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Author Topic: Comparison to V2 - help please!  (Read 2954 times)

Traumabill

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Comparison to V2 - help please!
« on: November 12, 2003, 08:37:12 PM »
I'm looking to drop from 16# to 15# for various reasons.

I'm currently throwing a V2 Sanded which I happen to like.  I throw
relatively fast (19+ mph) with very little hand (unfortunately, but working on it).  I play between the 5 - 8 board standing on 19.

Curious to what I should be looking at in the Track line that is real similar to the V2 I currently have and really like .  I'd like to evaluate both at their merits.  (currently the V2 is drilled Label leverage w/ no hole).    I'd like a tick more backend if possible... For house shots and 'heavier' oil...

I also had a chance to throw the Apex Obsession at Demo Days, which I liked...What is comparable to that given the same conditions? The Ebonite Rep stated I may want to consider a 'heavier' oil ball as the first one out given the house shot and my lack of hand....


Any thoughts or suggestions would help,

Thanks,

Bill

 

Nicanor

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Re: Comparison to V2 - help please!
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2003, 05:38:09 PM »
Ok, I'll try and be fair.

I believe that the Morpheus core is a great core.  One of the reasons I mentioned earlier was how much I like Track cores but did not care for the Columbia coverstock.

You say unique and morpheus in the Phenom unleashed but the Morpheus core is in several more bowling balls though I know they have different layouts of the flip block etc of the Morpheus core.  I think at least the Freak Out has a quicker spin rate then the Unleashed but thats only if you bu into spin rate.  I went to one of the Warren/Pinel seminars and I don't totally buy into spin rates etc.  if spin rates were so important, then symmetrical bowling balls would be a thing of the past, yet symmetrical balls seem to be the bowling balls most praised.  The thing about spin rate is that is suppose to help make the ball very predictable and the symmetrical bowling balls are lucky to ever find a spin rate.

A .047 differential is just above average, some are pretty high like in the 80's and then they are low as 17 (probably lower).  So what.  There is just a very small amount of measurable difference between max rg and min rg and the friction rate was lowered a couple of years ago so it should get through the heads better then the hook monsters of old.  What does a core do, what measurements differences do you get from the different cores.

I did throw the Unleashed today and I can honestly say the lane conditions made it unfair to judge this ball.  It was medium short oil Christmas tree pattern.  I threw the ball box condition and the ball hooked in the heads rolled out and when it did hit the pocket, it left a weak 10.  Not the balls fault.  I think with a little more oil and a longer oil pattern this ball will be great.

The Unleashed reminds me of the Enforcer, it has the same RG, recommended lane conditions etc.  But the Enforcer was a Morpheus core.

Again I say, throw the ball, tell me how it reads the lanes and carries the pocket that makes it unique.  Don't just tell me that it has a Morpheus core and that makes it unique.  Bowling balls read the lanes early, late, the back end, the mid lane, the heads, not at all, they carry everything, keep ins low, send them high, has no messengers, has messengers flying everywhere, rolls out, skids past the break point, etc.  Ok the ball is unique because it has a Morpheus core (like the Freak, Freak Out, Mutant, Super Freak, Phenom and now the Phenom Unleashed). Its not unique.

Please keep the discussion going.  I am not slamming Track equipment, I think they have outstanding cores.

V/R,

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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)
Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)

BackToBasics

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Re: Comparison to V2 - help please!
« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2003, 09:59:43 AM »
You have to look at the ball in the context of what it's compared to.  First, if I'm not mistaken, the FANG particle coverstock has larger particles than WOW but there are less of them.  This allows the ball to not burn too quickly which is a problem with heavier load particle balls.  The Phenom and Unleashed both get  more length than the Super Freak, Mutant and Freak but much more angular in the back.  This is a result of both cover and core.

Actually, the Phenom Unleashed has a faste spin rate than the Freak Out.  Spin rates are somewhat important when comparing asymmetrical balls.  Saying a Freak Out has a faster spin rate than a Triple Threat is mute because they are different types of balls. At that point, it's just symmetrical vs asymmetrical. The most important thing about spin rate is how quickly the ball reacts to changes in friction and also how quickly it will change direction.  This is because of how quicly the ball will seek it's preferred spin axis.  In theory, all things being equal, a ball with a faster spin rate will change direction more drastically.  

Yes, .047 diff is above average but it's not as high as other high flaring balls like the Mutant, V2 Strong, etc.  High flare can generate hook but it also generate early burn and not much backend.  Lowering the diff prevents the ball from burning too quickly.  If you notice, the Freak Out also has a similar diff which is why it was also very clean and strong downlane.

Thus you have a ball that has larger but less particles, an extremely fast spin rate and a medium differential.  This creates a oil ball that will get through the heads, still read because of the surface but be angular in the back.  This combination is hard to get because if you increase the particle, you get early hook.  If you increase the diff, you get early hook.  Niether of which allow you to open up the lane downlane.

The Phenom and Phenom Unleashed are the first two oil balls that I've had that reacted down lane like a polished ball.  The Freak, Super Freak and Mutant didn't match up to me at all and I tried various drillings and surfaces.  They just had too much diff and too high a particle load to use on the oil volumes I encounter.  Thus they hooked early, didn't recover, didn't hit and were condition specific.  This is not the case with the Phenom and Unleashed which is why I think they are unique.  A true test would be to drill an Super Freak and Phenom/Unleashed and throw them to compare.


Edited on 11/18/2003 11:03 AM

Mr Track

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Re: Comparison to V2 - help please!
« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2003, 10:25:25 AM »
why do you want this discussion to continue? you've thrown the ball already...play on different shots and see for your self.

what more can we say after we told you that it gives us/me great lentgh, a turn like no other, and the hardest hit to create messengers, solid flush, trips or anytype of pin reaction WITH a dull surface.

i dont know if you play up the boards or anything, but i havent trying shooting this ball anywhere near the second arrow.  
with this ball, i usually stand on 30/35 depending on the condition, and cross the middle/3rd arrow, breaking near 8 i believe....so pretty much, i get alot of hand on the ball, shooting it with med. speed(16-17)...this ball crosses the entire lane for me on med-med/carrydown, mid-light if polished(havent tried it yet)....i have not played on heavy conditions with this ball yet.


I think traumabill got all the information he needs, nicanor, all you have to do is experience it for your self.  If you dont like it, then maybe it's not for you...but i like it, and i believe that it's a unique ball.

maybe track doesnt have the best cover's on the market...OH WELL!

it takes the cake for me!
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'wanna be' Track Staffer

but performs well enough to be one!

Nicanor

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Re: Comparison to V2 - help please!
« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2003, 12:49:22 PM »
Mr Track,

the only reason I like to continue the discussing is because it is one.  Not necessarily do we agree, but it is a good discussing with difference of opinions that done without a lot of sarcasm.  just good info that I think Trackees might like to know.  I don't know if its for me, I'm heading out right now to test the ball on a little more/longer oil.  ut its all good.  I do like the feedback.  i don't have to agree with all of it, but I still like the input everyone has made to this topic.

V/R,

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Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)
Nicanor (Ten On The Deck)