Author Topic: Track fans have to admit..... (Read 4631 times)

Nodsleinad · « **on:** December 19, 2005, 03:44:51 AM »

Mr. Scroggins has not sold many balls the last two weeks. Shots were light, ball finished weakly and not very impressive at all.

He threw it like a league bowler ( I just had to say that ) !!!

Nod

Edited on 12/19/2005 1:14 PM

tenpinspro · « **Reply #16 on:** December 19, 2005, 03:38:47 PM »

quote:
Oh boy. If you only knew. Why do you think people are always asking what the pros are throwing on the telecast.

I think this varies on a case by case basis. Some shops may do well due to exposure of a product on the show but I have also been informed that overall it hasn't had the same effect as it used to. If it mattered that much to a manufacturer (in the sense of overall profit) that their product be on television, they would fight to sign the best players out there and that also isn't the case. If every ball used on television showed tremendous sales afterwards, companies would do everything possible to have their product there. AMF, Rotogrip and a few other smaller companies have since pulled out at the national level of the PBA. It's still about bottom line guys....

Another reason it tends to have less effect is because of brand loyalty as we have seen pros jump from one company to another. One year I saw Kim Adler make the show 4-5 weeks in a row and throw a different company every week. What did this do for consumer confidence? Absolutely nothing! Most have realized now that it is the bowler and not the ball.

My personal experience, TJ won 4 stops last year with Ebonite....not one customer asked me what he was using.
--------------------
Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Intl. - Amateur/Pro Shop Staff
Vise Inserts Staff
www.Trackbowling.com
www.startabowlingrevolution.com

See profile for Track Ball videos

*El Presidente of the Track Revolution

charlest · « **Reply #17 on:** December 19, 2005, 03:48:14 PM »

quote:
quote:
Example: after Walter Ray won the Johnny Petraglia Open 5 or 7 years back, using the original Helix, the Pro shop in that very center had 3 Helixes in stock. They never sold one of them and the hundreds of people watching the finals knew exactly what ball was used. The Pro shop dumped them for $15 each a few yers later after getting sick of looking at them.

99% of the people watching TV have no idea what ball is being used. Even when it was the AI, they didn't know that. Too many balls look alike. Even here where posters are dedictaed ball watchers, few have any clue which ball is being used.

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"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien

Charlest
That's a bad example. At that time the Helix cost close to $300. I dont care if WRW won 10 titles and avg 300, there was no way I was going to buy a $300 ball. Now if you used the Danger Zone as an example.....
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Buck '05

Sorry; it's as legitmate an example as any other out there, regardless of the price. Just because you're mor elikely to but a cheap ball than an expensive ball has NOT ONE THING TO DO WITH THE EXAMPLE OR THE PROBLEM!

Besides, at that time the DZ was not a cheap ball, retailing for over $225 WITHOUT inserts or thumb plugs. $225 was a LOT of miney in 1996 for a ball.

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"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien

Buckwild · « **Reply #18 on:** December 19, 2005, 04:17:20 PM »

Sorry; it's as legitmate an example as any other out there, regardless of the price. Just because you're mor elikely to but a cheap ball than an expensive ball has NOT ONE THING TO DO WITH THE EXAMPLE OR THE PROBLEM!

Besides, at that time the DZ was not a cheap ball, retailing for over $225 WITHOUT inserts or thumb plugs. $225 was a LOT of miney in 1996 for a ball.

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"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien
[/quote]

Charlest,

I should have reprhased my reply. While I wouldn't have bought the ball because of the price, many others felt the same way. As a matter of fact, I remember when ONE guy in my league bought the Helix, a lot of people was ripping on him for buying it. When he realized (after about 2 weeks) that the ball wasn't that good, he put it away for good. That is why I said that ball was a bad example. Perhaps one or two people bought the ball, and was ashamed to say how much they paid for it. when they did, others stayed away from it.
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Buck '05

Leftyhi-trak · « **Reply #19 on:** December 19, 2005, 05:16:59 PM »

Charlest,

Normally I'm with yah but not completely on this. Whats on the show does slightly impact sales. Case in point was the "Big Time" Tommy Jones threw last year. Sales especially on ebay were very high in dollar value even to the point that they could have gone onto proshop sites and found them cheaper. I agree with Rick as this may be more based upon region and the bowling audience of that area, but as a whole the bowling audience is oblivious and market wise probably a mere blip.

