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Author Topic: Help with my new Reign  (Read 7288 times)

Komodo

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Help with my new Reign
« on: September 21, 2009, 09:10:29 PM »
I brought a spare ball into a pro shop to have the span adjusted and to my surprise they had a new Reign ball out on display.  Owner said he had gotten some in early.  Anyways, it was the new ball I had decided I wanted when it was released so I went ahead and bought it then and there.  I want to make it clear that I'm not by any means a great bowler.  Only been at it for 2 years, but I'm starting to get a lot better and so far am carrying a 175 average in league.  I wanted to purchase my first high performance ball and the Reign seemed to be exactly what I had in mind.  Something really angular and strong off the break.  Also I wanted to have the drilling done based on my PAP.  The pro shop guy took my PAP by looking at the track on my spare ball (though I had only rolled that a few times so I can't imagine it had much of a track) and I explained to him the reaction I was looking for and told him to punch it up.  Picked it up the next day but did not have time to roll it then and there.  It was drilled so as the pin was dead left of center, sort of over middle finger, and about .75 inches above.  Anyways, took it out later and the reaction was simply not at all what I expected.  My old ball is a Brunswick Wizard and I expected a drastically different reaction from that.  What I got was damn near indiscernible.  I'm not a high rev player (which I explained at the time of purchase) and I tend to roll straight up the 5 board with speed.  I expected to be able to play much more in to out using this ball and still get recovery.  Quite frankly I saw no difference in reaction.  Is it possibly that I just don't put enough rev's on the ball to get it to react any differntly?  Or, is it that the drill really wasn't the right one for me?  I'd appreciate and thoughts you have.  

Also on a side note.  Is it normal when a pro shop drills a ball to use a scribe to mark up the ball? I mean I realize its just cosmetic and that a bowling ball ends up looking crappy after a couple weeks of bowling anyway, but isn't it normal to want your new ball to look new?  Not only was my new Reign all scribed up from finger holes to thumb but the guy also did the same to my previously unmarked spare ball when he fixed the span.

Edited on 9/24/2009 4:07 PM

 

J_Mac

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #1 on: September 22, 2009, 06:08:41 AM »
Sounds like a lousy job of matching the ball up to you.

BUT

House shots are very capable of making different balls appear to play roughly the same line.

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I'm really lucky that the shop that I frequent tries not to drill a ball for any bowler without first verifying speed vs. revs, axis tilt, axis rotation, and PAP by actually taking them onto the lanes.  PAP is usually verified by oil rings and not track wear.

Without knowing what your PAP is, no one here can verify how strong of a layout it really is.  Simply saying pin over middle finger isn't enough information.

Scribe lines are generally more accurate than the white pencil lines, but I never understood why most shops that use scribes are so heavy handed.  It doesn't take that much pressure to leave a mark that will be gone after the first light resurface.
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Dan Belcher

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #2 on: September 22, 2009, 07:27:04 AM »
I'm a lower-rev guy as well, and my Reign is stupidly strong downlane and lets me move deeper inside than all my other equipment and still carry.  So I doubt that's your problem.  More than likely, this drilling is too weak and low-flaring to allow the strong pearl coverstock on the Reign to do much.  Again, hard to say how weak this layout is based on your PAP, but for most bowlers, that's a low flaring layout.  This creates a lot of length, but also it tends to make the ball labor a little bit.  When the lanes get dry, you'll probably notice a big difference (the Wizard will want to hook too early and not drive through the back part of the lane compared to the Reign), but especially since it's a blended house shot, it's going to just make them overlap more.

Have your ball driller actually watch you throw both balls, explain to him what you actually want, and he'll probably end up redrilling the Reign I'm guessing to put a stronger layout on it.  You may also go to another ball driller for a second opinion.  Normally surface adjustments are the recommended thing to do when a ball isn't working well, but if you're having trouble getting a highly polished skid/snap pearl to do much when it finds friction outside, that tells me the drilling itself is just wrong and you're taking too much of the core's influence out of the ball.

the pooh

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #3 on: September 22, 2009, 07:37:11 AM »
I am sorry you had to have this experience. Being new(2 years) to the game, you have way too much expectations as to what a ball and layout can do. To get the reaction differences you are looking for, you must learn to alter your rotation of axis, your speed, your revolutions, your tilt, and how you play the lanes. Only then, does the ball and layout begin to make a slight difference. Most typical house shots tend to make the problem worse in that they make all balls have pretty much the same reaction. I have drilled thousands of balls for many hundreds of bowlers, and most new bowlers feel like you did.Some good lessons with a quality coach will do far more for you than any new ball. You don't know how many times I've heard "my new ball isn't any different than my old ball". Technique will give you the look you want!
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Nails

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2009, 07:49:48 AM »
Some of it is your low rev game, the rest is probably the shot.  I've seen house shots where a friend's Virtual Gravity was only two boards stronger than my old weaker equipment.  Do you have another center to try the two balls at?  You should see quite a bit more length and reaction to the dry with the Reign.  The drilling might be pretty normal did the pro shop tell you your PAP?

