Author Topic: We have never seen anything like this... (Read 9729 times)

Chief BK · « **on:** July 01, 2009, 06:02:29 AM »

I drilled up my first 930T this past Friday. I opted to go 4x3x3. The reaction shape of this piece is something that we haven't seen. The ball picks up and reads the mids very well. The shocker is at the bottom of the pattern...the ball flies off the spot. The fact that there is no loss of energy with this cover is remarkable. I suspect that this ball will out hook and out hit anything we'll see this year. Those who bought Cells and Virtuals will forget that they ever owned them. This very well could be the Ball Of The Year.

To the gang at the factory...I honestly think we've done it. This is a grand slam piece.

Myself and other Staffers will be reporting back very soon with detailed reviews of the 930T.
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Brian Krantz
Track Staff Member
GM of Blue Ball Lanes - Blue Ball, PA

SKIDSNAP · « **Reply #46 on:** July 14, 2009, 08:25:49 PM »

MItch Mitch Mitch...

So now you are making excuses for Mike's ball reaction (Mike's team won didn't they?) and you are giving the company line regarding what happened on tour last year regarding oil volume and ball choices.

How about this?

Stop making excuses, make some shows and get the balls in the hands of free agents as well. If they work well shops will stock them.

Xcessive_Evil · « **Reply #47 on:** July 14, 2009, 09:27:53 PM »

quote:

I have tested every manufacture's balls in the last year and I can state that the 930T is a bigger ball than the Virtual Gravity for a fact. The reason that Storm dominated the shows on tour is because there was almost no oil on tour last year and their coverstocks are the weakest of any major manufacturer.

Wow, that is a pretty bold statement. I'd like to hear the specifics as to why.
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You may be the better bowler, but my car would blow the doors off of yours.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v690/Phoenix_RsX/Arsenal/

louf846 · « **Reply #48 on:** July 14, 2009, 09:33:28 PM »

And you guys wonder why top tier bowlers tend to refrain from comment on some forums.

I have met Mitch, he is a stand up guy and is very honest. If he says it, he believes it.

He didn't say their balls were only good because there was no oil on tour, I believe the word was dominated. Look at their national staff guys. Those guys have had success through out their career regardless of whose balls they threw.

Best of luck this year on tour Mitch. Thanks for your explanation on Mike's ball reaction. Hope to see you in Indianapolis when the US Open comes to town.
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Louis Franzetti

Track Regional Staff Member

Xcessive_Evil · « **Reply #49 on:** July 14, 2009, 09:50:24 PM »

I'm not attacking him. I think it's great that he's back to posting on hear. I'm not doubting what he, or anyone else says. I just like to know why.

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You may be the better bowler, but my car would blow the doors off of yours.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v690/Phoenix_RsX/Arsenal/

SKIDSNAP · « **Reply #50 on:** July 14, 2009, 10:06:51 PM »

Rob,

Pardon me if I came across as attacking Mitch personally regarding the making shows comment. I meant that the balls need to get on telecasts and shops will be much more open to carrying Track product.

In regards to the "no oil on tour comment" that is garbage!! The only people who have been saying that in public have been sponsored by the same group of companies. It is sour grapes as far as I am concerned. It has to do with surface friction (Ra, Rs etc...). Storm had found a working formula that the other companies had not found.

Who is to say that the new product from other companies have not found a working formula as well.

nospareball · « **Reply #51 on:** July 14, 2009, 10:31:02 PM »

Ok, so lets assume that the 930T outhooks the VG. And lets assume that the reason Storm dominated on tour last year was because of the lack of volume, and they have the weakest covers.

With those two statements being true then why do companies keep making balls stronger and stronger when oil patterns keep getting lighter and lighter? I don't remember ever seeing the VG thrown on tour, just Storms lower end stuff mostly. So if the VG was too strong for the tour patterns, and a typical house pattern is shorter and has less volume than tour patterns then most people would be better off throwing lower end stuff.

I know people will buy it, people always buy oil monsters. But really most would be better off with something that doesn't hook quite as much so they don't end up having to put a 7" pin to pap like Mike did on the telecast to try and get it down the lane.