Nod,

Now back to the subject matter. The conditions of the show are considerably different than the qualifying and match play mostly due to the lighting and room temperature. With this being stated and him being the only lefty he had opportunity to break down the shot so he could play it however he wanted. Two weeks ago he handed the title away on both spares and execution. This week I don't believe he had the correct match up (too much ball) and the transition killed him. These pro's do things that us as league bowlers and most small tournament bowlers don't or barely understand. So if they made the wrong decision on "setting the shot" they are forced to live with it. Also in a one game match you don't have a ton of options that leave you with optimism. Remember making the right decisions for these guys is more than beer and a few bucks. I believe sometimes they almost pigeon-hole themselves in lane play but thats why they are pro's and I change a mean diaper watching them on TV.

Edited on 12/19/2005 7:54 PM

charlest · « **Reply #20 on:** December 19, 2005, 06:45:59 PM »

Hey, I never knocked Mike Scroggins and I'mnot going to start now. He made the darned show 3 weeks in a row! or something like that. He is a GREAT bowler, no matter his last 2 performances.

Lefty,

Sorry, more than one manufacturer has said in no uncertain terms that the balls used on the show are virtually never reflected in the sales of the following week or month. That is why Rick said the small manufacturers have backed out of PBA support, in general, only keeping some regional support for the sake of their staffers and supporters.

We are not making up this stuff! Honestly.

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"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien

BallsDeep · « **Reply #21 on:** December 19, 2005, 08:49:04 PM »

I think scroggins throws fine. He is smooth has a free arm swing and is deadly accurate. He may just be of the opinion that he should stick with what got him there and continue with a ball that may not be great for the condition on the tv pair. Although not an expert, the Strike may have worked better because of it's smoother reaction and enhanced readability over the flippier track he has been using.
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four fried chickens and a coke[/size=4]

chitown · « **Reply #22 on:** December 19, 2005, 11:47:01 PM »

quote:
Everytime I see him on TV, I think he has some disease or something. He looks like he has Downs Syndrome.

Whether he is bowling good or not

No offence to any BR members or their families intended.

Your thinking of Patrick Allen. He looks like he has downs.

chitown · « **Reply #23 on:** December 19, 2005, 11:51:51 PM »

quote:
quote:
Plus, with him being the $$ leader, points leader, etc, more people are going to see what he throws as he is up in the top 32 every week...

However, he used Brunswick to win the Masters, which is the only reason he is the "$$ leader, points leader, etc.". With Track he is 0-2 on TV and has not looked very good in doing that. I like Track equipment but I don't like Scroggins, maybe Track should pay him NOT to use their balls.

Edited on 12/19/2005 2:21 PM

At least he made the T.V. show. How many great bowlers didn't. I find it ridiculous that you guys would bag on a guy that made the T.V. finals.

Another point. I hook the lane a lot when the conditions are favoring that shot. However I have seen some locals guys that throw straight down and in like Walter Ray and can smoke most people in a match. I have been working on the down and end over end release myself because the carry percentage is great from that line. Plus if you miss chances are you knock down 9 and not many splits. With todays balls the end over end release is probably the best to learn and master.

chitown · « **Reply #24 on:** December 20, 2005, 12:03:06 AM »

Just wait you will see the Delta 1 win some shows. It's not the ball but the operator of that ball.

scotts33 · « **Reply #25 on:** December 20, 2005, 06:11:33 AM »

quote:
House bowlers will definitely go out and buy a ball they've seen on the show. Most of the higher teir bowlers like us don't, but you'd be surprised on how many times you'll se people come into the shops and order balls after seeing them on the show

HEY I'm a house hack!
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Scott

clintdaley · « **Reply #26 on:** December 20, 2005, 06:30:35 AM »

If TV made ball sales, then AMF, Roto Grip, and Visionary must be going under soon as you can not use them on the National Tour....yeah. Fact of the matter is, those companies came out and said that whatever the fee is to have their stuf on tour is not worth it.....so that is telling me the chance to have your stuff on 20 National shows, at the fee of lets say $50,000 for the entire year which equals $2500 per event is not worth it to them. They are also losing out on the people who show up to watch the PTQ, the round of 64, and then match play, not just the TV show, and they feel that $2500 or so is not worth it....tells me they are not getting many ball sales out of the National Tour.

