BallReviews
Regional Action => NorthEast => Topic started by: crankyanker on November 10, 2016, 07:33:53 AM
-
Think we'll ever see the US Open return here ?
http://www.nj.com/somerset/index.ssf/2016/11/bowlero_north_brunswick_rolling_strikes_is_cool_ag.html#incart_m-rpt-2
-
Think we'll ever see the US Open return here ?
http://www.nj.com/somerset/index.ssf/2016/11/bowlero_north_brunswick_rolling_strikes_is_cool_ag.html#incart_m-rpt-2
Never. Only downstairs, lane 49 - 82 are allowed for league bowlers. Our league was virtually kicked out there this year unless we wanted to merge with another league and start bowling at 10 PM! We found another house, Majestic Lanes, owned by former BPAA president, Tom Martino, and run by his sons, Tom Jr. and Anthony, that supports league bowling, cleans the lanes, the approaches and the settee area, oils regularly and consistently. They constantly put money back into the lanes.
Next time I set foot in Carolier it will be a cold day in hell.
-
"Next time I set foot in Carolier it will be a cold day in hell."
I totally agree ! I've moved to Howell Lanes where Johnny P, Parker & Lesley Bohn are regulars in my Monday night league.
Bowlero - they left out the "z" :P
-
Tom Shannon believes in his business model which he has apparently dedicated 50 of the 82 lanes to and 32 lanes for traditional league bowling which seems to be full if a league needed to bowl at 10:00 pm to bowl there.
If he's successful with his model, I am quite sure he will care less about all the former league bowlers who now state they will never step foot in the place again.
League bowling appears to be in a general state of decline almost everywhere, so the financial future for Bowlmor does not center on the league model. It's a part of it, but not the major part. I think all of us old traditional league bowlers need to come to grips with this reality. I for one am thankful that both our local houses which both did major renovations/upgrade similar to Bowlero support both league and entertainment type bowling and for now it seems to be working for everyone.
-
"Next time I set foot in Carolier it will be a cold day in hell."
I totally agree ! I've moved to Howell Lanes where Johnny P, Parker & Lesley Bohn are regulars in my Monday night league.
Bowlero - they left out the "z" :P
Those are 3 of the nicest, most talented bowlers to set foot on our earth. When God was handing out "nice", "thoughtful" and "consideration for your fellow human", they were at the head of the line
-
Tom Shannon believes in his business model which he has apparently dedicated 50 of the 82 lanes to and 32 lanes for traditional league bowling which seems to be full if a league needed to bowl at 10:00 pm to bowl there.
If he's successful with his model, I am quite sure he will care less about all the former league bowlers who now state they will never step foot in the place again.
League bowling appears to be in a general state of decline almost everywhere, so the financial future for Bowlmor does not center on the league model. It's a part of it, but not the major part. I think all of us old traditional league bowlers need to come to grips with this reality. I for one am thankful that both our local houses which both did major renovations/upgrade similar to Bowlero support both league and entertainment type bowling and for now it seems to be working for everyone.
He tried the same thing previously at AMF's Strike n Spare on RT. 22 in Greenbrook, NJ (now called Bowlmor Greenbrook). So far, it's an abysmal failure. They've been begging the leagues they sent away to return. I wonder why he expects the same business model to succeed at Carolier.
-
Don't know that it will succeed. But, until it fails he will do what he believes in. In the meantime, that doesn't bode well for league bowlers I know, but it is what it is for now.
For me in your situation if the price per game was affordable, "rather than never stepping foot in there again", I would practice at Bowlero and bowl league elsewhere as you are currently doing. At least that way you would save a 45 minute drive to where you are bowling league. But, I realize that's me and not you.
-
For me in your situation if the price per game was affordable, "rather than never stepping foot in there again", I would practice at Bowlero and bowl league elsewhere as you are currently doing. At least that way you would save a 45 minute drive to where you are bowling league. But, I realize that's me and not you.
Before many leagues were forced of there, conditions of practice with regard to the approaches and the oil on the lanes were so abysmal that I gave up even trying to practice for league there.
Examples of how bad it was are:
one day the approaches were so bad I went through an entire bag of Easy slide to be able to complete 3 games, and
on another day (I usually practiced around 11/11:30 AM) the lanes were so dry, I tried to play the 4th arrow with my plastic ball and it rolled out just beyond the 4th arrow.
(When Brunswick ran the place they oiled 2x a day: Midnight and 5 PM; when Bowlmor took over they oiled 1x a day. )
Often league conditions were barely better than that, in the 1st year Bolwmor took over.
-
Perhaps the ball manufacturers should consider getting into the business of owning bowling centers. They would certainly cater to league bowlers, because it's the league bowlers who buy their products. There can't be much profit in manufacturing bright orange or lime green plastic balls.
