Author Topic: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference? (Read 8819 times)

LuckyLefty · « **on:** March 26, 2012, 11:24:04 PM »

Okay....I give!

Both with a variation of the legion core, both pearl!

Which one or both is supposed to be an improved version of the 607ASE?

Regards,

Luckylefty

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

Edited by LuckyLefty on 3/26/2012 at 9:39 PM

trackfiend · « **Reply #1 on:** March 26, 2012, 11:53:19 PM »

The 508 has a tweaked core from the 607 and the cover from the 505a and its better than both its sooo good i love this ball so much it has been a house shot killer it paid for itself in three weeks in brackets lol.

Strider · « **Reply #2 on:** March 27, 2012, 08:03:50 AM »

Since the cover is still ~70% of the ball's reaction and both balls use completely different covers...

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #3 on:** March 27, 2012, 11:38:12 AM »

Strider,

Description of 508A

First we started with the ever popular Legion Core that we used in the best-selling Track ball in recent years, the 607A. Next we worked on creating a cover that would be just as angular as the cover used on the 505A. After testing several different covers, we said to ourselves, “if it isn’t broke, don’t fix it.” By combining the MP GEN 4 Reactive Pearl veneer and the Legion Core, we have provided Track fans with a ball motion that is stronger than the 505A while maintaining the same overall look on the lanes.

Description of the 811SE

Description: Track Bowling decided we needed a stronger, more dynamic version of the 607A SE. With that thought in mind, we bring to you the all new 811A Special Edition featuring a brand new core, the “Legion 2 Turbo”. This unique core started out as a symmetric core shape but then was modified into an asymmetric core to get the exact RG, Differential, and Mass Bias numbers we were looking for. This perfectly tuned core is the “Heart and Soul” of the new 811A SE. With the Mass Bias being 0.011, this ball is set up to give the most angular backend reaction to the widest range of bowlers and styles. To go along with our new “Legion 2 Turbo” core we are also introducing an amazing new coverstock, the “SE8 GEN1” which includes “Crystalline Mica”, an all-new performance pearl additive. This additive is 15% more responsive off the dry than what was used in the 607A SE

I haven't seen them and I read Names of coverstocks but it doesn't mean much too me. Could you expand on your thoughts? Thanks for your help!

Regards,

Luckylefty

I haven't seen them and I read Names of coverstocks but it doesn't mean much too me. Could you expand on your thoughts?

Thanks,

Luckylefty

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

Edited by LuckyLefty on 3/27/2012 at 10:05 AM

Curt_Dupre · « **Reply #4 on:** March 27, 2012, 12:24:41 PM »

The 508a is about 3-5 boards straighter than the 811a. The 508a is a touch smoother than the 811a. The 811a is cleaner through the front, with more angle on the back part of the lane. Both are pearls, but you can move further left with the 811a, as it retains energy better. If you have any other questions, let me know. Hope this helps.

Trackbowling.com
Mccorveysproshop.com
Track Regional Staff

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #5 on:** March 27, 2012, 12:36:38 PM »

Curt,

That was really helpful! Thank you.

Regards,

Luckylefty

PS I am surprised I am seeing Michael Fagen use the 811SE as a spare ball, what gives there!?

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

Nails · « **Reply #6 on:** March 27, 2012, 12:41:45 PM »

Supposedly Track came up with this number system so there wouldn't be any questions about the balls. The first number is the cover strength. The 8 series should in theory be quite a bit stronger than the 5 series. For some reason it's not always accurate. The 5 series has always been under rated as far as cover strength.

Telling it like it is.

MrPerfect · « **Reply #7 on:** March 28, 2012, 10:21:36 AM »

LuckyLefty wrote on 3/27/2012 10:36 AM:
Curt,

That was really helpful! Thank you.

Regards,

Luckylefty

PS I am surprised I am seeing Michael Fagen use the 811SE as a spare ball, what gives there!?

