Author Topic: Invasion not what I expected (Read 13112 times)

nmbr1sun99 · « **on:** January 31, 2010, 06:12:09 AM »

I recently got my Invasion... Drilled it 4x4x1 as noted for hi rev and speed bowler. The ball is barely having any reaction. Took the surface down to 2000 and it had some life. I am now debating taking the surface down to 1000.

Any suggestions before I contact Storm?

I purchased the ball for use on heavy oil PBA pattern and tournament patterns. Now is the time I need this ball. I can't afford to wait for a replacement.

icewall · « **Reply #16 on:** February 01, 2010, 07:37:23 AM »

quote:
Despite what so many people think, strong balls do not mean a lot of hook. They mean a lot of roll. You need an exceptional amount of oil to take advantage of a strong ball with a strong drilling on it, because otherwise the ball will burn up all of its energy in the front part of the lane. Even without seeing you throw the ball, I'm 99% certain you're not retaining energy for later in the lane, and that's why the ball isn't reacting well. Polish your Invasion and see if it rolls better. If not, try plugging and redrilling with a much weaker layout to get it through the front part of the lane. Otherwise, you may just be using the wrong ball. Something with a weaker core and coverstock will probably suffice.

(Real world example: I have a Mutant Cell that I've only got about 10 games on total because it's just too damn strong for its own good, and I even had to redrill it to make it more useful because it was going to require an absolute flood in the front part of the lane to have anything left on the backend. And bear in mind I only have about a 250rpm rev rate, so usually I do well with stronger equipment, but still prefer weak layouts and I can very rarely ever use anything duller than 2000 abralon)

+1

Pozz · « **Reply #17 on:** February 01, 2010, 10:31:34 AM »

Okay guys, so here comes a dumb question. What kind of weak layout are we talking. I have my VG stacked with the pin up a bit for some length and I struggled to get it to turn. I don't want to make the same mistake with my Invasion. I would say I am a tweener with about 300 to 350 revs and about 16 to 17 mph. What do you guys think would be a good layout?

OddBalls · « **Reply #18 on:** February 01, 2010, 10:38:16 AM »

quote:
Despite what so many people think, strong balls do not mean a lot of hook. They mean a lot of roll. You need an exceptional amount of oil to take advantage of a strong ball with a strong drilling on it, because otherwise the ball will burn up all of its energy in the front part of the lane. Even without seeing you throw the ball, I'm 99% certain you're not retaining energy for later in the lane, and that's why the ball isn't reacting well. Polish your Invasion and see if it rolls better. If not, try plugging and redrilling with a much weaker layout to get it through the front part of the lane. Otherwise, you may just be using the wrong ball. Something with a weaker core and coverstock will probably suffice.

(Real world example: I have a Mutant Cell that I've only got about 10 games on total because it's just too damn strong for its own good, and I even had to redrill it to make it more useful because it was going to require an absolute flood in the front part of the lane to have anything left on the backend. And bear in mind I only have about a 250rpm rev rate, so usually I do well with stronger equipment, but still prefer weak layouts and I can very rarely ever use anything duller than 2000 abralon)

Agreed..

If you don't have the oil to handle this ball, it will be DOA at the pins due to roll out..

Biggest clue os to take a benchmark ball and throw it on the same lane condition. If that ball hooks, and your"hook monster" doesn't, you have your answer. Not enough oil...

--------------------
Yes. it's I, the Inverted One..

OddBalls · « **Reply #19 on:** February 01, 2010, 10:40:25 AM »

quote:
Okay guys, so here comes a dumb question. What kind of weak layout are we talking. I have my VG stacked with the pin up a bit for some length and I struggled to get it to turn. I don't want to make the same mistake with my Invasion. I would say I am a tweener with about 300 to 350 revs and about 16 to 17 mph. What do you guys think would be a good layout?

How and when do you want to use it?

This looks likea heavy oil "queen" all the way..

Go 5" ptp with the mb just right of your thumb, wieght hole as needed.
--------------------
Yes. it's I, the Inverted One..

joblo1978 · « **Reply #20 on:** February 01, 2010, 10:49:00 AM »

Yeah, sounds like you bowled on toast.

I'm getting so damn sick and tired of paying money to bowl on crap lanes!

Strong ball + strong layout - oil = No hook

Your bowling balls can only store enough energy to hook once, and with oil, that will be on the backend. I love it when they hook at your feet.

With the ball being new, you prbably haven't learned the visual cues that it's trying to give you.

Not to mention that generally, these tests of different layouts, surfaces, and just video reviews for new balls in general are filmed on better than average conditions. So don't be too shocked when you roll your new ball you've been waiting for for months to find it has no hook.

