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Author Topic: Your scoring opinion.  (Read 1650 times)

DerHornen

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Your scoring opinion.
« on: December 11, 2006, 02:17:18 PM »
Lots of posts on here lately about scoring.  Many say it is too high, others saying it's just fine.  I'm interested in seeing the opinions of some of you here on BR.

What, in YOUR opinion, is the scoring like?

For those who believe scoring is too high:  Has scoring gotten so easy that you feel you have no significant advantage over bowlers of lesser skill?

For those that don't feel scores are too high:  Are the people calling for tougher scoring conditions just taking themselves too seriously?

 

Danes07

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2006, 10:22:30 PM »
I know its probably not good for TV, but I would prefer to see tougher scoring conditions.  I want to the see the pro's really showcasing whey they are out there bowling on the Pro Tour...the ability to make good shots, play the lanes the right way and repeat shots.  I want to see them get punished if they throw a bad shot....not get away with having so much bump room.
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TTforshort

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2006, 11:36:07 PM »
I have to agree with Bones. In our house, scores are probably low. The entire men's league average is 162.25.

TT
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Brandon Riley

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2006, 01:46:53 AM »
I don't think DerHornen was talking about TV.  I think he was talking about league bowling.  This is an everlasting battle but I think the one thing that hasn't been looked at is why people bowl league.
League offers 2 things:
1) Community
2) A place to compete.
Now even though I'll be smitten for saying this here on BR the vast majority of people who bowl league are not competitive.  They are there to socialize, drink beer and have fun with their friends.  Let them bowl on house shots and feel good.  It results in more revenue for the bowling alley and keeps people happy.

For those who are serious about their league and want to improve and take bowling seriously (90% of the people posting here on this forum) should be bowling on PBA patterns.  This would provide challenge, credibility and a standard as far as the conditions put out and scoring pace.  

We just need to make that distinction.  Proprietors should also make that distinction when they set up their leagues.  Define that this is a scratch league with tougher pba patterns.  And if you ave 200 then thats good and very credible because people all over the world are bowling on the same patterns as you and its fair.  If you ave 160, then you see how much you need to improve to become good.  And those people who are happy averaging 230 on a wall can continue doing that on their easy pattern while drinking beer and having fun.  Its about catering to everybody by having different options.  Its the only way to make people happy.
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inslyx

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2006, 01:49:51 AM »
I just recently started back up after about 5 years off. I don't think it's any easier now, or maybe I just got worse, but so far I was bowling much better and consistently before.  If anything today I think the newer equipment has gotten too confusing for most, relying on the ball and type and all that, instead of focusing on reading the lanes and making a good and consistent shot.

But, what do I know?

Pinbuster

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2006, 06:18:04 AM »
League scores are way too high.

One of the problems in a score fest is where one bad break on carry makes the difference between losing and winning.  

Second easy conditions do not punish bad shots enough. Balls thrown 2 or 3 boards either side of your target should not hit the pocket.

Easy conditions make converting spares easier as well. I would much rather be shooting at single pin spares than clusters of pins. Most bad shots still find the pocket they just don’t carry.

While the cream still rises to the top it is easier for a skilled bowler to distance themselves and win consistently on tougher but fair conditions.

It would be interesting to know the statistics but in a higher scoring environment scoring becomes volatile.

Lets take 220 versus 210 on a high scoring environment the 220 will probably win 65% of the time.

But I would think on a tougher scoring environment they would win 75% of the time.  


 

 

Fluff E Bunnie

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2006, 06:52:02 AM »
Personally, I would like to see it maybe a bit harder across the board because I would like to see the people who can pick up splits and convert all of their spares win out.

But that goes back to accuracy over power and that isn't the fad.

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se7en

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2006, 07:09:52 AM »
It's hard for me to relate to those who argue they are too high because my house is tough to carry in. The next house over here, however, I enjoy the scoring pace in practice(never bowled league there), and always see new 800/300 scores on the wall. I can't remember the last time I saw a 300 shot. I've banged 299 twice and the house's high average shot 297 a couple weeks ago, so I know it's possible, just not probable ;p
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Splitz

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2006, 07:17:33 AM »
Scores, league and on the pro tour are just plain stupid!  