Just my 2 cents.

Oh, and while I'm here, is this the first ball with a .030 Mass Bias? The highest I can remember is .02x.
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-Clint

DP3 · « **Reply #52 on:** July 14, 2009, 10:45:23 PM »

Maybe storm dominated last year because the best bowlers on tour minus Barnes and Parker were throwing Utah balls?
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-DJ Marshall
just another never was

BKloss · « **Reply #53 on:** July 14, 2009, 10:54:35 PM »

what is the ratio of guys throwing storm/roto/ebonite/track/columbia etc on tour? is that info anywhere?
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SleepOnIce · « **Reply #54 on:** July 14, 2009, 11:07:23 PM »

quote:
In regards to the "no oil on tour comment" that is garbage!! The only people who have been saying that in public have been sponsored by the same group of companies. It is sour grapes as far as I am concerned. It has to do with surface friction (Ra, Rs etc...). Storm had found a working formula that the other companies had not found.

Good, it's not like Mitch was on tour or anything last year. PA also said the same thing on an Xtra frame broadcast, I think the Dick Weber Open, and he is a free agent so it's not like he's promoting a different company.

quote:

Oh, and while I'm here, is this the first ball with a .030 Mass Bias? The highest I can remember is .02x.
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-Clint

The rising line were all .030+, I believe. If you are including other companies a lot of Mo's stuff is at or over .03.
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BLARGH
Rob Stone Supporters of America!

Edit: Quoted the wrong guy

Edited on 7/15/2009 11:56 AM

Chief BK · « **Reply #55 on:** July 14, 2009, 11:16:52 PM »

quote:
How about this?

Stop making excuses, make some shows and get the balls in the hands of free agents as well. If they work well shops will stock them.

Sure sounded like a personal attack to me.
You are correct though...Mike's team did win and he's got a nice chunk of change to show for it.

Most people are here to collect information about bowling equipment. We are here to provide them with accurate information. We are not here to get into a whizzing contest with the general public or to bash other manufacturers in any way.

I started this thread with a very bold yet accurate statement about the 930T. I anticipated a fair amount of discussion about the ball. I did not expect somebody to attack a very accomplished bowler. The fact that he is a Track Staff member has absolutely nothing to do with this response. I think it was a comment that should have been given a little more thought before it was posted.

What Mitch posted was not a "company line". He is correct. I encourage you to watch the tapes and you will see that Mitch's comment about surface and layout are accurate. I also agree with Mitch when he says that a little touch with a 2k pad would have given a much different look.

As for comparing our brand to others, Mitch has done more of that testing than any of us on staff and is more than qualified to provide you with the results.

The bottom line is simple...
We have released factual information. Everybody is entitled their opinion on this info. The only request that I have is that you try it for yourself before forming your opinions. We didn't decide that this ball was the next big thing before we threw it. We gave it a chance, put it through the tests and compared it to the biggest things on the market. If you choose not to believe or agree with what you're being told, that's entirely up to you. Just remember...you can't knock it until you've had it in YOUR hands.
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Track Staff Member
GM of Blue Ball Lanes - Blue Ball, PA

-Practice doesn't make perfect. Practice makes champions!

Edited on 7/14/2009 11:23 PM

Mitch Beasley · « **Reply #56 on:** July 15, 2009, 12:23:13 AM »

If you will read my post I stated that Storm made some really good product and that I liked some of it. I DO NOT give any company crap and if I say it believe that I mean it. I was not making excuses for mike or the equipment I was stating what I saw on the shows from my perspective. If you want to talk about the balls, Drill a 7 inch pin on a virtual gravity, hard shine it and see how well it reacts when you throw it bad.

Tour had less than half of the oil normally found on a house shot last year. The normal house shot has between 80 and 100 units in the front and has about 40 units at 25 feet. Almost all of the patterns we bowled on all year had less than 50 units in the front and dropped to around 8 units around 25 feet. Three times we bowled on less than 40 units. Plus we have over twice the rev rate on tour as league so we rip the oil off the lane 4 times faster than in league. We put the scorpion down to practice and the guys couldn't believe how fast they had start moving left and how much they had to move.