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

I don't know about Fagan, but while I have a plastic ball I do the same thing occasionally with my high end Track equipment. The reason is that with swelling, or lack thereof, my thumbs isn't always the same and sometimes one ball just feels better than the other. I know I can kill any ball, but first and foremost I need to be confident that I'm going to clear the thumb cleanly in order to achieve my desired result.

Considering how much Fagan used the 811 during the week in order to make the show it really isn't all that suprising that he used the ball he was most confident in for his spares. Unfortunately for him it didn't match up with the shot he saw during the telecast or he would have been using it for his first and second ball.

jls · « **Reply #8 on:** March 28, 2012, 01:01:23 PM »

Sir, good point...However I do believe most touring pros have their thumb holes drilled on

the large side and rely on TAPE...

And yes, touring pro's do have the ability to use just about any ball to pick up the 10/7 pin...

In fact, many house bowlers do...

The point sir is this...

When a consumer sees a HP ball being used on TV as a spare ball...They may get the wrong

idea about said balls hooking ability...

We play the telecast of the bowling shows here at the shop...I can tell you this...Most people

watching the show want to see what balls are being used...And when several customer's saw

11A on the ball being used to pick up the 10 pin...They asked about it...And then they figured

out it was the 811A...A HP ball..."a angular HP ball"...

And these customer's had a very negative image of the 811A after seeing that...Because most know

that MOST pro's use Plastic...

So IMO, I do not believe IT HELPS with the sales of a HP BALL, when consumer's see it being

used a a 10 pin ball...

Please keep in mine...MOST of the people that bowl and watch the telecast are NOT Mr. 220...

And they may not be up on some of the things a better bowlers does...Your point...

So if they see a companies latest release being used as a spare ball... They may indeed get

the wrong image of said ball...And that sir, could hurt sales of said ball...

Now lets be honest here...The 811A is not jumping off the shelves...<<<FEW BALLS ARE...

So we really don't need to see anything that could be seen as Negative about a balls performance...

I did notice on the last telecast that he was not using the 811A as a spare ball...

MrPerfect wrote on 3/28/2012 8:21 AM:

LuckyLefty wrote on 3/27/2012 10:36 AM:
Curt,

That was really helpful! Thank you.

Regards,

Luckylefty

PS I am surprised I am seeing Michael Fagen use the 811SE as a spare ball, what gives there!?

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

I don't know about Fagan, but while I have a plastic ball I do the same thing occasionally with my high end Track equipment. The reason is that with swelling, or lack thereof, my thumbs isn't always the same and sometimes one ball just feels better than the other. I know I can kill any ball, but first and foremost I need to be confident that I'm going to clear the thumb cleanly in order to achieve my desired result.

Considering how much Fagan used the 811 during the week in order to make the show it really isn't all that suprising that he used the ball he was most confident in for his spares. Unfortunately for him it didn't match up with the shot he saw during the telecast or he would have been using it for his first and second ball.

jls

Edited by jls on 3/28/2012 at 2:09 PM

ccrider · « **Reply #9 on:** March 28, 2012, 01:09:33 PM »

Spot on Jls. What was the marketing strategy? I bet Fagan and Track never even thought about the response from average Noe Bowler.

Those that can do. Those that can't complain. Pimpin ain't easy, but it's mandatory.

Most things we like, we don't need. Most things we need, we don't like. Don't confuse your likes with your needs.

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #10 on:** March 28, 2012, 01:33:12 PM »

JLS,

Very well explained regarding my impression of the high end ball being used as a spare ball!

I'll tell you one ball I can't pick up a spare with or would if I wanted for some reason to reduce my chances succeeding would be my Virtual Gravity! Boy does the high reactivity of that ball make it hard for me!

Regards,

Luckylefty

PS glad I wasn't the only one!

It takes Courage to have Faith, and Faith to have Courage.

James M. McCurley, New Orleans, Louisiana

jls · « **Reply #11 on:** March 28, 2012, 01:38:46 PM »

CC, sir that is exactly the point I was trying to make...

