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Author Topic: what would you do 2..  (Read 6554 times)

J_w73

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what would you do 2..
« on: March 04, 2009, 05:08:03 AM »
didn't want to hijack drilllords thread so I started my own..
I was in a similar situation when a guy threw a 300 and when his ball struck he fell to his knees and slammed his elbows/arms onto the approach in celebration.. his elbows where not over the line but his hands/wrists were definately over the line but from my angle I could not tell if they touched the approach...since I wasn't completely positive they touched the approach I didn't bring it up..
If I did see them hit the approach I'm not sure what I would have done.  That would be the ultimate D*ck move to take away someones 300 but a rule is a rule.. I think I would have said something.
What would you do??
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Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180

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Carlos Colon

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2009, 01:13:32 PM »
Agreed. You would be the ultimate d*ck.
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JessN16

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2009, 01:14:30 PM »
If his hands/arms were over the line but didn't touch the ground, it's not a foul. If that were a foul, you'd have to stop 5 feet in front of the foul line when you released the ball so that your hand didn't cross the line, vertically extended to the ceiling.

As to whether it would be a foul even if he did, I'll have to look at the rule book to see when the frame is technically over. Is it over once the ball has gone off the back of the lane and is now a "dead ball?" If it is, that might mean it wasn't a foul after all (similar to me throwing a shot, waiting 2 minutes, then walking back up to the foul line and stepping on it), but then again, most intentional fouls are committed after someone sees their result. So I don't know.

Either way, in that situation, I'm not saying a word other than "congratulations."

Jess
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J_w73

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2009, 01:19:05 PM »
I don't think time is a factor.. I remember in another post someone was talking about a european team tourney where they guy made the last strike they won.. and the guy stepped on the foul line in celebration and the other team called a foul..
I believe the the USBC book says something about it being "live"(my word not USBC) until the next bowler bowls.. in the case of the anchor bowler during the last game I do not know what the cut off would be.
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16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180



Edited on 3/4/2009 2:22 PM

Edited on 3/4/2009 2:22 PM
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JessN16

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2009, 01:22:58 PM »
quote:
I don't think time is a factor.. I remember in another post someone was talking about a european team tourney where they guy made the last strike they won.. and then his team came up and congratulated and jumped around and the guy stepped on the foul line while celebrating and the other team called a foul..
I believe the the USBC book says something about it being "live"(my word not USBC) until the next bowler bowls.. in the case of the anchor bowler during the last game I do not know what the cut off would be.
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16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180



That's the thing. If you're the last bowler on the team throwing the last ball of the game, the game is technically over once your ball goes dead, which is typically defined as the point the ball rolls off the back of the lane and into the pit.

Jess
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pin-chaser

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2009, 01:26:07 PM »
Definition of a Foul
Rule 5a. A foul occurs when a part of the player’s body encroaches on or goes beyond the foul line
and touches any part of the lane, equipment or building during or after a delivery. A ball is in play after a
delivery until the same or another player is on the approach in position to make a succeeding delivery.

I would hate to call this in this situation... but the rule is clear. If the guy had morals he would call it on himself if it happened. This is a tough one for sure.
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J_w73

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2009, 01:31:01 PM »
yeah.. you beat me to the rule..

says nothing about the end of the game, last bowler, ball going off the deck.



Edited on 3/4/2009 2:32 PM
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J_w73

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2009, 01:34:52 PM »
quote:
Definition of a Foul
Rule 5a. A foul occurs when a part of the player’s body encroaches on or goes beyond the foul line
and touches any part of the lane, equipment or building during or after a delivery. A ball is in play after a
delivery until the same or another player is on the approach in position to make a succeeding delivery.

I would hate to call this in this situation... but the rule is clear. If the guy had morals he would call it on himself if it happened. This is a tough one for sure.

like I said.. I wasn't for sure if he touched the lane but I'm sure he would have no clue either as he wasn't thinking properly. just excited..  I wouldn't be anywhere near the foul line after my 12th strike..
--------------------
16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180

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no300tj

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2009, 02:13:48 PM »
Even if he ran down the lane and took a pin from the next rack set, I wouldn't call foul on him. The way that rule reads, if the next guy is at the bar, the previous bowler could foul 2-3 minutes after he rolled his last shot. No foul ,game over.
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Kid Jete

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2009, 02:18:21 PM »
quote:
Definition of a Foul
Rule 5a. A foul occurs when a part of the player’s body encroaches on or goes beyond the foul line
and touches any part of the lane, equipment or building during or after a delivery. A ball is in play after a
delivery until the same or another player is on the approach in position to make a succeeding delivery.

I would hate to call this in this situation... but the rule is clear. If the guy had morals he would call it on himself if it happened. This is a tough one for sure.


