY NOW BE PAYING $10 more... BUT THE THREE ONLINE DEALERS WERE SELLING EBONITE BALLS AT COST OR BELOW BEFORE... HURTING THOUSANDS OF PRO SHOPS IN AMERICA...

NOW JOE, I'M SORRY YOU MIGHT HAVE TO PAY $10 MORE IF YOU WANTED TO BUY AN EBONITE BRAND...

NOW BRUNSWICK SHOULD BE HAVING THEIR WEEKLY/MONTHLY FIRE SALE ON THEIR LATEST NEW RELEASE, THE WICKED SEIGE...

LOOK FOR IT, BUY IT, AND ENJOY BOWLING WITH IT...

IT'S YOUR MONEY.....

"PENNY WISE AND DOLLAR FOOLISH"

but as always

MERRY CHRISTMAS

--------------------
jls

ccrider · « **Reply #90 on:** December 21, 2010, 09:29:27 AM »

Jls,

What evidence do you have to support your claim that proshops were selling Ebonite balls at a loss and using Brunswick incentives to offset the loss?
--------------------
Those that can do. Those that can't complain. Pimpin ain't easy, but it's mandatory.

Most things we like, we don't need. Most things we need, we don't like. Don't confuse your likes with your needs.

Author Topic: Time to STOP! (Read 10216 times)

JOE FALCO

Time to STOP!

sunsetlefty

Re: Time to STOP!

JOE FALCO

Re: Time to STOP!

sunsetlefty

Re: Time to STOP!

Steven

Re: Time to STOP!

slowmo44

Re: Time to STOP!

Atochabsh

Re: Time to STOP!

laufaye

Re: Time to STOP!

jls

Re: Time to STOP!

Steven

Re: Time to STOP!

JOE FALCO

Re: Time to STOP!

JOE FALCO

Re: Time to STOP!

Steven

Re: Time to STOP!

sunsetlefty

Re: Time to STOP!

jls

Re: Time to STOP!

ccrider

Re: Time to STOP!