Not every bowler that buys a ball is MR 220, like Slick Willie the bias staffer...

People read up on the new releases...And when they see a ball billed as "Angular" or "extremely

angular" they expect big time hook on the back end...

And they seem to have a problem when they see said ball being used on the PBA Tour Finals as

a 10 pin ball...

We play the telecast of the last show here at the shop...So when customer's are waiting they

watch the show...Cause as we all know, hardly anyone watch's the show on Sunday...

And when customer's saw the 11A on the ball Fagen use as a 10 pin ball... They ZOOMED in

to see what ball it was... I said nothing...But customer's aren't STUPID... And in seconds

they figured it out... 811A...

And their reactions were, "if it's so angular, then why is Fagen using it as a 10 pin ball in an

Important tournament...Especially in the FINALS"...

When MOST of the time we see the Pros on TV use PLASTIC...

IMO, this will not help with the sales of the 811A...

This was the point I tried to make...But slick Willie the staffer went postal and said Fagen

can use anything and throw it at the 10 pin...

WOW that's AMAZING...A touring pro can pick up a 10 pin with a HP BALL...WOW...

Heck, even I can do that...LOL

BTW, I noticed Fagen was NOT USING THE 811A on last weeks show...

And NAILS was "spot on" when he said that their numbers don't always much up...

And it's US PRO SHOPS that sell the balls that TAKE THE HEAT WHEN SAID BALLS

DON'T MEASURE UP TO THE HYPE...

Especially HYPE from bias staffers...

Now once again... IMO the 811A is a good piece of equipment when used on the right shot...

ccrider wrote on 3/28/2012 11:09 AM: Spot on Jls. What was the marketing strategy? I bet Fagan and Track never even thought about the response from average Noe Bowler. <<< NO They must think everyone that buys a ball is a MR. 220...

Those that can do. Those that can't complain. Pimpin ain't easy, but it's mandatory.

jls

Edited by jls on 3/28/2012 at 1:30 PM

CubsFan · « **Reply #12 on:** March 28, 2012, 02:20:08 PM »

I'm pretty certain the show last week was part of the group taped back in November. I also noticed he was not using his 811 on that show, nor was he wearing a running shoe on his non-slide foot. He must have started those practices sometime between the taping of those shows and the U.S. Open. Not sure if he was using plastic during The Masters (the first live show) against Barnes.

jls wrote on 3/28/2012 11:38 AM:

BTW, I noticed Fagen was NOT USING THE 811A on last weeks show...

Nails · « **Reply #13 on:** March 28, 2012, 02:34:45 PM »

To continue the side bar...

Not that it matters, but I'm pretty sure Duke doesn't use plastic for spares. He either uses his strike ball or another resin ball. Probably one he warmed up with and is comfortable with the feel. Duke does play with tape a lot, so once he's comfortable with it, he'll throw it at anything.

I don't remember if Fagan used to use plastic, but the other guy did have a point about him being able to throw any ball straight since he throws that baby back up. If it's feel he's looking for, I wonder why he just doesn't use his strike ball (like the 607A SE) for spares. I like my spare ball's thumb hole to be extra tight. Since I flatten out my hand, if it's the least bit loose I tend to drop it. Maybe that's why Duke or Fagan just use another "strike" ball for spares. It's already on the rack, and maybe they had time to tape it up just right for spares. I understand your point about not using the latest "greatest" HP ball for spares though.

Telling it like it is.

PLM · « **Reply #14 on:** March 28, 2012, 03:37:16 PM »

I'm sorry to hear the 811A is having some sales problems. It is the first Track ball I have owned, and I really am liking it.

Author Topic: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference? (Read 8819 times)

LuckyLefty

Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

trackfiend

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

Strider

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

LuckyLefty

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

Curt_Dupre

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

LuckyLefty

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

Nails

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

MrPerfect

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

jls

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

ccrider

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

LuckyLefty

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

jls

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

CubsFan

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

Nails

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?

PLM

Re: Ok I give....508A versus the 811 SE the difference?