Personally, I wouldn't put a 4x4 on an invasion, that's damn near a stacked leverage drilling, good luck finding oil for that beast.
--------------------
-John B.
734 high series, 278 high game

Really enjoyin' the Virtual Energy and Mutant Cell right now

Mr Straight Ball · « **Reply #21 on:** February 01, 2010, 11:30:58 AM »

@nmbr1sun99: I just want to ask what I have seen on any of these post unless I missed it. Why did you choose a layout that has a note that says easy to get through the heads?

Sounds like the ball is doing what the drill sheet describes. Have not thrown mine enough to give a review but the pin is 1" above the fingers on the center line with the "Lighting" 3" right of my thumb w/ no hole. It is more than aggressive for me.
--------------------
Bakes...Why is the 9-pin standing?
40 Boards & A Ball - www.40boards.com
Is your Ball ready to cross 40 Boards?
40 Boards is proudly supported by Storm Products & Stepp's Glen Burnie Pro Shop

jls · « **Reply #22 on:** February 01, 2010, 01:22:12 PM »

quote:
Yes, contact Storm ASAP so they can tell you what Surface & drilling you needed. Personaly, I'd say either your ball is getting too much friction too early or Storm sent you a DUD covered Invasion.
--------------------
Seahawks Fan!

WHAT...........

Storm sent you a "dud"

Where to keyboard pounders come up with this CRAP..........

Unbelievable the CRAP that keyboard pounders POST...........

"Storm sent you a dud covered Invasion"

What a stupid comment, by a keyboard pounder....

--------------------
jls "Obama, you wanna see my truck"

Motogp69 · « **Reply #23 on:** February 01, 2010, 02:37:02 PM »

quote:
reign of fire is an arcy ball at best...not even close to skid/flip. Ball rolls continuously through the lane. As for invasion that ball needs oil. I would be very reluctant to drill the invasion with a strong layout. I feel with the stronger asymmetric cores depending on a persons axis measurements I would put the pin at least 5" from axis. Now polished you probably go stronger on the layout. I haven''t drilled mine yet (invasion or reign of fire) but will soon.

You make a comment about a how a ball rolls on something you haven''t drilled or thrown yet. I''ve thrown the Reign of Fire, and it flips plenty. Way more than the Invasion. The Invasion has the sickest amount of roll I''ve ever seen in a ball though. I hope they make it in a hybrid.
--------------------
Videos at:
http://youtube.com/user/Gsnap21

"The framers of our Constitution believed that if the people were to be sovereign and belong to different religions at the same time then our official religion would have to be no religion at all. It was a bold experiment then as it is now. It wasn''t meant to make us comfortable, it was meant to make us free."

Edited on 2/1/2010 3:37 PM

nmbr1sun99 · « **Reply #24 on:** February 01, 2010, 02:55:50 PM »

It was either this or 4x4x2... Hi Rev and speed. According to Storm's layouts and graphs it was up to these 2. SO my guy that drills my equipment and I decided on the 4x4x1

quote:
@nmbr1sun99: I just want to ask what I have seen on any of these post unless I missed it. Why did you choose a layout that has a note that says easy to get through the heads?

Sounds like the ball is doing what the drill sheet describes. Have not thrown mine enough to give a review but the pin is 1" above the fingers on the center line with the "Lighting" 3" right of my thumb w/ no hole. It is more than aggressive for me.
--------------------
Bakes...Why is the 9-pin standing?
40 Boards & A Ball - www.40boards.com
Is your Ball ready to cross 40 Boards?
40 Boards is proudly supported by Storm Products & Stepp's Glen Burnie Pro Shop

tburky · « **Reply #25 on:** February 01, 2010, 03:21:08 PM »

quote:
quote:
reign of fire is an arcy ball at best...not even close to skid/flip. Ball rolls continuously through the lane. As for invasion that ball needs oil. I would be very reluctant to drill the invasion with a strong layout. I feel with the stronger asymmetric cores depending on a persons axis measurements I would put the pin at least 5" from axis. Now polished you probably go stronger on the layout. I haven''''t drilled mine yet (invasion or reign of fire) but will soon.

You make a comment about a how a ball rolls on something you haven''''t drilled or thrown yet. I''''ve thrown the Reign of Fire, and it flips plenty. Way more than the Invasion. The Invasion has the sickest amount of roll I''''ve ever seen in a ball though. I hope they make it in a hybrid.
--------------------
Videos at:
http://youtube.com/user/Gsnap21

"The framers of our Constitution believed that if the people were to be sovereign and belong to different religions at the same time then our official religion would have to be no religion at all. It was a bold experiment then as it is now. It wasn''''t meant to make us comfortable, it was meant to make us free."