Who wants to see games where if you leave a pin standing you lose?  

My friends and I watched the tour on Saturdays religiously many years ago, as in the 70's.  We fought for control of the TV in the dorm common room with the football junkies and usually the bowlers won out.  We were watching the bowlers like hawks viewing a wounded rabbit trying to pick up any little tip that could help us.  You think that would happen today?  What can you learn from seeing someone throw nothing but strikes?  Where does the skill come in adjusting to conditions when there is a highway to the pocket with a 80mph speed limit?

I remember in the mid 70's when a person shot 300 in a league, usually with a few crossovers thrown in, it was a once in a blue moon event.  People celebrated the score because you might not get to see one again for years.  High score for the house for the year might just barely scratch 700.  700 was practically the unreachable goal!  Now, same house, if there aren't 2 or 3 700's for 40 bowlers on one shift everyone is complaining about how the lanes were "screwed up".  

Where do you go once someone shoots back to back 800's or hits 900?  What thrill is there in seeing your 10th 300 game of the season?  There isn't anywhere to go.  There isn't anything special anymore.  When perfection becomes the norm you have nothing to look forward to except failure, lots of fun,eh?

michelle

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2006, 07:35:56 AM »
It is not the scores themselves that is the issue but rather the fact that conditions have meant that shot-making plays no real meaningful role in getting those scores.  

Once that is recognized, people would grasp a little easier why it has been easy for me to go more than seven months without having thrown a ball and not miss league in the least...

DerHornen

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2006, 07:57:39 AM »
quote:

For those who are serious about their league and want to improve and take bowling seriously (90% of the people posting here on this forum) should be bowling on PBA patterns.  This would provide challenge, credibility and a standard as far as the conditions put out and scoring pace.  

We just need to make that distinction.  Proprietors should also make that distinction when they set up their leagues.  Define that this is a scratch league with tougher pba patterns.  And if you ave 200 then thats good and very credible because people all over the world are bowling on the same patterns as you and its fair.  If you ave 160, then you see how much you need to improve to become good.  And those people who are happy averaging 230 on a wall can continue doing that on their easy pattern while drinking beer and having fun.  Its about catering to everybody by having different options.  Its the only way to make people happy.


That's a good point.  Let the league bowlers have their walls, and let the competitive bowlers have their sport shots.  I think we're still seeing the growing pains of changing the game so that the two "types" of bowlers can each get what they want.

I really don't know what to say about PBA scoring.  I agree that it's difficult to watch matches where leaving one ringing 10 in a game causes a guy to lose. I'll leave it up to the PBA to decide if they need those strike strings to get ratings.

BAPSBill

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2006, 08:17:47 AM »
Even Norm Duke called the cheeta pattern last week "Adult bumber bowling" during the telecast.And Randy said "well you did bowl this week ,Didn't you?"
Sort of agreeing (but also asking why didn't you bowl better?)

BapsBill

janderson

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2006, 09:58:15 AM »
Take into consideration that there is a bowler who claims to have bowled not 1, not 2, but 5 perfect 900 series in a six month period of time...and there are people who believe it to be true.

Scores simply reflect the conditions on which we bowl.
Scores alone are no longer an accurate measuring stick for bowling skill on many common conditions found today.

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Edited on 12/12/2006 11:00 AM

Phoneman

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2006, 10:13:50 AM »
My opinion is not that the scores are too high...The scores are up for everyone the better bowlers are now at 235 and up the average bowler is 210-235.  Joe Nobody will average the low 200s.  Whats the big deal.  Everybody is up the same amount.  My average has gone from 202 in 1990 to 225 today.  I dont feel I am any better but the equipment and lanes make my score higher.  Big deal...I am still getting beat by the same guys I did 15 years ago and I still beat the others.  Bowlers arn't any better the scale has just moved to the right a bit.  It is the same scale.  Thats why in handicapped leagues most handicaps are based on 235 or 240 not 200 or 210 back in the 90s.

janderson

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Re: Your scoring opinion.
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2006, 10:16:53 AM »
quote:
The scores are up for everyone the better bowlers are now at 235 and up the average bowler is 210-235.


Actually, the average bowler, according to the USBC who has the stats, is in the 170's.

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