Some like scribe marks, some do not.  The shops that use them do so because a sharp scribe line should be more accurate than a grease pencil.  I like the marks, but I can easily understand that many do not.  If they bother you, make sure to let the shop know.  They can be removed with a resurface, but I wouldn't do it until the ball needs it.  But maybe they can do a potential next ball without them.
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rctc286

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #5 on: September 22, 2009, 07:59:08 AM »
I bought a used Reign and I was disappointed in mine.  I was looking for a stronger reaction the my dimesion 2 which moves alot. (I Love that Ball).  The reign looks to me like a med light kinda reminds me of T Road Pearl more of a arc reaction. Not what I was looking for.  My Dimension 2 cover most of my needs.
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Dan Belcher

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2009, 08:00:59 AM »
quote:
I bought a used Reign and I was disappointed in mine.  I was looking for a stronger reaction the my dimesion 2 which moves alot. (I Love that Ball).  The reign looks to me like a med light kinda reminds me of T Road Pearl more of a arc reaction. Not what I was looking for.  My Dimension 2 cover most of my needs.
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Roto Grip and Storm why throw anything else!
The Reign has a weaker cover and higher RG core than the Second Dimension -- I'm not sure why you would have expected it to be stronger.  It's going to be longer and react harder off the dry, but not hook more overall unless the Second Dimension is just burning up really badly.

rctc286

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2009, 08:07:32 AM »
I was misinformed buy a proshop. Knowones perfect
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tommygn

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2009, 08:36:35 AM »
Komodo,

Please do not go to another pro shop UNTIL YOU HAVE SPOKEN with the pro shop that drilled your ball. A second opinion is very useful, only when you have been dismissed by your current pro shop, or just do not have a good relationship. I have had customers come in to my pro shop, be unhappy with the results, only for them to go someplace else and have the new shop steal my business, when all that was needed was a surface change or balance hole. Talk to your pro shop, let him or her see you roll the ball, discuss with them first, and then seek a second opinion if you are not satisfied.

Other than that, much of what other people posted is very much correct in that house conditions will steer the ball to the pocket, and not allow you to see the differences in the two balls as you may on a PBA pattern.
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r534me

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2009, 11:24:57 AM »
quote:
I bought a used Reign and I was disappointed in mine.  I was looking for a stronger reaction the my dimesion 2 which moves alot. (I Love that Ball).  The reign looks to me like a med light kinda reminds me of T Road Pearl more of a arc reaction. Not what I was looking for.  My Dimension 2 cover most of my needs.
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Roto Grip and Storm why throw anything else!


The t-road pearl does not arc unless you have it drilled that way.  Mine is over the bridge and snaps hard.  The 2D is more of an arcing ball.  My 2D hooks at the midlane and doesn't snap on the backend.  I rarely find enough oil in house conditions to use the 2D.  My TF is strong enough even drilled very weak with the pin over middle finger and mb next to the thumb.

rctc286

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2009, 12:01:17 PM »
I was not saying my T-Road Pearl arch.  I was saying the reign kinda reminded me a little of the T Road. If it sounded that way, It wasnt what I meant.
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dougb

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2009, 01:05:37 PM »
I have a Brunswick Wizard and T-Road Pearl.  Depending on the drilling and the cover (especially if the Wizard is in it's OOB unpolished state), the difference in the balls becomes apparent when the house shot starts to break down.  Where the Wizard will start to hook earlier and your carry goes down as the ball burns energy, the T-Road Pearl will start to shine.  My guess is the Reign is the same, as most comparisons I've heard put it as a stronger and more angular T-Road Pearl.

Like you, I am a lower revs player and my T-Road Pearl is drilled differently (pin to the right of ring finger, cg in palm).  This gives me length, a smooth arc, and a powerful move to the pocket on the backend.  When the lanes break down I can move left and throw the ball out there with confidence that it will come back.

duvallite

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2009, 02:43:46 PM »
Sounds like your layout may be too weak for your style.  Have the shop tell you what they think  your PAP is, as that is really key to the layout process.  As a lower rev player, I'm guessing that you are probably speed dominant also.  For this type of bowler, stronger layouts are supposed to work better, say something like between 4 1/2 - 3 3/8 pin to pap (probably closer to 3 3/8), depending on how strong the ball is, and pin-down layouts would typically be better to get the ball into a roll sooner.  For that sharper backend, a smaller pin-buffer should help there also, say around 2 1/2 to 1 1/2 from your VAL.  As a final thought, ask about a balance hole to help the ball react better.  Maybe something about 2 - 3 3/8 down from your PAP on the VAL.

jls

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2009, 04:17:10 PM »
Never use a spare ball to get your PAP...

BTW the ball was drilled, I seriously doubt you PAP was ever considered...

It sounds like you got the basic 101 drilling.. Pin above the fingers...And more above the middle finger... R U KIDDING ME...

To me it sounds like you needed a more aggressive drilling... Like a 4 by 4 with a 2 - 2 1/2 " pin buffer...MB strong...

So don't knock the ball,  Knock the drilling....

Cause the drilling you got tends to make the ball go long with a smoother backend...

You got this ball drilled in a converted broom closet, right??? Open 5-8...


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Edited on 9/22/2009 4:20 PM

Juggernaut

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Re: Help with my new Reign
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2009, 04:22:01 PM »
quote:
Never use a spare ball to get your PAP...



 Why not? Assuming you use the same release, the pap should be the same, shouldn't it?
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