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Author Topic: 2 Handed  (Read 5077 times)

Pinbuster

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2 Handed
« on: August 02, 2017, 05:25:49 PM »
I watched the junior gold some on TV the last 2 weeks.

Both weeks there were at least 1 boy bowling 2 handed but no girls.

I don't believe I have ever seen a 2 handed girl bowler.

Has anyone seen a moderately successful 2 handed girl bowler?

By moderately successful I mean not a very young girl simply rolling the ball with 2 hands and lets say they carry an average of 180 or better.

If there are not any is there a physical reason this is not happening?

 

avabob

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2017, 06:26:19 PM »
Two handed delivery is a more physically demanding move than traditional delivery that can make use of leverage and gravity to create ball speed.  Not saying you won't see women develop this release, but you don't see many women power players with one hand either. 

Roller

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2017, 07:53:34 PM »
 I always add a "yet" with things like this. As conditioning continues to improve for athletes of all kinds, I would bet we will start to see them in the junior ranks first. One place I bowl at has practice of the nearby boys' and girls' high school teams before our league starts, and you see some of their girls playing around with the powerful two hand technique, but then they usually go back to the one hand. Eventually, some will stay with it more than just as a part time experiment, and they will score highly with it, and make it stay, I believe.

bergman

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2017, 07:30:09 PM »
I believe that in the very near future, we will be seeing more and more 2-handed bowlers coming out of the boys' junior ranks. We are seeing this trend shaping up already. In time, we will see this trend emerge among the girls' divisions too, but to a lesser degree, due to the physical demands required to master the 2 handed style.



 

spmcgivern

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2017, 08:22:21 PM »
There is a woman bowler here in maybe her mid 50s that is attempting to throw two-handed (and lefty at that).  It isn't the prettiest thing in the world, but she completes her 3 games without much issue.  Ball does tend to roll out, but it is a genuine effort and perhaps better than what I could attempt (assuming I don't kill myself on my first attempt).

northface28

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2017, 09:57:27 PM »
Just wait, they're coming.
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milorafferty

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2017, 11:11:57 PM »
We have a young lady in this area who is decent as a two hander.  If she wanted it, she could be really good, but She hasn't made a real effort to improve.
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Luke Rosdahl

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2017, 07:12:10 AM »
I'd believe there will eventually be some, but when you look at girls bowling in high school and college, there aren't a lot of high rev rates.  High rev rates can suffer or get you into trouble when you are dealing with the kind of carrydown that straighter games create.  Plus it puts you in a part of the lane no one else is in and it can take a long time for a shot to develop if you're just working it by yourself, so a higher rev rate wouldn't necessarily be a benefit in high school or college.  In a mixed league or tournament environment, sure, but when just bowling against other females, I'd work on my straight game. 
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spmcgivern

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2017, 08:49:09 AM »
I'd believe there will eventually be some, but when you look at girls bowling in high school and college, there aren't a lot of high rev rates.  High rev rates can suffer or get you into trouble when you are dealing with the kind of carrydown that straighter games create.  Plus it puts you in a part of the lane no one else is in and it can take a long time for a shot to develop if you're just working it by yourself, so a higher rev rate wouldn't necessarily be a benefit in high school or college.  In a mixed league or tournament environment, sure, but when just bowling against other females, I'd work on my straight game. 

Historically I would agree.  But just one look at the PWBA this year you will see more and more women (especially foreign) generating the revolutions and overall game similar to men.  They aren't Belmo or the such, but the are significantly more than Duke which is what women were in the past. 

Then again, Liz just won AGAIN so straight is still successful for the women.

Luke Rosdahl

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2017, 09:18:22 AM »
PWBA is a different animal, that's why I didn't mention it.  Speaking just high school and college specifically, not saying higher rev rates can't succeed, just not the norm and would have to have several members of a team working together, I.E. Daria Pajak and Verity Crawley. 

Speaking of PWBA though, Daria fought the transition on the show that had been created by the straighter bowlers.  Nothing would shape up right for her due to the carrydown in the middle of the track.  Top seed was a bad place for her to be.  I think if Liz and Daria's positions had been switched, Daria wins the tournament. 

I know this is true of any situation, not just male or female, but male game is majority high rev, female game is majority low rev, and taking advantage of your environment is key.  Men compete in a majority track burn environment, women compete in a majority carrydown environment.  I wouldn't advise a woman to use a two handed style if they plan on bowling in high school, college, and then professionally, I'd stick them with a crapload of tape on Liz Johnson and say pay attention.  Guys I would show a lot of Belmo.  Just recreational bowling though?  Do whatever. 

I'd believe there will eventually be some, but when you look at girls bowling in high school and college, there aren't a lot of high rev rates.  High rev rates can suffer or get you into trouble when you are dealing with the kind of carrydown that straighter games create.  Plus it puts you in a part of the lane no one else is in and it can take a long time for a shot to develop if you're just working it by yourself, so a higher rev rate wouldn't necessarily be a benefit in high school or college.  In a mixed league or tournament environment, sure, but when just bowling against other females, I'd work on my straight game. 

Historically I would agree.  But just one look at the PWBA this year you will see more and more women (especially foreign) generating the revolutions and overall game similar to men.  They aren't Belmo or the such, but the are significantly more than Duke which is what women were in the past. 

Then again, Liz just won AGAIN so straight is still successful for the women.
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milorafferty

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2017, 09:29:39 AM »
Does no one remember Belmo? He (almost single handed) changed the game, now we are seeing a lot of two hand bowling at the PBA level. The first lady to be effective with a high rev, high speed, two handed style will dominate the PWBA, just like Belmo.
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Luke Rosdahl

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2017, 09:53:07 AM »
Depends on environment.  PBA is already a high rev high speed environment, he found a way to increase both power and control, that's why he's dominating.  The key word you said was effective.  I'm not sure that speed and power is the way to overcome a high carrydown environment.  Daria got virtually blocked out after 3 games of straight up the lane play.  Maybe if one gets good with urethane though . .

Does no one remember Belmo? He (almost single handed) changed the game, now we are seeing a lot of two hand bowling at the PBA level. The first lady to be effective with a high rev, high speed, two handed style will dominate the PWBA, just like Belmo.
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avabob

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2017, 10:10:45 AM »
It is really about being able to over power a condition with speed and revs as opposed to playing the pattern .  Women are in much the same situation as us seniors bowling senior only tourneys.  Particularly on long patterns.  Women and seniors will both be more successful playing straighter and letting the pattern open up as they make parallel moves.  Interestingly even the high rev young guys are attacking long patterns much straighter than they did just a couple of years ago.  The difference is they open the pattern up much quicker, and get forced much deeper. 

HackJandy

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2017, 10:53:33 AM »
>Maybe if one gets good with urethane though . .

You can go pretty far playing straight even one handed with urethane.  Maybe not PBA level but can definitely crush local 2 handed house hacks anyway especially on tough sport patterns.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2017, 10:56:40 AM by HackJandy »
Kind of noob when made this account so take advice with grain of salt.

avabob

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Re: 2 Handed
« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2017, 11:01:24 AM »
2 handed will continue to grow, but I don't think it will dominate the game.  Beside being more physically demanding there are other subtleties.  One thing that makes Bello successful is his ability to change axis rotation.