Clint

--------------------
Clint Daley-Owner
Lets Go Bowling Daley
Inside Hunt Club Lanes
Salem, Ohio 44460
TRACK ADVISORY PRO SHOP STAFF

http://www.trackbowling.com/

http://www.startabowlingrevolution.com/

scotts33 · « **Reply #27 on:** December 20, 2005, 10:56:17 AM »

I wrote the PBA last year about licensing costs and off the top of my head I think they are more than you state Clint. http://pba.com/resources/ProductCategories.asp

I also think you are correct as Visionary dropped them last year and their business is up from what it was when they did register/license. They have hired new employees and are very busy this year. I normally could call and get whatever I wanted within a few days now it's more like a week or more.
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Scott

Jeffrevs · « **Reply #28 on:** December 20, 2005, 11:17:16 AM »

quote:
If TV made ball sales, then AMF, Roto Grip, and Visionary must be going under soon as you can not use them on the National Tour....yeah. Fact of the matter is, those companies came out and said that whatever the fee is to have their stuf on tour is not worth it.....so that is telling me the chance to have your stuff on 20 National shows, at the fee of lets say $50,000 for the entire year which equals $2500 per event is not worth it to them. They are also losing out on the people who show up to watch the PTQ, the round of 64, and then match play, not just the TV show, and they feel that $2500 or so is not worth it....tells me they are not getting many ball sales out of the National Tour.

Clint

--------------------
Clint Daley-Owner
Lets Go Bowling Daley
Inside Hunt Club Lanes
Salem, Ohio 44460
TRACK ADVISORY PRO SHOP STAFF

http://www.trackbowling.com/

http://www.startabowlingrevolution.com/

It can also be said that is shows they don't NEED to as well....
--------------------
JEFF
"A Mayhem and a couple of Hercs.......uhm.....Nice!.."

Jeffrevs · « **Reply #29 on:** December 20, 2005, 11:23:46 AM »

quote:
quote:
Everytime I see him on TV, I think he has some disease or something. He looks like he has Downs Syndrome.

Whether he is bowling good or not

No offence to any BR members or their families intended.

Your thinking of Patrick Allen. He looks like he has downs.

Why do people have to bring crap up like this !! This kind of stuff is idiotic!!
GROW UP!
--------------------
JEFF
"A Mayhem and a couple of Hercs.......uhm.....Nice!.."

Nodsleinad · « **Reply #30 on:** December 20, 2005, 11:24:21 AM »

Like i stated ... wether you want to admit it or not... Scroggins has not sold many balls in the last two weeks. Wether the novice or the more advanced players make a purchase after what they see on TV is cloudy. All I can say is from the days of the Yellow Dot to now, balls sales can be judged by the overall marketing package. PBA is one of those tools and no matter what the ads say most bowlers like to see the balls thrown by what they consider the better bowler. Wether that better bowler is your league high average bowler or the PBA, the ball is judged on those factors. He has made Track look horrid. The ball rep should be looked at as well. Can't he get a ball to work on TV with all his experience and access to hundreds of balls and drillings.

Nod

Edited on 12/20/2005 1:16 PM

Author Topic: Track fans have to admit..... (Read 4631 times)

Nodsleinad

Track fans have to admit.....

tenpinspro

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

charlest

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

Buckwild

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

Leftyhi-trak

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

charlest

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

BallsDeep

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

chitown

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

chitown

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

chitown

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

scotts33

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

clintdaley

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

scotts33

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

Jeffrevs

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

Jeffrevs

Re: Track fans have to admit.....

Nodsleinad

Re: Track fans have to admit.....