Edited on 2/1/2010 3:37 PM

for the record i have thrown both balls that did not belong to me. In fact i threw about 16 games each. Both balls roll well as long as there is oil. My rev rate is between 300-325.

Edited on 2/1/2010 4:23 PM

LotsaBalls · « **Reply #26 on:** February 01, 2010, 03:44:47 PM »

Is it possible the ball is over flaring, that ball is just about maxed out with that layout and you say you have a high rev rate. I know that I could not drill that ball that strong for myself.

River700 · « **Reply #27 on:** February 01, 2010, 04:10:14 PM »

quote:
It was either this or 4x4x2... Hi Rev and speed. According to Storm's layouts and graphs it was up to these 2. SO my guy that drills my equipment and I decided on the 4x4x1

quote:
@nmbr1sun99: I just want to ask what I have seen on any of these post unless I missed it. Why did you choose a layout that has a note that says easy to get through the heads?

Sounds like the ball is doing what the drill sheet describes. Have not thrown mine enough to give a review but the pin is 1" above the fingers on the center line with the "Lighting" 3" right of my thumb w/ no hole. It is more than aggressive for me.
--------------------
Bakes...Why is the 9-pin standing?
40 Boards & A Ball - www.40boards.com
Is your Ball ready to cross 40 Boards?
40 Boards is proudly supported by Storm Products & Stepp's Glen Burnie Pro Shop

nmbr1sun99, since you are a higher rev and speed bowler, like everyone else has said drilling a ball like the invasion 4 x 4 is going to burn up obviously. If you are able to, I would either redrill your invasion 5 x 5 x 1 1/2 - 2 inch pin buffer pin up or you could even do a 5 x 5 x 3 1/2 inch pin buffer pin down. With using these types of layouts, you can add surface like 2k or 1k and the ball will still tip on the back end. Even with a 5 - 5 1/2 pin to pap, the ball will still flare at least 5 inches, maybe 6 which is plenty.
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Bowling is fun, enjoy it, don't hate it

David Lee Yskes · « **Reply #28 on:** February 01, 2010, 05:16:22 PM »

goto my Bowlspace page and you'll see a good layout for a VG or invasion...

I have my VG drilled up weak, yet the ball hooks like a monster...
--------------------
" Lift Your Skirt Grab Your Balls and Learn How to Bowl " http://coolluvr4u1976.bowlspace.com/

For my vids on youtube - search coolluvr4u1976

Bigmike · « **Reply #29 on:** February 02, 2010, 10:14:56 AM »

I've had both of them (Invasion and ROF) for about two weeks now. I haven't had a chance to drill them as have had no time and the center I bowl in has the heads break down so quickly these would just sit on the rack all night.

My experience with the predecessor, Virtual Gravity, was that weaker layouts with a stronger MB position were golden. I drilled my VG with the pin 5 1/4 from PAP (put pin directly over my bridge) and VG mark at a 70* angle (about 1-2" right of thumb). I have a modest rev rate close to 300 and with what should be a weaker layout, the VG flared almost 4-5".

I plan on drilling my Invasion the same way. Sometimes a weaker pin position with a stronger MB layout is perfect for these strong coverstock/core combos just to keep them from using all of the energy in the front part of the lane.
--------------------
"Why don't you call me sometime.....when you have no class" ~~Rodney Dangerfield to Sally Kellerman, his college professor in Back to School ~~1986

Mike Craig - Storm Products Pro Shop staff -Columbus, OH

tommygn · « **Reply #30 on:** February 02, 2010, 12:34:24 PM »

This ball has a very strong core and cover. This doesn't always translate into the most left to right movement. This ball retains its motion through a variety of different lane conditions, more so than any other ball I have used. Please see my review of the Invasion for more details.
--------------------
Tommy Gollick
Storm Regional/Pro Shop staff
Red Crown Pro Shop Harrisburg, PA
stormbowling.com

Author Topic: Invasion not what I expected (Read 13112 times)

nmbr1sun99

Invasion not what I expected

icewall

Re: Invasion not what I expected

Pozz

Re: Invasion not what I expected

OddBalls

Re: Invasion not what I expected

OddBalls

Re: Invasion not what I expected

joblo1978

Re: Invasion not what I expected

Mr Straight Ball

Re: Invasion not what I expected

jls

Re: Invasion not what I expected

Motogp69

Re: Invasion not what I expected

nmbr1sun99

Re: Invasion not what I expected

tburky

Re: Invasion not what I expected

LotsaBalls

Re: Invasion not what I expected

River700

Re: Invasion not what I expected

David Lee Yskes

Re: Invasion not what I expected

Bigmike

Re: Invasion not what I expected

tommygn

Re: Invasion not what I expected