I didn't understand what happens to the lanes on tour until I bowled out there. It is a different world and if you don't understand how the lanes change differently you will die a quick death.

I believe in the equipment and will put it against anything on the market. If I didn't believe in it I wouldn't risk my bowling career with only three balls in production for me to throw.
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Northwest Region PBA
Track Tour Staff

Beasley pro shop

Xcessive_Evil · « **Reply #57 on:** July 15, 2009, 01:11:46 AM »

quote:

I believe in the equipment and will put it against anything on the market. If I didn't believe in it I wouldn't risk my bowling career with only three balls in production for me to throw.
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Northwest Region PBA
Track Tour Staff
Beasley pro shop

I can definitely respect that.
--------------------
You may be the better bowler, but my car would blow the doors off of yours.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v690/Phoenix_RsX/Arsenal/

louf846 · « **Reply #58 on:** July 15, 2009, 07:01:39 AM »

Manufacturers don't make balls for tour. It is less than 1% of the people who will actually be throwing them. Bowling centers continue to place more oil on the lane so the balls continue to be stronger balls.

Some balls just happen to match up really good on tour depending on what they are doing at the time with the patterns. Because a ball is not on every TV show doesn't mean it isn't a great ball for what 99% of the people that would be using it bowl on.
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Louis Franzetti

Track Regional Staff Member

srlunatic · « **Reply #59 on:** July 15, 2009, 03:33:58 PM »

Having been beat many times by Mitch I know he is a complete Animal and can make a white dot do more than I will ever make any ball do.

I am still confused though how any ball could outhook a VG buy a mile. Again the point I was making is that it had seem that there was too much exaggeration and not enough evidence about the new equipment. I just drilled up a Mega Friction by AMF and it is stronger and handles more oil than an Super Carbide Bomb did for me. oOw a 930T is going to *outhook this by a mile* seems like a major exaggeration.

As for the tour. It would seem to me that knowing what the tour conditions have been like the last couple of years, knowing that the high rev rates most tour players have, that of course the lanes will see more friction to combat silly high scores you would see if they were bowling the Shark every week. Storm and Roto Grip and the other big brands have a very good variety of balls out there to combat this. Wes using a Cell Pearl to me says that there had to be some decent amounts of oil in many cases. If you know that the lanes are going to get fried quick and that moving left will be the name of the game, why aren't the Track Guru's helping out Mitch and such with very weak layouts, super high polish and such? This is not a slam against Mitch who I have the utmost respect for, it is more a why isn't the Track Line being delivered in a way that will allow for a wide variety of conditions to be met and to excel on the lesser volumes of oil on tour?

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â€œEvery now and then when your life gets complicated and the weasels start closing in, the only cure is to load up on heinous chemicals and then drive like a b@$tard from Hollywood to Las Vegas ... with the music at top volume and at least a pint of ether.â€

louf846 · « **Reply #60 on:** July 15, 2009, 03:40:39 PM »

Again, balls are not created specifically for tour and you cannot predict tour conditions for the year ahead. The product line is made and delivered to distributors well before the tour season starts. As Mitch has said, the 715A fills a gap in the Track product line. The balls this season are very good and I am looking forward to seeing them on the lanes. The new concept of having an A, C, and T ball eventually in every price point will cover a variety of patterns and volumes. But it takes time to get them all to market. We are not a ball of the month club company.
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Louis Franzetti

Track Regional Staff Member

Author Topic: We have never seen anything like this... (Read 9729 times)

Chief BK

We have never seen anything like this...

SKIDSNAP

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

Xcessive_Evil

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

louf846

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

Xcessive_Evil

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

SKIDSNAP

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

nospareball

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

DP3

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

BKloss

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

SleepOnIce

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

Chief BK

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

Mitch Beasley

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

Xcessive_Evil

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

louf846

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

srlunatic

Re: We have never seen anything like this...

louf846

Re: We have never seen anything like this...