-
That just stinks, I use to look forward to the PBA and more recently the PWBA US Open tour stop at Carolier to watch and talk to the pros. Now since Carolier/Bowlero have essentially cut the number of lanes for competitive bowling in half, there are now no bowling centers in NJ large enough to accommodate a Professional tour stop. Unless some insanely rich bowling enthusiast feels like opening up a brand new 70+ lane center with an emphasis on competitive league bowling, the closest professional tour stop will be the PWBA Rochester Open in NY state, which is serious hike for anyone in NJ.
-
Perhaps the ball manufacturers should consider getting into the business of owning bowling centers. They would certainly cater to league bowlers, because it's the league bowlers who buy their products. There can't be much profit in manufacturing bright orange or lime green plastic balls.
I am not a spokesman for Brunswick, so take this for what it's worth.
Did you know that Brunswick sold the bowling centers they owned to Bowlmor? As I recall it was about 85 of them. For whatever reason the capital side of Brunswick didn't want to own bowling centers anymore. Perhaps they have watched the declining numbers of league bowlers for the last 20+ years and decided to get out. Perhaps it was for other reasons because Brunswick Capital owns a successful line of fitness equipment, which would probably be pretty popular in today's society... Who knows?
There are other ball manufacturers that are very profitable, at least for the time being, and I don't see them out buying bowling centers either. If the league base continues to shrink then why would they?
Right now we have X amount of ball companies competing for a shrinking market. UNLESS the sport can attract new bowlers, presumably from those who start out as open play bowlers, we will continue to shrink in numbers. That, to me, does not sound like a good long-term investment.
I'm not condoning the poor treatment by poorly run centers at all. I believe if you're going to be in the bowling business do it right because you can't afford to alienate ANY segment of your customer base, open bowlers or league, because you really need it all to be successful.
-
While I don't condone many of the actions of BowlMor, I will say that until YOUR name is on the deed to the business, it's super easy to ridicule the owners.
Bottom line (as noted by many in this post) league bowling is declining and has been for a long time. If proprietors don't take action guess what, they close down. While every market is different, our center's backbone is league bowling and we bust our tail constantly trying to build it. BUT you need those open play people that bowl a few times a year to pay the bills, just having league bowlers will not suffice in today's marketplace. You absolutely have to cater (or try to) everyone that steps foot in your building. Every customer wants something different and you have to try your best to knock their socks off with quality products and excellent customer service.
-
That just stinks, I use to look forward to the PBA and more recently the PWBA US Open tour stop at Carolier to watch and talk to the pros. Now since Carolier/Bowlero have essentially cut the number of lanes for competitive bowling in half, there are now no bowling centers in NJ large enough to accommodate a Professional tour stop. Unless some insanely rich bowling enthusiast feels like opening up a brand new 70+ lane center with an emphasis on competitive league bowling, the closest professional tour stop will be the PWBA Rochester Open in NY state, which is serious hike for anyone in NJ.
Why not? There are two PWBA stops in No. California. One at Double Decker bowl in Rohnert Park which has 50 lanes and one at Steve Cook's Fireside Lanes in Citrus Heights which has only 32 lanes.
There are also multiple locations with 32 lanes that host PBA Regional and PBA50 stops and when the PBA "tour" was actually a tour, both Harvest Park Bowl(32 lanes) in Brentwood and E.A. Dublin Bowl(40) lanes had multiple tournaments.
Even during the heyday of the PBA tour, the pros bowled tournaments at a few 32 lane houses.
-
That just stinks, I use to look forward to the PBA and more recently the PWBA US Open tour stop at Carolier to watch and talk to the pros. Now since Carolier/Bowlero have essentially cut the number of lanes for competitive bowling in half, there are now no bowling centers in NJ large enough to accommodate a Professional tour stop. Unless some insanely rich bowling enthusiast feels like opening up a brand new 70+ lane center with an emphasis on competitive league bowling, the closest professional tour stop will be the PWBA Rochester Open in NY state, which is serious hike for anyone in NJ.
Why not? There are two PWBA stops in No. California. One at Double Decker bowl in Rohnert Park which has 50 lanes and one at Steve Cook's Fireside Lanes in Citrus Heights which has only 32 lanes.
There are also multiple locations with 32 lanes that host PBA Regional and PBA50 stops and when the PBA "tour" was actually a tour, both Harvest Park Bowl(32 lanes) in Brentwood and E.A. Dublin Bowl(40) lanes had multiple tournaments.
Even during the heyday of the PBA tour, the pros bowled tournaments at a few 32 lane houses.
Not for nothing either, but Sun Valley lanes in Lincoln, Nebraska is 32 lanes, while the LPBT/PWBA stop at Maplewood Lanes in Omaha was 40.
That said, it would depend on number of entries into the tournament in proportion to the number of lanes and squads available.
By contrast, the last tournaments at the Showboat/Castaways, including the Firestone TOC used barely a third to half of the lanes available.