IF THE GUY HAD MORALS?  ARE YOU KIDDING ME?  

That might be the most ignorant thing I have ever heard on here.  What do morals have to do with celebrating a 300?  It's not like ANYTHING he did in the process of delivering the shot caused him to foul.  I think you're the one that needs to check your morals.
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J_w73

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2009, 02:22:36 PM »
quote:
quote:
Definition of a Foul
Rule 5a. A foul occurs when a part of the player’s body encroaches on or goes beyond the foul line
and touches any part of the lane, equipment or building during or after a delivery. A ball is in play after a
delivery until the same or another player is on the approach in position to make a succeeding delivery.

I would hate to call this in this situation... but the rule is clear. If the guy had morals he would call it on himself if it happened. This is a tough one for sure.


IF THE GUY HAD MORALS?  ARE YOU KIDDING ME?  

That might be the most ignorant thing I have ever heard on here.  What do morals have to do with celebrating a 300?  It's not like ANYTHING he did in the process of delivering the shot caused him to foul.  I think you're the one that needs to check your morals.


If I did what the guy did and then realized in my celebration that I did touch the lane... I would call the foul on myself.. and chalk it up to stupidity and a lesson learned.  If the rule says it is a foul then it is a foul..

We have a guy that has been called for a foul atleast 4 times for kicking and stepping on the endcap over the foul line. Everytime he is called on it he doesn't understand why it is a foul because he didn't step on the lane and he intentionally kicks(bad shot) or steps on it(on a good shot..like running it out..) either one is dumb..
Why don't people want to follow the rules. They are there for a reason.
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16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180



Edited on 3/4/2009 3:27 PM
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Spider Ball Bowler

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2009, 02:24:10 PM »
I did hear of a guy here in Michigan that shot 300, bent over and kissed the lane after and they called a foul on him.  From what I understand, the guy is a HUGE pr*ck, so that's why they called it.  Shady, oh yea.  Give him the 300 and make fun of him later for kissing the lane.
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livespive

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2009, 02:29:28 PM »
quote:
If his hands/arms were over the line but didn't touch the ground, it's not a foul. If that were a foul, you'd have to stop 5 feet in front of the foul line when you released the ball so that your hand didn't cross the line, vertically extended to the ceiling.


I stop 6' back (Stuck, and fell in the lane once, and said no more.)

But back on topic,

If he fell to his knees it might have been his first one, and been overcome with joy.  I don't think I would take that from him......

Maybe have the league put it to a vote.
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Kid Jete

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2009, 02:30:27 PM »
quote:
quote:
quote:
Definition of a Foul
Rule 5a. A foul occurs when a part of the player’s body encroaches on or goes beyond the foul line
and touches any part of the lane, equipment or building during or after a delivery. A ball is in play after a
delivery until the same or another player is on the approach in position to make a succeeding delivery.

I would hate to call this in this situation... but the rule is clear. If the guy had morals he would call it on himself if it happened. This is a tough one for sure.


IF THE GUY HAD MORALS?  ARE YOU KIDDING ME?  

That might be the most ignorant thing I have ever heard on here.  What do morals have to do with celebrating a 300?  It's not like ANYTHING he did in the process of delivering the shot caused him to foul.  I think you're the one that needs to check your morals.


If I did what the guy did and then realized in my celebration that I did touch the lane... I would call the foul on myself.. and chalk it up to stupidity and a lesson learned.  If the rule says it is a foul then it is a foul..

We have a guy that has been called for a foul atleast 4 times for kicking and stepping on the endcap over the foul line. Everytime he is called on it he doesn't understand why it is a foul because he didn't step on the lane and he intentionally kicks(bad shot) or steps on it(on a good shot..like running it out..) either one is dumb..
Why don't people want to follow the rules. They are there for a reason.
--------------------
16-17 mph,350 rpm,PAP 5 1/2 x 3/8up, HighGame 300 x 3, High Series 782
Book Average 215 / 205,PBA Xperience ave180



Edited on 3/4/2009 3:27 PM



You're probably the cop that gives out tickets for going a little over the speed limit to get a dying child to the hospital too.
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JessN16

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Re: what would you do 2..
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2009, 02:35:22 PM »
quote:
yeah.. you beat me to the rule..

says nothing about the end of the game, last bowler, ball going off the deck.



Edited on 3/4/2009 2:32 PM


Actually, it does say something about last bowler. It says "A ball is in play after a delivery until the same or another player is on the approach in position to make a succeeding delivery."

If he's throwing the last ball of the last frame of the last game, there is no other player on the approach to make a succeeding delivery -- because there is no succeeding delivery at all. Ergo, game over, no foul.

Jess
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