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Author Topic: Rules question  (Read 10183 times)

Rick Wunder

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Rules question
« on: August 13, 2009, 12:38:11 AM »
This happened in our league last night:

A bowler is up on lane 13.  During his approach, he falls on the approach, losing his ball off his hand.  He fell and landed way short of the foul line.  His ball rolled across the approach toward lane 14, and eventually found its way into the right gutter on lane 14.  The ball eventually ended up going all the way down lane 14 (gutter), causing the pinspotter to cycle and return his ball.

We concluded that since the ball left his hand and rolled across the foul line that he had made a legal (if unorthodox) delivery.  We considered the possibility that it should be considered a gutter ball and he should get zero on that ball (his first ball of the frame).  After further consideration, and consulting the USBC rule book, we reconsidered, determining that he had "bowled" on the wrong lane, so therefore it was a dead ball and should be taken over again.

What do the rest of you think the ruling should have been?

We have e-mailed the USBC and I'll post the results when I hear them.
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AngloBowler

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2009, 08:42:36 AM »
Sounds like you ended up with the right call. One way or another, he did actually bowl on the wrong lane.
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Urethane Game

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2009, 08:53:06 AM »
I think he gets zero.  I believe the foul line extends beyond the lane he was bowling on.  The ball crossed the foul line even though it was not on his lane.
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Phoneman

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2009, 09:21:51 AM »
I would agree that it should be considered bowling on the wrong lane and thus he gets a redo.  If it had gone down the lane he was bowling on it would be considered a gutter ball.

azguy

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2009, 10:08:19 AM »
True the foul line extends from ground to the moon, sort of, and side to side from wall to wall, however, as you stated, he bowled on the wrong lane ( sort of ) and IMO you made the right call in the end.
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DanH78

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2009, 10:16:17 AM »
Dead ball.
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Urethane Game

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2009, 10:18:39 AM »
He was on the proper approach.  While it is unfortunate that he fell, he did make a legal delivery.  The ball was released from his hand and crossed the foul line.  I don't believe that where the ball ended up has any bearing.
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michelle

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2009, 10:41:50 AM »
To carry the unfortunate result of a legal delivery argument to a different hypothetical...

Bowler for Lane #14 is having to loft the caps.  They are sliding on the approach of Lane #13 but for some reason they over-loft and the ball lands the gutter caps halfway down the lane between Lane #14 and Lane #15.  Lane #15 then cycles when the ball eventually makes its way to the pins.  

The obvious intent was to place the shot onto Lane #14.  The unorthodox delivery commenced on Lane #13.  However, the shot concludes on Lane #15.  

Based on some of the theories advanced in this thread, it would be a dead ball.  

Discuss...

JohnP

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2009, 10:57:17 AM »
Re: original situation.  I think it's a dead ball.  You're right in asking USBC for a ruling, and should have (and perhaps did) have the player bowl a provisional frame.  Bowl it on lane 13.  If USBC rules its a dead ball, the whole frame counts.  If they rule he gets 0 count on the ball, only the first ball of the provisional frame counts.  If he knocks all the pins down, it's a spare - otherwise he gets the pin count after 0 for the first ball.  --  JohnP

shelley

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2009, 11:02:57 AM »
I agree with the dead ball.  Let him get up, wash his hands, and bowl on the correct lane.

SH

inconsistent 1

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2009, 11:07:10 AM »
Use common sense! Obviously he didn't throw his ball, it sailed out of his hand as he fell on the lane. Either a dead ball or a wrong lane do-over.

catbert

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2009, 11:16:30 AM »
It will be interesting to see what the USBC has to say about this particular case, AFAIK there is no rule about standing in one approach and delivering the ball in another lane, the ball ended up in a different lane so to me it's dead ball it has to be replayed.

=)

But this is my best guess...
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mumzie

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2009, 01:21:08 PM »
Dead ball - since he didn't foul. If he'd fouled, it would have been 0 for the first ball.
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pnj1967

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2009, 01:25:46 PM »
Correct.

quote:
Use common sense! Obviously he didn't throw his ball, it sailed out of his hand as he fell on the lane. Either a dead ball or a wrong lane do-over.

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J_w73

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Re: Rules question
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2009, 02:10:59 PM »
quote:
Use common sense! Obviously he didn't throw his ball, it sailed out of his hand as he fell on the lane. Either a dead ball or a wrong lane do-over.


Rules are rules and don't always follow common sense or sympathy.
If he fell and the ball fell out of his hand and crossed the foul line on the intended lane then the delivery would count.  He might have got lucky in the fact that the ball went down the wrong lane.  
It will be interesting to see USBC's response.  Hopefully they make a clear cut decision as all facts seem to be there.  From my experience they don't like to make set decisions even though it is their rule book.
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