BL.
-
That just stinks, I use to look forward to the PBA and more recently the PWBA US Open tour stop at Carolier to watch and talk to the pros. Now since Carolier/Bowlero have essentially cut the number of lanes for competitive bowling in half, there are now no bowling centers in NJ large enough to accommodate a Professional tour stop. Unless some insanely rich bowling enthusiast feels like opening up a brand new 70+ lane center with an emphasis on competitive league bowling, the closest professional tour stop will be the PWBA Rochester Open in NY state, which is serious hike for anyone in NJ.
Why not? There are two PWBA stops in No. California. One at Double Decker bowl in Rohnert Park which has 50 lanes and one at Steve Cook's Fireside Lanes in Citrus Heights which has only 32 lanes.
There are also multiple locations with 32 lanes that host PBA Regional and PBA50 stops and when the PBA "tour" was actually a tour, both Harvest Park Bowl(32 lanes) in Brentwood and E.A. Dublin Bowl(40) lanes had multiple tournaments.
Even during the heyday of the PBA tour, the pros bowled tournaments at a few 32 lane houses.
Not for nothing either, but Sun Valley lanes in Lincoln, Nebraska is 32 lanes, while the LPBT/PWBA stop at Maplewood Lanes in Omaha was 40.
That said, it would depend on number of entries into the tournament in proportion to the number of lanes and squads available.
By contrast, the last tournaments at the Showboat/Castaways, including the Firestone TOC used barely a third to half of the lanes available.
BL.
Ah, I did not know that. In that case I guess it would now all depend on whether prospective proprietors want to displace open/league play for a week in order to host a Tour event, and since "Bowlero" agreed to host the 2017 NCAA Women's Bowling Finals, I guess it's possible.
-
That just stinks, I use to look forward to the PBA and more recently the PWBA US Open tour stop at Carolier to watch and talk to the pros. Now since Carolier/Bowlero have essentially cut the number of lanes for competitive bowling in half, there are now no bowling centers in NJ large enough to accommodate a Professional tour stop. Unless some insanely rich bowling enthusiast feels like opening up a brand new 70+ lane center with an emphasis on competitive league bowling, the closest professional tour stop will be the PWBA Rochester Open in NY state, which is serious hike for anyone in NJ.
Why not? There are two PWBA stops in No. California. One at Double Decker bowl in Rohnert Park which has 50 lanes and one at Steve Cook's Fireside Lanes in Citrus Heights which has only 32 lanes.
There are also multiple locations with 32 lanes that host PBA Regional and PBA50 stops and when the PBA "tour" was actually a tour, both Harvest Park Bowl(32 lanes) in Brentwood and E.A. Dublin Bowl(40) lanes had multiple tournaments.
Even during the heyday of the PBA tour, the pros bowled tournaments at a few 32 lane houses.
Not for nothing either, but Sun Valley lanes in Lincoln, Nebraska is 32 lanes, while the LPBT/PWBA stop at Maplewood Lanes in Omaha was 40.
That said, it would depend on number of entries into the tournament in proportion to the number of lanes and squads available.
By contrast, the last tournaments at the Showboat/Castaways, including the Firestone TOC used barely a third to half of the lanes available.
BL.
Ah, I did not know that. In that case I guess it would now all depend on whether prospective proprietors want to displace open/league play for a week in order to host a Tour event, and since "Bowlero" agreed to host the 2017 NCAA Women's Bowling Finals, I guess it's possible.
Some places would, as they would get paid either way. At that point, it would come down to which one would bring in more money for that week: league bowlers, or the entity hosting that tournament, as they would effectively be reserving the entire house for that week.
If done during the summer months, which the PWBA basically always has (yes, they did tour in the fall, but a lot of their stops were in the summer), the proprietors absolutely went all in for it, because the money they'd get in was more than what they'd take in with summer leagues and open bowling.
Bring in something like Collegiate tournaments, and you'd basically have the same thing. Even if during the regular season, they'd factor in how much they'd bring in with league bowling versus what the USBC and NCAA would pay for reserving the house. Then you'd have to factor in the costs of maintenance (USBC/PBA/PWBA would bring in their own mechanics and hardware), refreshments (alcohol is more expensive than soft drinks), and see which one looks better on paper.
And league bowlers being bowlers, they wouldn't really complain about not being able to bowl for a week if they were able to see current or future pros going at it in their house, let alone in their city.
The proprietors of Sun Valley, Strike and Spare Lanes in St. Charles, Mo. (outside St. Louis), and Woodland Bowl in Indianapolis had no problem at all with having their bowlers forego a week for collegiates, because of how much they'd earn over league, and to be honest, with the action they saw the weeks the tournaments were there, league bowlers there didn't mind it one bit.
BL.
-
Strike and Spare shut 'er down about 5 years ago. Prolly not a good example to use.